Where Should I Go?Confed. Or Sault?

[BTD]

BTD: It's too tough of a concept for some to understand i guess.

Normally I wouldn't keep beating the dead horse... but in this case it makes sense to call Confed an 18 month program. Summer breaks in normal programs like Sault or any other post secondary aren't long enough to get meaningful work and you have to leave your job to go back to school anyway in the fall. But since Confed is only 18 months straight, once you're done in April you can start working, you're not going back to school... seems obvious to me.

At least that was one of the specific reasons why I chose Confed. But if I had started straight out of high school, I might have considered Sault as I wouldn't have been in any rush to finish.

Even though it is still a matter of semantics, I'm pretty sure most colleges start at the beginning of Sept to the end of April. 1st year= Sept to Sept = 12 months
2nd year= Sept to end of April= 8 months.

Total = 20 months. But who cares anyway, that is not the point.

Sault you only take the 2nd summer off. You go through the first summer much like you do at Confed.

Regradless of all this BS. It doesn't matter. Compare apples to apples. If Sault is 3 yrs, and an Applied science degree is 4 years, then confed IS a 2 year program.

If confed is 20 months. Then an applied science degree is 44 months, and Sault is 32 months.

It is NOT a valid point to say that Sault is a 3 year program and Confed is a 1.5 year program.

Again, if you are successful at one college you will most likely be successful at the other. I thought Sault was great when I went there. I have flown with confed grads and they seem just as capable. It is about finding somewhere that will offer what they tell you they offer, you will feel comfortable, and you can thrive.

BTD

[flyordie17]

Even seneca is quite expensive isn't it? I live close enough that I wouldn't need residence, but your still paying for a degree and flight training aren't you?

[. .]

I believe that somehow in becoming an applied degree program, rather than an aviation technology diploma, Seneca lost most or all of their funding. It's my impression that you're now paying near university tuition rates, on top of the flying expenses at Seneca. At Western you pay full university tuition on top of flying expenses. In Ontario, Sault and Confed are the only two schools which offer fully subsidized flying. College tuition is also much less than what the universities are charging.

[sirtate]

where did you pull the 100k+ from?

http://www.registrar.uwo.ca/FinancialSe ... UGRDFT.pdf

ACS (Com Aviation Mgmt) Year 1 19,620.29
ACS (Com Aviation Mgmt) Year 2 18,068.59
ACS (Com Aviation Mgmt) Year 3 16,772.84
ACS (Com Aviation Mgmt) Year 4 15,498.09

I pulled it directly from Western's website. They charge their university tuition (all the regular fees for the BMOS program) and then they tack on an even $50,000 for the flight training. You're telling me it costs that much to go from 0 to commercial + Multi IFR? Theres no way.

What happens if the student doesn't cost maylan $50,000 after everything is complete? Does he/she receive the unspent money when they graduate? I highly doubt that.

you also have to realize that the rates for year 1 remain that way for the duration of your program, ie; $19.6k x 4...

so it's 4x$20k, plus your living expenses... easily $1k/mo... my math shows about $120k for the entire program...

even if you were charged the old rates at Maylan, you'd still be looking at $65k for the flight training alone...

if they lost $12k on one student, how much did they lose in total? what do you think the rates will do in the future?

if i was Mr.Maylan i'd be putting overages into my contract with Western...

[Zwartboy]

This is similar to the estimate I did for myself when I was looking into the UWO program a few years ago.
Year 1 19,620.29
Year 2 18,068.59
Year 3 16,772.84
Year 4 15,498.09
Total 69,959.81

Last time I checked, their Katana's rented at $120/hr [over a year ago, so it's most likely gone up]
I'm guessing at an instructor rate at 50/hr

airplane for 200hrs @ 120/hr = 24,000
instructor for 100hrs @50/hr = 5,000
Total 31,000

70,000 + 31,000 = 101,000. That's why the program is known for it's 100k price tag.

I lived in London at the time, so I wouldn't have needed to pay for living expenses. But that was still way too expensive for me. I also didn't see the point of the business side of the program. I want to fly the airplanes, not run the company. I can see why the military loves the program, but if your not going into the military, it's very very costly.

