System after system after system...

[...]

This post of mine is really not aviation related. However, it's an important topic that in an indirect way does affect us all in aviation, so it does qualify for the forum. The ever growing aggressiveness of weather.

People chose not to hear me rant on about climate changes, however, I don't blame them because I carry no credentials about environment and the weather.

However the science is in, human beings have become unprecedented force in nature. For the 1st time in 4 billion years that life has existed on this planet...one species "us" is capable of ultering the physical and chemical and biological features of this planet on a geological scale. We today are the most numerous mammals on the planet. There are more of us than there are rabbits in the world. That's a lot. The rules are squewd, the tables have been tilted, and soon all there will be left at the poker table is us, and Mother Nature...and the House HATES losing.

In David Suzuki's words..."game over."

Dr. Suzuki was up in Ottawa and this aired for public display in which I managed to catch it on live TV on CPAC On October 30th, 2008, in Ottawa, the National Round Table on the Environment and the Economy (NRTEE) hosted a unique round table forum entitled "Securing Canada’s Future in a Climate Changing World", which marks the organizations 20th anniversary. Key w0rds: David Suzuki, Canada, Environment, Sustainability, Survival, Peak Oil, Over Population, Permaculture, Extinction, Evolution, Birds, Fish, Animals, Life, Alternative energy.

It's 43 minute speech...I know, a bit to long for some attention spans people on here have, however I HIGHLY recommend you view it. I HIGHLY RECOMMEND YOU VIEW IT IN IT'S ENTIRETY.

Towards the end (@ 32 minutes in his speech and again @ 38 minutes) he links economy with environment, politics, the population problem and science.. It's a brilliant fuse of thought and intellect this man delivers. In fact it's the best piece of video of its kind I have ever seen.Carlos Mencia

Thanks for reading and hopefully viewing the video link.

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid= ... zuki&hl=en

[Embraer190]

Excellent post. This is probably the single most important issue/challenge facing humankind. I hate when people point fingers towards aviation as being a major problem. The global aviation sector only makes up about 3% of total CO2 emissions - the majority is from road transportation. I don't know about you folks, but I think it is much easier to make a car electric than it is to make a 747 electric. We need the brightest minds of the world to collaborate to find viable solutions. Not to mention we also need some good political leadership. I am confident in Obama's "Green Economy" strategy of alternative power generation and getting a million electric cars on the road by 2015. The time to act was a decade ago, we have to do some catching up and we have to do it fast.

[Flying Nutcracker]

Every 10 or 12 years, my friends, every 10 or 12 years! I saw it in the 70's, the 80's, 90's and now at the end of the zero's... Holy sh*t I am getting old!

[Cat Driver]

Where do we get the electricity to run all those cars?

[ski_bum]

Just Dam a few more rivers in MB...

[Driving Rain]

Where do we get the electricity to run all those cars?

Thats too easy Cat

[jetmech]

I've lost all respect for David Suzuki. His fear mongering along with that other idiot Al Gore are not helping this economy nor is the media for it's share in spreading fear to the masses. Theres no doubt that we must change our habits......and we have. This green shift is a total farce that the Government has jumped all over in the name of raping us of our hard earned dollars. "Change Today" is not possible. This is something that needs to occur over time. Why do I or you need to suffer a hard life of economic turmoil so we can shut down our coal fired plants with no alternatives? Yes we should hand the next generation a clean planet but come on. We don't live to the age of 500, and to ask us to suck it up for the next 50 years is just not practical. I think we've made some serious strides. 25 years ago a 737 could barely make Florida from Toronto, now they make Hawaii from Vancouver. I'd say thats a big stride in fuel economy. Our cars our cleaner than ever before and our environmental policies regarding factorys and the like are a lot tougher now then they were 20 years ago. How do you buy into what these enviro morons in the Government preach, when they allow billions of dollars worth of trade with countries like China and Mexico? How are they building for so cheap? Do you think they care where they dump factory waste and everything else? All we ever here about are brown outs and black outs because theres an energy crisis, yet where ever you look theres a new subdivision going in and a wall of Condos.....where is this power coming from if theres not enough for whats allready there? This environmental movement is the biggest pile of bullshit I've ever seen and the amount of people buying into it is scary. How does a country of only 33 million people living in one of, if not the richest Country in the world when it comes to natural resources not have enough energy to power itself? Please be carefull what you read...we need to make changes, but change has to come with moderation.


http://www.nrsp.com/articles/07.12.13-o ... neral.html

[...]

