ATPL Question

[Radiohead]

Hi,

I don't normally post, but I have this question that's been bugging me for a while, and a few people have asked me and I havn't known the answer, so here goes.

Does Dual count the same as Co-pilot time in regards to getting an ATPL issued (that is, Co-pilot time counts as half toward the ATPL requirements) or does Dual count 1:1 with PIC toward the total time/flight time requirements (night, hood etc.)

Thanks for reading.

[broompusher]

Dual counts 1:1 towards your ATPL

[Spokes]

Careful, not all dual counts this way. Some dual does not count at all.

[young grasshopper]

My understanding is that 100 hours dual could be used towards an ATPL (at least thats what I used). It basically allows for your entire commercial hours to be used 1:1 (ie - 100 hours PIC, and the balance dual). Correct me if I'm wrong (as its starting to bug me not knowing for sure!!!).

[Spokes]

From CARs

An applicant shall have met the training requirements for the issue of a Commercial Pilot Licence - Aeroplane that is not restricted to daylight flying and completed a minimum of 1500 hours total flight time of which a minimum of 900 hours shall have been completed in aeroplanes. The total flight time shall include a minimum of:
(amended 2000/09/01; previous version)

(a) 250 hours pilot-in-command flight time in aeroplanes which shall include where applicable, a maximum of 100 hours pilot-in-command under supervision flight time completed in accordance with Section 421.11. The pilot-in-command and/or pilot-in-command under supervision flight time shall include a minimum of 100 hours cross-country flight time of which a minimum of 25 hours shall have been by night;

(b) 100 hours night flight time as pilot-in-command or as co-pilot of which a minimum of 30 hours shall have been acquired in aeroplanes;

(c) 100 additional hours cross-country flight time as pilot-in-command or 200 hours as co-pilot or any combination thereof, with flight time calculated in accordance with section 421.10. Flight time as pilot-in-command may be part of the 250 hours pilot-in-command flight time specified in paragraph (a); and
(amended 2005/12/01; previous version)

(d) 75 hours instrument flight time of which a maximum of 25 hours may have been acquired in approved instrument ground trainers and a maximum of 35 hours may have been acquired in helicopters. Instrument ground time shall not be applied toward the total 1500 hour flight time requirement.

This was taken out of the ATPL experience requirements. I think the reference to Comercial Pilots Licence must be a miss-print.

Nothing here limiting what dual counts or doesn't

Also from 3.7 in the AIM

3.7.3 In-flight Instruction (Dual): Licensed Pilots

(a) The holder of a valid commercial or airline transport pilot licence may give in-flight instruction for familiarization, refresher and instrument flight training, provided the pilot receiving the instruction holds a valid pilot licence endorsed for the type or class of aircraft in the same category as the aircraft used, and the person providing the instrument flight training meets the requirements specified in CAR 425.21(7). This authority does not permit category conversion training, e.g. aeroplane to helicopter, gyroplane to aeroplane, etc.

(b) The flight time acquired under (a) may be credited to the pilot-in-command as pilot-in-command time, and as dual flight time to the pilot receiving the training.

(c) Not more than 3 hr of familiarization flight time acquired for any type or class of aircraft may be credited towards the flight time requirements for a higher type of licence.

And of course there is this from CARs:

421.10 Crediting of Flight Time Acquired by a Co-pilot

The holder of a pilot licence may be credited not more than 50% of co-pilot flight time towards the total flight time required for the issuance of a higher class of pilot licence.
(amended 1998/12/01; previous version)

So if you get some DUAL time under this AIM then you can only count 3 hours of it. There is no mention of a limit on DUAL if you do training under the hood, so I would count it.

Thats all I could find on the subject.

[Ralliart]

Any dual given by a certified flight instructor will count towards the total time requirement of the ATPL at 1:1 just like PIC time.

[Radiohead]

Thanks everyone for the replies, that helps a lot.

[ahramin]

Spokes. That is not a misprint. There are no training requirements specific to the ATPL. And while you do not need a commercial licence to get an ATPL, you still need to get all the training required for a commercial.

[Spokes]

Oh, I see. Thanks.