Now I'm up at Sault College and wishing I had chosen Confed. I find that Sault College is geared towards the airlines. I have no doubt that both schools produce good pilots, so it's just up to where you want your career to go. If you want to fly a King Air and work your way to Air Canada, then go to Soo college. If you want to fly the mighty Beaver, go to Confed. I know a grad from Soo College that is flying a Beaver, and I know a guy from Confed that's flying for Jazz, so in the long run I don't think it makes much difference.

[CYQT]

This is similar to the estimate I did for myself when I was looking into the UWO program a few years ago.
Year 1 19,620.29
Year 2 18,068.59
Year 3 16,772.84
Year 4 15,498.09
Total 69,959.81

Last time I checked, their Katana's rented at $120/hr [over a year ago, so it's most likely gone up]
I'm guessing at an instructor rate at 50/hr

airplane for 200hrs @ 120/hr = 24,000
instructor for 100hrs @50/hr = 5,000
Total 31,000

70,000 + 31,000 = 101,000. That's why the program is known for it's 100k price tag.

Just to clarify, the numbers at the top include tuition & flight training. Still very expensive, but not as much as you are saying. With 4 years of living expenses im sure the number would hit 6 figures.

[Zwartboy]

Just to clarify, the numbers at the top include tuition & flight training. Still very expensive, but not as much as you are saying. With 4 years of living expenses im sure the number would hit 6 figures.

Oh. I was under the impression that they were seperate. Sorry for any confusion. Whether it's 70k or 100k, it's still very expensive.

[CF188A]

Slightly late in responding to this thread, but I suppose many will read it in the months to come as they make their decisions for post-sec next year.

I have experienced both programs, so here is my two cents.

The profs at both colleges are 10/10 , and for the most part the students are dedicated within the programs. People choose these schools because they want to be pilots in w/e field of aviation. CONFED is not a “be all to end all or a FLOAT only operation”. It is the core of their program, but keep in mind they have graduated pilots to the Air Force, Emirates, Air Canada, Cathay, etc. and are not.... just a bunch of bushwhackers who fly floats around. The Sault has graduated people in the similar fields and many Sault grads have gotten jobs on floats... so what does that tell you?

The Sault seems to decrease their numbers in an inhumane fashion before graduation. This is not because they graduate "better" pilots, or have a "better" program, but mainly because calculus, mechanics, etc, is not everyone’s forte. Being successful in these courses does not make for a better pilot than any other flight program in this country. Some people, in responses above would have you believe they "could not make it", and therefore resort to those who did not complete the Sault program in a rude way. I suggest you make your own decisions by taking into account your own abilities.

If you want to challenge yourself and take an academically rigorous program, then stay on course with the Sault as you will have some of the best years of your life. Now you must keep in mind as well the airlines do not examine your full academic transcript to see each course you have taken, and give you a higher seed based on it. It comes down to your ratings, experience, and above all your character/ personality and attitude. So this is perhaps where the upside of the Sault program is. That being said, the Sault College program will graduate you into a successful career as a pilot. People SHOULD make their decision based on their own individual capabilities. Each program requires an extensive amount of effort and each will bring you to where you want to go.

Confederation's math and physics courses are of similar curriculum, but are split between the first and second semester. The numbers starting second semester each year are usually the same as the Sault. If your attitude is "I want to be a Pilot” then I would highly suggest you accept your offer to Confederation. Students apply what they learn in ground school instantly in the aircraft -and can actually see "how things work". You are solo within 10 weeks.


The Sault was my #1 choice a few years ago because of the ratings. I did not care about dress codes, or anything of the sort and I placed my bet in success solely on what sounded right at the time (Commercial License / Multi IFR Rating). I did not realize the float rating was viewed in such respects by major carriers due to the unparalleled decision making skills it brings with it. I dismissed Confed because of the negative talk about it, and I believed it would not get me to where I wanted to go. The Sault was the "Be all to end all" So after a few months in Sault Ste. Marie, I realized the program was not geared towards me along with many others who have not been successful there. However after withdrawing during second semester and being accepted to Confed, I wish I had chosen CC as my #1 choice regardless of ratings. I am sure many can say the same thing. I would not give up my seat in Confed given the experiences I have had so far, even if I was offered a free ride in Sault Ste. Marie. Seeing the Aviation Center of Excellence at CYQT, meeting the staff, etc. sold me in just a few hours.


All future applicants must keep in mind that many if not all are biased towards their attended college. I know many descent people in the Sault program, and they love it there just as much as the students who are successful at Confed. It all comes down to preference and your individual capabilities. So I would suggest to any future undecided applicants to take a trip and see firsthand the environment of the Sault College flight program, as well, the Confederation College flight program and decide which is better for you.