I've lost all respect for David Suzuki. His fear mongering along with that other idiot Al Gore are not helping this economy nor is the media for it's share in spreading fear to the masses.....etc etc...

...
...
...
...

...
...
..............wow.

...wow...it's over folks. With similar opinions like the one above that are running our country...wow...yeah, I'll be in deepest South America should anyone need to find me. Ask for,

"Yo soy de Aves de Perro" which is loose Spanish for I am Birddog.

Hopefully they will point to a statue in the National City Park like this;


I fully intend to die for some just cause that requires the skills of a poet writer to make me a folklore legend in every tiny Peruvian mudhut.

[Tim]

I've lost all respect for David Suzuki. His fear mongering along with that other idiot Al Gore are not helping this economy nor is the media for it's share in spreading fear to the masses. Theres no doubt that we must change our habits......and we have. This green shift is a total farce that the Government has jumped all over in the name of raping us of our hard earned dollars. "Change Today" is not possible. This is something that needs to occur over time. Why do I or you need to suffer a hard life of economic turmoil so we can shut down our coal fired plants with no alternatives? Yes we should hand the next generation a clean planet but come on. We don't live to the age of 500, and to ask us to suck it up for the next 50 years is just not practical. I think we've made some serious strides. 25 years ago a 737 could barely make Florida from Toronto, now they make Hawaii from Vancouver. I'd say thats a big stride in fuel economy. Our cars our cleaner than ever before and our environmental policies regarding factorys and the like are a lot tougher now then they were 20 years ago. How do you buy into what these enviro morons in the Government preach, when they allow billions of dollars worth of trade with countries like China and Mexico? How are they building for so cheap? Do you think they care where they dump factory waste and everything else? All we ever here about are brown outs and black outs because theres an energy crisis, yet where ever you look theres a new subdivision going in and a wall of Condos.....where is this power coming from if theres not enough for whats allready there? This environmental movement is the biggest pile of bullshit I've ever seen and the amount of people buying into it is scary. How does a country of only 33 million people living in one of, if not the richest Country in the world when it comes to natural resources not have enough energy to power itself? Please be carefull what you read...we need to make changes, but change has to come with moderation.

have you ever heard of science? it's what these 'enviro morons' use to back up their preachings. people with 'why should it be my problem' attitudes like your's are the problem. you know why the government wants to take some money to make it work? BECAUSE IT COSTS MONEY. of course i would like to have my money in my pocket. but i'd also rather not have emphysema when im 60 and have to pay $13 for a litre of gas. for the same reason it cost a lot of money to build the original infrastructure of our country (roads/railways/hospitals/schools) it has to cost money to build the infrastructure of the 'green world'. just because the 737 can make it farther doens't mean we aren't still doing harm. if you went from a pack of smokes a day down to a 1/2 pack you're still a smoker. well the world is still smoking and we are all suffering the effects. the reason it should be our problem is because we are all contributing to it. natural resources are only an endless supply if they are managed. if the rate of use exceedes the rate of replenishment then we run the hell out of them.

fear mongering is exactly what people should be doing because we nead to be worried about what we're doing. not that i would call the information from one of canada's (in fact the whole world's) foremost scientists on the topic fear mongering so much as 'facts'

[jetmech]

