speeding> do you?

linecrew · Post by **linecrew** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:42 am

mighty mouse wrote:Second, Public roads have public rules. Bring back photo radar!

F@#K NO! Not the automated tax man!!

Buzz Lightyear · Post by **Buzz Lightyear** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:46 am

Got busted 2 days ago for the first time ever. I was on my way to the airport driving the girlfriend who was late for work...120 instead of 70!

Ouch! $335, 5 points, no discussion.

Was it dangerous? no, it's a highway (although apparently not considered as such) with barely any traffic. Driving at 70 would be dangerous when everyone is at a 100.

Speeding is all relative, doing 50 km/h in a narrow street is more dangerous than 30 or so over on a highway, in my opinion.

Anyway, I'll know better for next time.....I'll let the girlfriend take the bus!

Rockie · Post by **Rockie** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 1:37 pm

mighty mouse wrote:Second, Public roads have public rules. Bring back photo radar!

I'm all for that. It was a sad day when they put the kibosh on photo radar.

Liquid Charlie · Post by **Liquid Charlie** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 1:54 pm

Ontario and their wisdom -- I was going from Brockville to Toronto and encountered 3 grid locks with stop and go -- bumper to bumper -- screeching stops and all that messy stuff on the 401 -- the third time I figured out what it was -- OPP processing the road racers -- give me an F'n break -- how stupid to create the worst possible safety hazard on a high speed road -- well high speed for ontario -- haha -- they were seizing cars and with the tow trucks at work and all the flashing lights the traffic was coming to a dead stop -- some guy cruising at 150K + -- sure slap him with a ticket but the rest is over the top and dangerous -- use the law for what it was intended -- god give those guys a little more power and they start clicking their heals together -- and this is from a guy who usually is in LRC at about 110K

rsandor · Post by **rsandor** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 2:40 pm

I'm all for that. It was a sad day when they put the kibosh on photo radar.

There were 2 fatal flaws with photo radar.

1: An officer (who had to be paid) was required to man each operating photo radar van. This was a totally uneccesary waste of money.

2: Photo radar vans were NOT all placed in locations where exceeding the speedlimit would be dangerous. They were placed in wide open sections of highway, where the speed limit was unusualy LOW for the road conditions. It was an income generator in many more ways than a safety tool.

In europe, they have "traffic boxes" everywhere, which are far cheaper, far more efficient, and far better. Sure, they are stationary and once you know where they are, you know that you can't speed - BUT that is the whole point!!!! They work!!

I'd support traffic boxes placed in construction zones or areas where excessive speeding is a repetitve cause of accidents.

I would not support a ressurection of our old photo radar vans system.

rsandor · Post by **rsandor** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 2:44 pm

What we need in BC are Telematik signs. Signs that change the limits depending on conditions.

FL_CH · Post by **FL_CH** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 4:37 pm

You mean you want the gov't to invest money in eliminating their source of income? Dream on!

I gotta agree though that Germany must have the best highways, AND people follow rules and speed limit religiously. It might be a NO LIMIT zone on some parts of the autobahn, but if it says 120, everybody goes 120!

zforzulu · Post by **zforzulu** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 12:27 am

Once again I agree with "rsandor". Perfect explanation of photo radar in Canada and why it works in Europe but was just a fund-raiser here.

z.

... · Post by **...** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:47 am

Buzz Lightyear wrote:Got busted 2 days ago for the first time ever. I was on my way to the airport driving the girlfriend who was late for work...120 instead of 70!

Ouch! $335, 5 points, no discussion.

Was it dangerous? no, it's a highway (although apparently not considered as such) with barely any traffic. Driving at 70 would be dangerous when everyone is at a 100.

Speeding is all relative, doing 50 km/h in a narrow street is more dangerous than 30 or so over on a highway, in my opinion.

Anyway, I'll know better for next time.....I'll let the girlfriend take the bus!

I got pulled over doing 160 kph on the 403 this summer prior to the 50 over rule. Long story short...I used to date his sister 10 years ago. Lucky for me...I treated her like gold!

Anyway...he let me go because I was a good guy...AND I treated his sister well. Or I would have gotten a large biscuit like you did! 335$...ouch is right!