Safe and happy flying to all

[. .]

I've found a very common theme over the last few years and the "what college should I choose threads. Every year there's a new round of students who either fail out, or quit to save face. Every year these students come onto AvCanada and will attempt to discredit Sault and Seneca college in an attempt to justify their inability to succeed there. It's so painfully obvious that you'd rate something you succeeded at higher than something you failed to achieve, yet they do it anyway. Some try harder than others to disguise it as honest feed back, or as a warning between friends.

No one ever comes on and talks about how they were too immature at 18 or 19 to deal with living on their own and prioritizing their school and party mix. It's always the colleges fault for being sadistic, or inhumane. No one goes on to talk about all the free help and tutoring the schools offer, or how they went the extra mile to keep students in school that wanted to be there.

I also find it amusing how people will go to great lengths to justify their experience as being best. The last post talking about how major carriers love float time and it's "unparalleled decision making skills". I find it funny that if it's so sought after no major carriers have a section on their application for float time. They all wanna know if you've flown Large multi crew turbines or jets, they all wanna know if you've been in a full motion sim, they all wanna know if you've used solid SOP's and worked as part of a team. Why no cater your experience to what you're dream job wants?

[fly-drink-chicks-music]

Because he wants to get it done quicker and cheaper and not spend 100k+ at western for something that shouldn't cost nearly that much. I dont mean to offend you, but everyone is well aware of Western's 'amazing' program. There's no need to advertise it in every single thread.

Cheers to that!

[Zwartboy]

I'm at Sault College now, and doing pretty well. I wish I had chosen Confed, but that's my opinion.
I'm not going to say any college is better than another because it's really personal preference. I am going to recommend that anybody looking for an aviation college should go visit the colleges, talk to some instructors, get a good feel for the college and the program they offer. Make your decision off that. Also, don't forget that you can do your CPL, Float and M-IFR at a FTU as well. (not likely the same one for all three).

[Onthestep]

With those grades I'd be going into a far more lucrative and less stressful proffession then aviation. But to each their own. I went to the Sault, it was so so. The faculty are very nice people with good intentions but I feel that their curriculum is in serious need of a facelift. As someone else posted the program is very mathematics focused, now its been a few years but I seem to remember my first term including, Math, Statics, Dynamics, Hydraulics, Mechanics, Physics and a few others... And dont plan on getting near an airplane for quite some time (unless your drinking Tim Hortons at CYAM, daydreaming, and waiting for the Dash 8 to land). Once you get through the first year Gauntlet life gets better, equipment is well taken care of and student relationships make it a fun atmospher to fly in. Don't forget they take flying very seriously so you'd better too or you'll end up doing more then just your IFR at a private school. Good luck and safe flying !

[Embraer190]

Just make sure you really do your research and make sure you know what you're getting into first... I know a bunch of guys who start aviation, sink a fair amount of money into it, and never finish. It really doesn't matter where you go, just realize what you're getting into. Are you becoming a pilot because you have roots in aviation and sincerely want to fly airplanes or are you doing it for the image? Make sure you make an informed decision.

[just curious]

Just now, it's winter, and the economy in a downturn. So you have a bit more time, and reason to consider your options.

First is cost/benefit analysis. Your parents are paying. Going to Harvard and getting a commercial IFR is possible. But the financial hardship you impose on your parents is not worth the payout in terms of your employability and personal growth.

What is the outcome of going to any college aviation program? Essentially, it is the right to be considered for an entry level pilot position. Nothing more. Every graduate like to tout the virtues of their program. The reality is that graduates of every program end up in every facet of aviation. So the advantage initially of any program over another is moot. "Where did you do your licences?", is a question that is far down the conversational lines with any of my new co-pilots. Unless they do dumb things. Then I call the CP, and ask him not to hire graduates from that program for a while.

A Con grad will have a commercial floats. A Sault grad will have a commercial multi-IFR. IFR costs more than floats. In changing over from a technology diploma to a degree, the funding support for Seneca disappeared. A Seneca grad will have a degree, a commercial Multi-IFR, and a 100K debt load. A Western grad will have a degree, a commercial Multi-IFR, and a 100K debt load. None of the above can boast a significant advantage in the initial hiring race.