I've lost all respect for David Suzuki. His fear mongering along with that other idiot Al Gore are not helping this economy nor is the media for it's share in spreading fear to the masses. Theres no doubt that we must change our habits......and we have. This green shift is a total farce that the Government has jumped all over in the name of raping us of our hard earned dollars. "Change Today" is not possible. This is something that needs to occur over time. Why do I or you need to suffer a hard life of economic turmoil so we can shut down our coal fired plants with no alternatives? Yes we should hand the next generation a clean planet but come on. We don't live to the age of 500, and to ask us to suck it up for the next 50 years is just not practical. I think we've made some serious strides. 25 years ago a 737 could barely make Florida from Toronto, now they make Hawaii from Vancouver. I'd say thats a big stride in fuel economy. Our cars our cleaner than ever before and our environmental policies regarding factorys and the like are a lot tougher now then they were 20 years ago. How do you buy into what these enviro morons in the Government preach, when they allow billions of dollars worth of trade with countries like China and Mexico? How are they building for so cheap? Do you think they care where they dump factory waste and everything else? All we ever here about are brown outs and black outs because theres an energy crisis, yet where ever you look theres a new subdivision going in and a wall of Condos.....where is this power coming from if theres not enough for whats allready there? This environmental movement is the biggest pile of bullshit I've ever seen and the amount of people buying into it is scary. How does a country of only 33 million people living in one of, if not the richest Country in the world when it comes to natural resources not have enough energy to power itself? Please be carefull what you read...we need to make changes, but change has to come with moderation.

have you ever heard of science? it's what these 'enviro morons' use to back up their preachings. people with 'why should it be my problem' attitudes like your's are the problem. you know why the government wants to take some money to make it work? BECAUSE IT COSTS MONEY. of course i would like to have my money in my pocket. but i'd also rather not have emphysema when im 60 and have to pay $13 for a litre of gas. for the same reason it cost a lot of money to build the original infrastructure of our country (roads/railways/hospitals/schools) it has to cost money to build the infrastructure of the 'green world'. just because the 737 can make it farther doens't mean we aren't still doing harm. if you went from a pack of smokes a day down to a 1/2 pack you're still a smoker. well the world is still smoking and we are all suffering the effects. the reason it should be our problem is because we are all contributing to it. natural resources are only an endless supply if they are managed. if the rate of use exceedes the rate of replenishment then we run the hell out of them.

fear mongering is exactly what people should be doing because we nead to be worried about what we're doing. not that i would call the facts from one of canada foremost scientists on the topic fear mongering so much as 'facts'

Yes I have heard of Science: http://www.climatescienceinternational.org/

http://www.nrsp.com/articles/07.12.13-o ... neral.html

I thnk your missing my point

[Doc]

Where do we get the electricity to run all those cars?

Extension cords. I'll admit though, we'll need longer extension cords to power 747s.

On a more serious note, I was talking to someone who told me he didn't really care about climate change, as he'd be extinct long before the polar bears.

This is an opinion shared by too many people on a global scale. Same for whaling, and the barbaric practice of removing fins from living sharks so some self righteous bastard in Japan can get a hard on!

Most don't seem to grasp the simple fact, that we are just visitors on this planet. We are simply renting space from future generations. And globally, at least, we're piss poor tenants!

Politicians don't care, because they're only going to be there for four years. CEOs don't care because they're only interested in the bottom line on annual reports. And, I'm afraid the rest of the global population doesn't care, because we won't be around to reap what we have sewn.

[jetmech]

http://scienceandpublicpolicy.org/image ... ration.pdf

I really don't want to be taken as someone who does not care, that's not my intent. I don't dump oil down the sewer and I don't burn tires for warmth. I'm simply asking for people to relax with the green wagon a little. Should we go and cork all the Volcanoes and dig them up, there pretty good at belching CO2 as well. I'm just not going to by into the pay, pay, pay attirude of these left wing Governments. I'll use solar energy, make it affordable then. To here Jack Layton say he spent $20'000 on solar panels that give hime barely enough power to run his air conditioner is ridiculous. Pay me a few hundred thousand dollars a year and I'll by windmills and solar panels to.

http://sinkinglifeboat.blogspot.com/200 ... truth.html

[Rockie]

The earth will undoubtably survive the worst humanity can throw at it, and it will be here long after we're gone. It's humans that won't survive because we have a very narrow environmental window that we can live in, and we are doing our best to destroy it. But for people who can't see the obvious there is also the very real economic justification for cleaning up our act. The last few months should have convinced you of that.

