Quiting after getting an endorsement.

[SeptRepair]

Ok kind of curious about peoples opinions when it comes to getting an endorsement. When a company forks out the course fee, pays for hotel and food and as well as full wages for a few weeks while on course, how long should you wait before you give your notice when you get back?

[brownbear]

I personally would not quit right away. It will tarnish your rep with that company.

If you have a good standing with the guy who sent you there, you might want to talk about it.

If I knew I wanted to quit a job I would not take a course.

I don't think there is a minimum time required or what is ethical. Some may say a year etc... but I guess it depends on how well you and your manager get along. If you quit right after is he going to give you a bad reference for your next job?

To me it's kinda like say f-you to them. It may burn bridges. I like having good references from past jobs.

[pilotdreams]

So, your the guy everyone talks about.

[If it's got wings]

So, the first question is did they have you sign a training bond or give a verbal agreement to stay for a certain period? Could you get a job else where with out the endorsment or is that your ticket to advancement? Is the company hiring you going to be willing to pay out your training bond?

I guess the bottom line is not to burn bridges you may have to walk back over. If the company is so awful to work for in terms of working conditions, safety, and finally pay that you never plan on ever work for them again even if they are the only paying job on earth, then no further thought is needed. You must realize by now though that the industry is very, very small and word travels fast, a good reputation will take you places, but a bad one will shut doors very quickly.

My experience is if the move to a new company is a forward career move talk it over with your boss and see what kind of agreement you can come to. I left a company 2/3 of the way through the year after I recieved an endorsment course and we worked out an agreement that I would contract to help cover the fleet and my new employer was cool with that cause they did have to pay out the rest of the training. This was all based on no written bond just an verbal agreement, I basically didn't want to burn that bridge, so tried very hard to find a solution. Hopefully that helps, sorry it is so long

[Jigger24]

So far we AME's are not painted with the same brush as pilots, but if too many guys do what you are thinking about it wont be long until we are...

So think about what you are going to do...

[SeptRepair]

Ok the responses so far are exactly what i expect/think. Trust me i am not one of these guys. I have no intention of ever doing such a thing. I worded the question poorly i guess in that it leads the reader to believe its me. The last 2 years a couple of the young engineers in our hangar have done just that. Pisses me off like you wouldn't believe. I sure the hell hope upper management remembers when they come crawling back after they realize the grass that was so much greener was in fact spray painted to look that way.

[ad81]

Talk with the company and see what they expect of you first.

[bombardierfixer]

Well I left on my "contract" with a little over a year left on it. But I told the guys it was so I could obtain a EASA license which was true. I offered to pay it back but I asked for a receipt and a adjustment to my taxes because my wage was calculated in there as well so it wasn't a benefit. Needless to say I havn't heard squat from them. I think its not right to get guys to sign for two year contracts, I think one year is fair enough. But in the end I left on good terms and they know I'll probably be back at some point. The thing is the whole "bridge burning thing" really goes both ways now, unless you live in Kewlona and refuse to leave! The management can talk tough but they need you now just as much as you need them. Face it guys the gene pool of quality AME's is really starting to dry up and the employers know it (the smart ones anyway). Don't screw people but don't let a missguided sense of loyalty let you get taken advantage of as well especially when they try to play the "well we can't pay you anymore" game...

[Bulawrench]

I think that is the frustrating part of getting good people is that they may leave if there is a better offer. I like the saying "the grass is always greener until you get there,then it turns brown." It is almost a gamble that employers make with training for AME's. In my opinion, treat people right,pay them as much as the boss will allow and they are less likely to leave. Just because there is a lack of good engineers doesn't mean we have to lower our standards of maintenance.

[bombardierfixer]

Oh, I never ment lower your standards! Never. I meant that the problem is that there is hardly anyone coming up to replace the experiance. The talent pool is just getting smaller. It makes it more challenging for employers to keep quality guys and basically you as a employer just don't have the flexibility that they used to if they want to stay competative.

[Bulawrench]

I agree the pool is getting smaller. That makes us mediocre engineers look like Top guns. ha ha
I think sometimes people just give up and say "it's good enough" when exceptional engineers will not stop until it is close to perfect.

[roncoldlake]

I have enjoyed the discussion on this. As for quality AME's. Its not just the Civilian side its also the Military. I live in Cold Lake and they have scaled back flying ops to train more techs. I was on the first wave of releases in 05 and guess what. The Baby boomers are starting to retire everywhere. That is why when most of the Tech in the air force got out they went to the oil patch because it was more readily accessable. As for endorsements and then leaving. As far as I know even if you sign a letter of agreement you are not bound by it because if you used that endorsement to release or work on aircraft or items relating to. Then it was something that was required for you job. I certainly agree if you are even thinking about leaving talk to you supervisor. This not only burns bridges but puts a bad taste in Managers mouths with regards to Engineers. Of course most have already made up their minds. But if we change a few then they will change a few and so on and so on. I am trying to get a course from them so far all I have heard is that it is my intention to look for a better job which is not the case. I will keep pressing on though.

[Troubleshot]

On this subject I am going to take the stance of "kill or be killed", by that I mean we are all an economic down-turn away from getting layed off...loyalty may get you a promotion to Crew Chief or QA inspector but it will not save your ass if there is not enough money to pay everyone and keep the books in the black. I personally do not care about anyones feelings in management, my obligation is to my family and quality of life. We all understand the industry is in a boom and not taking advantage of it is mistake and will stun your financial growth as an AME, die hard loyalty is a major part of why our wages lack luster. 4 year loyalty has only gotten me a lay-off, a .75cent raise/year, minimal training, and a fight for something as stupid a pair of snow pants for working on the ramp all night.

So all you guys turning away all the great wages and benefits...thanks!

[SeptRepair]

I tend to agree, it is a kill or be killed attitude that more and more people are taking in our industry. Hell im even guilty of it. If there is an extra buck/hr to be given ill be right there trying to get a piece of it. Even though im somewhat new to this forum i get a feel that we have alot of guys who have been around when 10/hr for a license engineer was good. That was the 80's. Retiring from a company after spending 30 years is a thing you will find on old TV reruns. It just doesn't happen much anymore. Personally i went the way of a contractor. I demand a little more than the average wage and if/when the work drys up im gone. No hard feelings. Thats just the way it is. Ill find another job and start the cycle all over again. Im riding this boom and making sure im sticking alot of money away for when that inevitable downturn in our industry comes.

[bombardierfixer]

Okay, how's about this...Whats your obligation to contract companies?????

[Troubleshot]

Okay, how's about this...Whats your obligation to contract companies?????

easy...what ever your contract says... and even then you don't owe them much dependant on the contract, don't worry I have gotten screwed by contract companies too (i.e. wage @#$!-overs, pre-diems, car rentals) all of which were strangely messed up when I got to the job site..(funny isn't it)

Fellas you need endorsements to release M2 aircraft so why do people look at them like some sorta gift from the company ?, if they don't want to train you move on! if they keep dangling that carrot in your face but never seem to come through...you my friend are a sucker. Now I know some situations are special but for the most part if you have been at a company for more than 2 years with no type training you are missing the boat (and cash).