Later, a degree may be the deciding thing in applying to Air Canada. But for many airlines, a degree or diploma is always going to be far down the list of deciding factors, after flight time, IFR, turbine, jet, 705, languages or cultural fit

Cost may not be important to you, but it is to your parents. Ok, perhaps not cost, but value. IF you were my child, I would question the value of all aviation programs. However, if you were still insistent on a flying career, I would insist that you also get a degree, so that duing a downturn like this, you would have a fallback. I flew someone out the other day that was a ramp rat/swamper. Now they are laid off, and working as a book keeper.

In terms of cost, Sault would get you an entry level position, and with an extra year, a degree with some useful skills. It would do so for less money by a long shot versus Western or Seneca. If you were insistent on getting some of the premium training that theyh allegedly get, I as a parent could still send you to Cranfield University in england, or University of California, for aviation related training that is held in much higher regard.

I did a brief search of articulation agreements for Sault. You can do your own searching for Confederation.


Articulation Agreements

(3) Sault College Aviation Technology (Flight) Advanced Diploma & Algoma U's Bachelor of Business Administration degree program. This collaboration is specially designed so that Aviation student may complete the diploma and the degree in 4 year of full-time study (fall, winter & spring)--that's the completion of a 3-year diploma and a 4-year degree in just 4 years! For course and program details, visit: Aviation-BBA

Athabasca University/ Sault
BMgmt (PD) With Major, 4 yr Sault College Aviation Technology Diploma - Flight 200709 Approved 30 credits

They also have a tie-in with Embry Riddle.

Professional post-employment training

http://viterbi.usc.edu/aviation/

http://www.cranfield.ac.uk/soe/shortcou ... e10263.jsp

You will of course, do whatever you want, and that's fine. Just go into this understanding that it is uncertain, and expensive, and that college itself is only one line on a resume. As long as I see the minumum qualifications on a resume for a position, that candidate is in the running, whether thye went to Con, Seneca, Harvard, or Fred's school of aviation and veterinary medicine.

[CF188A]

I've found a very common theme over the last few years and the "what college should I choose threads. Every year there's a new round of students who either fail out, or quit to save face. Every year these students come onto AvCanada and will attempt to discredit Sault and Seneca college in an attempt to justify their inability to succeed there. It's so painfully obvious that you'd rate something you succeeded at higher than something you failed to achieve, yet they do it anyway. Some try harder than others to disguise it as honest feed back, or as a warning between friends.

No one ever comes on and talks about how they were too immature at 18 or 19 to deal with living on their own and prioritizing their school and party mix. It's always the colleges fault for being sadistic, or inhumane. No one goes on to talk about all the free help and tutoring the schools offer, or how they went the extra mile to keep students in school that wanted to be there.

I also find it amusing how people will go to great lengths to justify their experience as being best. The last post talking about how major carriers love float time and it's "unparalleled decision making skills". I find it funny that if it's so sought after no major carriers have a section on their application for float time. They all wanna know if you've flown Large multi crew turbines or jets, they all wanna know if you've been in a full motion sim, they all wanna know if you've used solid SOP's and worked as part of a team. Why no cater your experience to what you're dream job wants?

You are one of many posters on here which unfortunately have a bias ignorant outlook. I think I made it clear that my decision to attend Sault College was made strictly through immature decision making. I was fresh out of high school at the time. I learned from my mistake. The whole Multi IFR sounded great! I admitted the Sault program is not geared towards me. It is unfortunate I have to decipher my BEYOND legible and fair post which has pros and cons from each side of the fence. I followed your path at one point, and unfortunately I was not successful regardless of the extra opportunities I sought from college staff and services. I also find it humorous that you do not touch on present Sault College students (above) stating they would have preferred Confed. You will also find that some people just love the Sault, it is simply about preference. There is nothing wrong with this, nor is there anything wrong with having a "GREAT" time in one program and a "DREADFUL" time in the other.

You aimed at my post because I stated Confederation College has a benefit the other Colleges do NOT have. If my post was PRO Sault College I do not think there would have been a personal lodge. However dismissing the possible ...yes "UNPARALLEDED", skill of decision making, which comes with float training, it is a noted strength in the eyes of carriers. NOWHERE did I state a float rating will get you a job flying a 320 or a Metro. I said it grants successful students unparalleled decision making skills. And applicant can investigate this on their own accord. Make a phone call to Human Resources or take a visit to a local carrier.