The auto companies are a prime example of stagnant, unimaginative thinking and its inevitable result. Instead of begging for bailout money that shouldn't be needed they should be on the forefront of building automobiles that run on clean, sustainable energy. The company with the foresight to do that will be rich beyond their wildest imagination. Instead, with lower oil prices they are once again flaunting their gas guzzling trucks. They are flat out brain dead stupid, and so are we for buying them.

[Tim]

http://aqua.nasa.gov/doc/highlight/lrg/AMSRE_SeaIce.jpg

here's nasa doing a little 'fear mongering' with this picture. damn hippies with their pictures of the world.

i certainly did not miss your point, you made it quite clear you care more about yourself than the impact of what you do haves on others:

"Why do I...need to suffer a hard life of economic turmoil so we can shut down our coal fired plants with no alternatives?"

answer: because you are contributing to it, probably more so than the average canadian judging by your attitude. and there are alternatives. they just cost money. to which of course you would say:

" "Change Today" is not possible."

no it is not, i requires a lot of time and effort. that's why we have to do as much as possible now, because if we don't it will just take longer and more damage will be done.

we cannot harm the planet, there's nothing we can do that it can't fix in a few million years. as you so aptly point out jet, all us people "don't live to the age of 500".

"Should we go and cork all the Volcanoes and dig them up, there pretty good at belching CO2"

so because volcanoes make CO2, we have carte blanche? well earthquakes kill people, so mudering really shouldn't be a big deal either right?

[jetmech]

http://aqua.nasa.gov/doc/highlight/lrg/AMSRE_SeaIce.jpg

here's nasa doing a little 'fear mongering' with this picture. damn hippies with their pictures of the world.

i certainly did not miss your point, you made it quite clear you care more about yourself than the impact of what you do haves on others:

"Why do I...need to suffer a hard life of economic turmoil so we can shut down our coal fired plants with no alternatives?"

answer: because you are contributing to it, probably more so than the average canadian judging by your attitude. and there are alternatives. they just cost money. to which of course you would say:

" "Change Today" is not possible."

no it is not, i requires a lot of time and effort. that's why we have to do as much as possible now, because if we don't it will just take longer and more damage will be done.

we cannot harm the planet, there's nothing we can do that it can't fix in a few million years. as you so aptly point out jet, all us people "don't live to the age of 500".

"Should we go and cork all the Volcanoes and dig them up, there pretty good at belching CO2"

so because volcanoes make CO2, we have carte blanche? well earthquakes kill people, so mudering really shouldn't be a big deal either right?

" "Change Today" is not possible."

no it is not, i requires a lot of time and effort. that's why we have to do as much as possible now, because if we don't it will just take longer and more damage will be done.

See there you go, it' takes time thats what I'm getting at. Of course I care, but why are you buying into the fact that it needs to cost us all so much? This world operates on Money, I did not make it that way. If this Government gave a shit, we would be building our product here....where it can be regulated...not China! Yes the Big 3 are there own Disaster but thats a different thing all together. A lot of you on here are Pilots, it cost you thousands to get where you are. Are you going to stop flying your big 747 that burns 130'000 pounds of fossil fuel? Probably not, you need to make a living.....what you propose along with people like Al Gore is to stop living. Go ahead park that plane and go fishing for you livelyhood.. We can't just stop life for this, it has to be done at a rate we can all live with. I agree with what your saying for the most part, but at what cost? Don't tell me it doesin't matter, and call me selfish. I've posted a few links of the other side of the story, don't just deny what these people who are Scientists, are saying. Read through some of it. There are some valid points there. This is destryoing our economy, our economy is how we live wheather you like it or not.