Why was I speeding? people sitting in the left lane doing a highway musical variation of corus/verse....in other words beteen 90/100 kph...for about 7 cars. The right lanes blocked doing the same speed. In front of them........WIDE OPEN SPACE! I decided to dump this herd of cars and bob and a weave after 10 minutes following this herd of cattle

I 'punch' it...and well wouldn't my buddy OPP guy sitting there @ the worst time of my acceleration passing all these mules!

115-120kph folks won't get you in trouble with the boiz in blue and neither will moving over to the right when you're done passing other cars.

Rockie · Post by **Rockie** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 6:41 am

I am Birddog wrote:
Buzz Lightyear wrote:Got busted 2 days ago for the first time ever. I was on my way to the airport driving the girlfriend who was late for work...120 instead of 70!

Ouch! $335, 5 points, no discussion.

Was it dangerous? no, it's a highway (although apparently not considered as such) with barely any traffic. Driving at 70 would be dangerous when everyone is at a 100.

Speeding is all relative, doing 50 km/h in a narrow street is more dangerous than 30 or so over on a highway, in my opinion.

Anyway, I'll know better for next time.....I'll let the girlfriend take the bus!
I got pulled over doing 160 kph on the 403 this summer prior to the 50 over rule. Long story short...I used to date his sister 10 years ago. Lucky for me...I treated her like gold!

Anyway...he let me go because I was a good guy...AND I treated his sister well. Or I would have gotten a large biscuit like you did! 335$...ouch is right!

Why was I speeding? people sitting in the left lane doing a highway musical variation of corus/verse....in other words beteen 90/100 kph...for about 7 cars. The right lanes blocked doing the same speed. In front of them........WIDE OPEN SPACE! I decided to dump this herd of cars and bob and a weave after 10 minutes following this herd of cattle

I 'punch' it...and well wouldn't my buddy OPP guy sitting there @ the worst time of my acceleration passing all these mules!

115-120kph folks won't get you in trouble with the boiz in blue and neither will moving over to the right when you're done passing other cars.

It's amazing how people can justify their behavior by blaming it on others. The guy doing 100 in the left lane is way safer, not to mention within his legal and reasonable rights, than the lunatic doing 160 in the right lane. You have no leg to stand on.

Hedley · Post by **Hedley** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 6:54 am

The guy doing 100 in the left lane is way safer, not to mention within his legal and reasonable rights

How short people's memories are ... is anyone here old enough to remember the two guys who drove side by side east on the 401 from Toronto at precisely the posted speed limit 100 kph? They had traffic backed up behind them for miles, and when the boys in blue finally got their hands on them, they were charged with obstructing a highway.

It would appear that the police and the traffic court judges do not think it is either safe or legal to drive the speed limit in the left lane.

... · Post by **...** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 7:03 am

Rockie wrote: It's amazing how people can justify their behavior by blaming it on others. The guy doing 100 in the left lane is way safer, not to mention within his legal and reasonable rights, than the lunatic doing 160 in the right lane. You have no leg to stand on.

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Hey Rockie read Hedley's post!

Hedley wrote:
The guy doing 100 in the left lane is way safer, not to mention within his legal and reasonable rights
How short people's memories are ... is anyone here old enough to remember the two guys who drove side by side east on the 401 from Toronto at precisely the posted speed limit 100 kph? They had traffic backed up behind them for miles, and when the boys in blue finally got their hands on them, they were charged with obstructing a highway.

It would appear that the police and the traffic court judges do not think it is either safe or legal to drive the speed limit in the left lane.

read it again!!!

Hedley wrote:
The guy doing 100 in the left lane is way safer, not to mention within his legal and reasonable rights
How short people's memories are ... is anyone here old enough to remember the two guys who drove side by side east on the 401 from Toronto at precisely the posted speed limit 100 kph? They had traffic backed up behind them for miles, and when the boys in blue finally got their hands on them, they were charged with obstructing a highway.

It would appear that the police and the traffic court judges do not think it is either safe or legal to drive the speed limit in the left lane.

and again

Hedley wrote:
The guy doing 100 in the left lane is way safer, not to mention within his legal and reasonable rights
How short people's memories are ... is anyone here old enough to remember the two guys who drove side by side east on the 401 from Toronto at precisely the posted speed limit 100 kph? They had traffic backed up behind them for miles, and when the boys in blue finally got their hands on them, they were charged with obstructing a highway.