I also stated many times above the positives about attending Sault College and the amount of successful pilots they have graduated is right up there. They have one of the best reputations in this country. So what was the problem above? Simple...a certain user believes some turbine hours, and flying a multi gets you your bars. Fortunately, present day carriers look beyond the resume. Ladies and Gentlemen, one must make their own decisions BASED on their own individual strengths. Not to mention at the end of your 250 hours being at Sault College or Confed, you still have some flying ahead to even be considered. They build a foundation. You do the rest within your carrer. Do not make your decision based on qualifications Confed or the Sault graduates you with, as one can achieve what the other has at day’s end in just a few weeks at a local flying club (Maybe not the same quality level training, but it is a rating and a start none the less)

My current success and seeding in a program better suited for me was viewed in a negative fashion by the user above. Regardless of typing good things about both programs, etc. it is evident people still have the motive and belief that the final rating you achieve is the be all to end all. They also are influenced that one is better than the other. This is not true.

I would once again suggest to all applicants, just to take a weekend trip to Sault Ste. Marie, and Thunder Bay. View both programs for yourself and make your own decision. There are success stories at both colleges. People are currently having a good and bad time in both as this message is written. See which is better for you.

[. .]

CF188A:

I'm going to try and be crystal clear for you here. You're total and absolute naivety is overwhelming. You've clearly never worked for an airline, let alone a 703 operation, yet you're an expert on what they're looking for. You then go on to state that you can just do an IFR rating at the local flying school, but don't worry if it's not as thorough, or as good a quality. Why on earth would you want the best IFR training available anyway, it's not like your career is going to be spent in the clouds or anything like that. It certainly would do you no good to lay down the most solid foundation possible. Lastly, If airlines thought that float time helped make better pilots they would look for that. It would become a requirement, or a section to get bonus points on. When I helped with hiring at my last airline we actually looked down on float time. It's almost all single pilot vfr work. It has very few parallels to two crew, sop oriented, pavement to pavement, ils to ils operations. The last thing we needed was to spend extra sessions in the sim trying to teach someone how to work within at team, and how to communicate to all the different members.

Anyway, good luck at making it through confed. I'd hate to see you on here next year talking sour grapes about how confed sucks now too, and that you should check out _______ flying school, because you might just like it better.

[CF188A]

I read your post partially. It is quite sad when a moderator hijacks threads. Maybe you should attack students above who just support their college because they went there? Or maybe because they have to many letters in their Tag? But I suppose that is traditional AVCANADA for you.

My original post, had the intent of telling future applicants to go and make your own decision based on their own individual capabilities. I, like MANY others have had better experiences at one college over the other. Nowhere did i demote Sault College or its ratings. I simply stated Confederation does have a core strength with their float flying. You make it sound as though I said word for word" Attending Confederation College will make you a 777 FO in no time...yup go to Confed because the general word is better).

From there you decided to pull a George Bush with your assumptions and ignorance. Regardless of your "infinite" years of experience, I am going from my limited knowledge in the industry and talking with the smaller carriers. My post was not bias and I explained from my understanding of being a student , the strengths and weaknesses of both programs. Most readers can clearly see your rampage is motivated by your bias views. As for your final comment. Talking about rhetorical failure with a student in as they succeed in their program ...... how low can you go? Talk about maturity. I think someone is sensitive to their Sault Education.

So once again, future students and applicants go and see each college for yourself and make your own decision. Do not listen to Captain Experience above, or my word for that matter. Most will agree graduating from either or is not a be all to end all (like i said above) . Regardless either or will graduate you into a successful career.

[. .]

I read your post partially

Okay, you go back and read the rest of it then. Feel free to take notes.

On a more serious note. I seriously encourage you to come back to this post in 10 years and we'll see if you're still singing the same tune.

[CF188A]

I read your post partially

Okay, you go back and read the rest of it then. Feel free to take notes.

On a more serious note. I seriously encourage you to come back to this post in 10 years and we'll see if you're still singing the same tune.

Likewise Captain Experience

For the third or fourth time... drop your ego and revert to my original post which talks about one tiny experience, along with countless others who have written in this thread. So why did you act like a child again? Oh right, because I stated Confederation College has strength. This is the political and egotistical garbage people talk about when it comes to the colleges. Even though I stated Sault College has a great program and will graduate into a career as a pilot etc. etc. etc. etc. That is not enough. People need to feel superior at all times.