"Should we go and cork all the Volcanoes and dig them up, there pretty good at belching CO2"

so because volcanoes make CO2, we have carte blanche? well earthquakes kill people, so mudering really shouldn't be a big deal either right?

No we can't go Murder people, what I'm getting at is that a lot of Global warming is also normal....and we have been cooling off since 1998 and are forcasted to do so for the next 50 years. Please don't take me out of context or put words in my mouth.

[Embraer190]

Where do we get the electricity to run all those cars?

Are you serious?

Solar, Wind, Geothermal, Nuclear, Wave, Hydro... should I go on?

Better question is where do get all the friggin oil to run those cars?

[Tim]

our economy has largely been based on things which directly contribute to global warming.

and if we make a switch in our lifestyles it isn't as if everyone will lose their jobs. somebody has to design solar panels and wind turbines. then someone else has to dig the hole to put them in and someone else has to install it. then someone else needs to maintain it. and someone needs to put in the wires that bring the power to the homes and maintain that.

the economy changes to suit the world me make.

the industrial and technological revolutions all cost jobs at the start. more automation, less people. but people have to create the programming and machines that do all this so jobs are created else where.

unfortunatly it takes fuel to get people from point a to point b. but what about turning the a/c way up in the summer and the heat way up in the winter? or spending a little extra for those eco-friendly products. and if we buy more eco-friendly products we creat more jobs for that sector, which in turn promotes that sector and inspires more to get into it. how about buying local produce that hasn't been shipped from south america and wrapped in plastic inside a box, inside another box that's also wrapped in plastic. how about going INTO tim's instead of idling in the drive though (it's quicker anyways).

it's supply and demand. if we demand things that are better for the world instead of worse, it's what we will get. and the more people start to buy into it the cheaper it will be.


i took nothing out of context and quoted you directly. you made a comparison of CO2 from volcanoes and CO2 from people. one goes in cycles and occurs naturaly which is PART of the eco-system. one is continuous and worsening and is un-natural. my analgy with earthquakes and murder is your logic not mine, and i was made as a point to illustrate the crap you're spewing.

[Doc]

Where do we get the electricity to run all those cars?

Are you serious?

Solar, Wind, Geothermal, Nuclear, Wave, Hydro... should I go on?

You thought he might be serious?? Are YOU serious?

[Embraer190]

You thought he might be serious?? Are YOU serious?

Yes?

[Nark]

I think I can understand when Cat is asking a rhetorical question.

Solar-good. Have a look down in death valley. You'll go blind by the reflection of all the solar panels. They don't output enough power to sustain the population.

Wave - dependant on lunar activity near coastal sections. Not efficient power.

Wind - debatable. Not enough power output, plus the public outcry of noise pollution.

Hydro - excellent source, that require environmentalist to concede land to be flooded.

Geothermal - requires drilling. Refer to "oil."

Nuclear - Best source for energy. Again environmentalist's a la "Nancy Pelosi" who have no idea how it works. The public thinks of Hiroshima and Chernobyl every time nuclear energy is mentioned. Nevermind the many war ships and power plants being run without incident, save for Three Mile Island, which should really prove how effective the US safety standards are.

[Tim]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geothermal ... in_Iceland

it doesn't specifically say in this particular article but it is extremly clean as well. clearly this isn't a viable option for everywhere due to the unique geological construction and location of iceland, however it is an excellent example of the kind of thinking we need.

[Embraer190]

I think I can understand when Cat is asking a rhetorical question.

Solar-good. Have a look down in death valley. You'll go blind by the reflection of all the solar panels. They don't output enough power to sustain the population.

Wave - dependant on lunar activity near coastal sections. Not efficient power.

Wind - debatable. Not enough power output, plus the public outcry of noise pollution.

Hydro - excellent source, that require environmentalist to concede land to be flooded.

Geothermal - requires drilling. Refer to "oil."