It would appear that the police and the traffic court judges do not think it is either safe or legal to drive the speed limit in the left lane.

one more time

Hedley wrote:
The guy doing 100 in the left lane is way safer, not to mention within his legal and reasonable rights
How short people's memories are ... is anyone here old enough to remember the two guys who drove side by side east on the 401 from Toronto at precisely the posted speed limit 100 kph? They had traffic backed up behind them for miles, and when the boys in blue finally got their hands on them, they were charged with obstructing a highway.

It would appear that the police and the traffic court judges do not think it is either safe or legal to drive the speed limit in the left lane.

IT'S A SIMPLE CONCEPT.......MOVE OVER

linecrew · Post by **linecrew** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 7:10 am

Rockie wrote: The guy doing 100 in the left lane is way safer, not to mention within his legal and reasonable rights, than the lunatic doing 160 in the right lane. You have no leg to stand on.

Give your head a shake...and then please get out of the left lane beacuse you're not being courteous to the guy behind you doing 102 kmph.

... · Post by **...** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 7:29 am

Since we are on this topic...When I move over after passing a car because those that are coming up behind me seem to want to by-pass me. For some strange reason they don't pass me when I MOVE OVER....THEY JUST SIT THERE IN MY BLIND SPOT. This happens 9 out of 10 times!!!!!!!!!

Until I am coming up on traffic in the center lane and now buddy to my left is just sitting there not making any move and I know they see I am approaching the center lane car.

As I try to speed up to edge past the left lane car in order to pass the center lane guy....he now decides NOT to let me pass by blocking me by speeding up when I do thus making me put on my brakes because he has excersized poor roadmanship (Also known a being an asshole)

WHY DO PEOPLE BLOCK OTHERS FROM ADVANCING EVEN AFTER I HAVE MOVED OVER TO LET SOMEONE PAST ME!!!!!!!!!!!??????????

What's wrong with MOST of you people????

MOVE OVER....it's a simple concept...

MOVE OVER

rsandor · Post by **rsandor** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 8:44 am

The guy doing 100 in the left lane is way safer, not to mention within his legal and reasonable rights, than the lunatic doing 160 in the right lane. You have no leg to stand on.

Rockie, driving within the speed limit does not absolve you of being required to KEEP RIGHT.

The passing lane is for PASSING ONLY. You are NOT within your legal right to cruise at 100kph in the passing lane. You are SUPPOSED to drive in the RIGHT lane, until you come up on traffic, and then you check your rearview & blindspot, pass on the left, and return to the right lane when the pass is completed.

That is how you do it. Any other way is WRONG.

I do agree that 160kph when the speed limit is 100kph is excessive and I don't condone it either. That does not mean that holding up 110kph traffic at 100kph in the left lane is legal or socially acceptable.

Hedley · Post by **Hedley** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 10:26 am

2: Photo radar vans were NOT all placed in locations where exceeding the speedlimit would be dangerous. They were placed in wide open sections of highway, where the speed limit was unusualy LOW for the road conditions. It was an income generator in many more ways than a safety tool.

A friend of mine was pretty angry a while ago, when he got a photo radar ticket on the 401 - for doing 109 kph during the day, on dry pavement.

I guess Bob Rae thought he needed the money more than we did.

Rockie · Post by **Rockie** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 1:19 pm

It's you guys who need to read. I drive in the right lane at 100 because it's safer. And when I pass someone camped in the left lane doing 95 I think "there goes an inconsiderate driver with his head stuck up his ass" and carry on with my day. When I see some lunatic in the right lane doing 130 or 140 I think "that reckless asshole is going to kill someone someday and I sincerely hope it's only him".

Give me the slow guy in the left lane any day.

The case Hedley points out is an extreme, and real case of two guys obstructing traffic and they deserve the penalty the police gave them. But a single simpleton droning along in the left lane at 100 is (while not being very bright) also not being unsafe like the simpleton careening from one side of the highway to the other doing 140. You people don't seem to see the difference and only use the slow guy in the left lane to justify rocketing down the road in the right lane.