I think everybody can agree both are great programs and one must choose which is right for them. Once again, the colleges build a foundation for each student. You can get what the other college offers upon graduation in a matter of weeks. It is still a very long journey after graduation. So I suppose that makes each program reputable, and worth taking.

You just needed a weekly ego boost . Very well understood. Captain Experience would rather you only graduate from the college which he has attended.

Make your decision based on your own individual capabilities. It has been proven time and time again, that each will graduate you to where you want to go.

I also appologize to all those who are reading these forums , especially future applicants. Go and view each environment for yourself, and see which is best for you. Listening to a bunch of "bias experts" will not allow for accurate information.

[Zwartboy]

I'm starting to regret having an opinion. After all, I only attend the school.
How about everybody stops bickering like children and offer their opinions based on their experience. That is what this forum is about.

[. .]

I have never said that confed wasn't a good school, or that it's students were anything but top notch. What I do take offense to, is someone with less than Zero experience coming on and preaching about why something is great, or why something isn't. Even more so when this person has massive sour grapes issues. Further, your inability to grasp that a 2 week IFR course from Perimeter or even better, Cornwall is the same as 8 months of study blows my mind.

[AUGER9]

Guys, just give it up. You've both successfully made yourselves look like idiots.

[CF188A]

I have never said that confed wasn't a good school, or that it's students were anything but top notch. What I do take offense to, is someone with less than Zero experience coming on and preaching about why something is great, or why something isn't. Even more so when this person has massive sour grapes issues. Further, your inability to grasp that a 2 week IFR course from Perimeter or even better, Cornwall is the same as 8 months of study blows my mind.

This is simply just humorous now. Especially when people start saying they wish they did not have an opinion because Captain know-everything shoots them down. God forbid people get to choose how they think. So let’s say I am the immature child. That would make the , unknown , Captain Experience, (probably a current student or recent grad) that much more mature ... as he starts fights within internet forums with kids because other people have a preference based on their first hand experiences within the programs. You are telling me that is not legible? Experience and success within both first semesters? Right, my most sincere apologies.

Someone less than zero experience (You must know me very well, after exchanging messages in a forum) .

You take offence to someone stating they have experienced both programs, and they personally prefer one over the other because it is better suited for them ? Regardless once again of promoting the quality of the Sault program, you just have to tell people their thought process is wrong, rather view their positive experiences in a negative way. You take offense to someone having a far better time at one over the other. That is absolutely pathetic and I find it hard to believe you even have a place in the aviation industry. I would hate to know your views on someone who prefers Westjet over Air Canada .

Massive sour grape issues? Lets keep in mind my original post ... which you will not answer to because it makes more than enough sense. I described my brief experience in a fair manner and advised people to make up their own minds based on their own capabilities. Sorry if you do not agree with me , that is your opinion. I would love to actually know who the hell you think you are attacking people in a public forum for giving an open, liberal view when it comes down to making a college decision.

Go back into your flight simulator.

[CF188A]

All future applicants must keep in mind that many if not all are biased towards their attended college. I know many descent people in the Sault program, and they love it there just as much as the students who are successful at Confed. It all comes down to preference and your individual capabilities. So I would suggest to any future undecided applicants to take a trip and see firsthand the environment of the Sault College flight program, as well, the Confederation College flight program and decide which is better for you.

Safe and happy flying to all

[CLguy]

Endless wrote:

When I helped with hiring at my last airline we actually looked down on float time. It's almost all single pilot vfr work. It has very few parallels to two crew, sop oriented, pavement to pavement, ils to ils operations. The last thing we needed was to spend extra sessions in the sim trying to teach someone how to work within at team, and how to communicate to all the different members.

I think you need to go back and rethink your opinion of float pilots. I have been flying off the water for 25 years in a 2 crew, sop orientated environment in multi turbine transport category aircraft. In fact my winter work is all the above as well, except it is a 3 person sop orientated environment.

Also as a little side note, Confed has been looking at making some changes to their program and one suggestion was take the float training part out for students who don't want to pursue float flying and the Chief Pilot of Westjet and Director of Flight Ops at Jazz, both of whom sit on the programs Advisory Board were adamant that the float flying remain because they both feel it makes you a better pilot. Of course what would they know!!