It is a fact that most people think they are better drivers than they actually are, and I'm pretty sure 100% of the fast drivers do. But if you want to drive with nothing but experts like yourselves who have the reflexes, training and the right stuff to drive fast then by all means go to a track. Unfortunately for you astronauts you share the road with people who lack the testosterone you do, but who have even more right to be there since they are obeying the traffic laws and you aren't. I suggest you sign petitions or something and present them to your legislative member and try and get society to see things your way, but in the meantime try leaving for where you're going on time and you stay out of my lane.

comanchepilot · Post by **comanchepilot** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:24 pm

I completely agree with rsandor... I have been to Europe and seen the signs alongside the road in The Netherlands, Belgium, Germany, etc, and think that they are one of the smartest things ever...

We already have people monitoring the condition of the roads anyway, so why not have something like this, where when conditions dictate, the limit is lowered, but 100% bare and dry, there is no reason to not allow 130-140 kph limits.

The state of Montana is a perfectly good example of the fact that it isn't speed that kills...

http://www.motorists.org/pressreleases/ ... y-paradox/

For a while in the 90's the speed limit on highways was "Reasonable and Prudent," and incidentally, at the height of this period, Montana recorded the lowest ever fatality/accident rate on its highways.

And another thing while I am at it, I think there should be a 4 lane (2 each way) express bypass on the 401 through Toronto that starts in the Brampton/Milton area and extends to Pickering on the other side, with access ramps only for emergency vehicles, etc. and having a speed limit of 130-140 kph. A lot of the traffic congesting the 401 is transient from one side to the other, removing them from the equation would certainly help the flow of traffic.

Thoughts?

Rockie · Post by **Rockie** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:41 pm

comanchepilot wrote:The state of Montana is a perfectly good example of the fact that it isn't speed that kills...

Of course not, and neither does falling from great heights. Everybody knows it's the sudden stop that kills you.

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:53 pm

I lived in the Netherlands for three summers and drove about 80 miles a day each way to the airport.

Most people drove around 130 KPH and the slower ones drove in the right lane.

The difference in Europe is if you want to change lanes other drivers give way and assist you in the lane change..in Canada other drivers are more likely to consider it a challenge to stop you from changing lanes.

... · Post by **...** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 3:43 pm

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rsandor · Post by **rsandor** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 4:20 pm

What is boils down to is being responsible.

You don't have to stay 100% legal to be 100% safe. How do you define safe vs unsafe?

If someone drives 150kph everyday for 50years in a 100kph zone, does that mean he's been "lucky" for 50 years, or does it mean that maybe 150kph is PERFECTLY SAFE on that stretch of highway? Is 150kph in a Porsche safer than 150kph in a Cavalier? (you bet your ass it is!)

However, I agree with Rockie that most people overestimate their car control skills, and because of the speed differential with slower traffic that does not expect it, excessive speeding on public roads is unsafe 99.99% of the time.

rsandor · Post by **rsandor** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 4:21 pm

I agree with Cat too. In europe, people move over for you. In Canada and many US states, there seems to be some sort of self righteous ego problem with slower drivers who refuse to let faster ones by.

Liquid Charlie · Post by **Liquid Charlie** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 2:50 am

I call it poaching lanes -- ever noticed that most people in canada want to drive in the centre lane -- to coin a phrase -- WTF -- just look in your mirror and you will usually see the centre lane is always the busiest -- just means you have cut off the other 2 lanes -- human nature is a funny thing and the "sheep" syndrome is so true -- just sit back and watch the passengers on your airplane next time you are at the gate -- why does everyone seem to want to follow a leader -- damn if one person looks like they are lining up there will be 100 people behind then in short order.

How to piss off a westjet agent -- don't line up --

flyinphil · Post by **flyinphil** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 4:52 am

While the posted maximum may be 100, the accepted maximum seems to me to be where points kick in(117). The discretionary zone is between those speeds where if you are just driving like an a**hole, the cop can fine you.

In my opinion, anything, even if you are IABD, over 130 in a 100 zone deserves a licence suspension and heavy fine. Over 130, a one year suspension and retraining just like the drunks that still insist on driving because at that speed, you are every bit as much a hazard.

You can blame the crappy drivers all you like but if they are driving the speed limit, they are driving within the laws of the land. That does not mean people should drive poorly. The ought to move to the slower lanes and let people pass.