Nuclear - Best source for energy. Again environmentalist's a la "Nancy Pelosi" who have no idea how it works. The public thinks of Hiroshima and Chernobyl every time nuclear energy is mentioned. Nevermind the many war ships and power plants being run without incident, save for Three Mile Island, which should really prove how effective the US safety standards are.

And yet by drilling in the ground for oil and altering the biosphere by spewing CO2 into the atmosphere, we're doing the right thing?

No one said it would be easy to change.

Technology is advancing and these alternative sources of energy are becoming more viable as we type.

We have two choices:

1) Move to alternative energy production and enjoy the benefits of sustainable, planet-friendly energy

2) Keep drilling for oil, hurt the planet even more, run out, and THEN move to alternative energy... if life can still be sustained.

[Carrier]

There are lots of suggestions from the Greens on how to address various symptoms of the problem but none on how to fix the basic problem.

Anyone who has had any training or considerable successful experience in problem solving will know that the first action is to identify the problem as against the symptoms. Then come up with solutions for the problem. So many of the Greens ignore the problem and address the symptoms, usually in a biased manner. Media interviewers fail to press them on the real problem and solutions for it.

The problem is that the human population has risen above the long term environmentally sustainable level, particularly regarding the standards of living that people expect. The logical solution is that it needs to be reduced to a number that is environmentally sustainable. (This would have to be implemented in regions as well as for total world population.) How should this be done and over what time frame?

David Suzuki, Al Gore, Paul Watson et al need to be asked to put forward exactly what population level they consider is environmentally sustainable and on what basis, including for regions, and then how they propose to reduce the present human population level to that figure.

[jetmech]

our economy has largely been based on things which directly contribute to global warming.

and if we make a switch in our lifestyles it isn't as if everyone will lose their jobs. somebody has to design solar panels and wind turbines. then someone else has to dig the hole to put them in and someone else has to install it. then someone else needs to maintain it. and someone needs to put in the wires that bring the power to the homes and maintain that.

the economy changes to suit the world me make.

the industrial and technological revolutions all cost jobs at the start. more automation, less people. but people have to create the programming and machines that do all this so jobs are created else where.

unfortunatly it takes fuel to get people from point a to point b. but what about turning the a/c way up in the summer and the heat way up in the winter? or spending a little extra for those eco-friendly products. and if we buy more eco-friendly products we creat more jobs for that sector, which in turn promotes that sector and inspires more to get into it. how about buying local produce that hasn't been shipped from south america and wrapped in plastic inside a box, inside another box that's also wrapped in plastic. how about going INTO tim's instead of idling in the drive though (it's quicker anyways).

it's supply and demand. if we demand things that are better for the world instead of worse, it's what we will get. and the more people start to buy into it the cheaper it will be.


i took nothing out of context and quoted you directly. you made a comparison of CO2 from volcanoes and CO2 from people. one goes in cycles and occurs naturaly which is PART of the eco-system. one is continuous and worsening and is un-natural. my analgy with earthquakes and murder is your logic not mine, and i was made as a point to illustrate the crap you're spewing.

Belieave me I'm doing what I can. All of my appliances, every one of them are energy star. I put in new windows. My furnace is high effiency and my A/C is set to 26 C in the summer and the heat is at 20 right now. I make a habit of buying home grown and home built now more than ever. I'm avoiding Costco the Chinese outlet store. I have a composter, two of them. Both our cars are well taken care of econimical 4 cylinders. These are things that everyone can do. Your idea of job creation due to technologie change makes sense, But that does not mean we stop everything we're doing now and hit the unemployment line. You've mentioned nothing about our Government doing multi billion dollar buissiness with third world countries, and supporting human rights atrocities in doing so. To suggest I'm spewing crap is a little steep. I think I've backed up my argument quite substantially. It's the fact that people like yourself and myself are possibly polarized to one side of the debate or another. It takes individuals in power with your train of thought and my train of thought to meet in the middle and figure out an plan that makes sense and is realistic and viable at the same time. It's this whole idea of having to stop living that get's me. Thats all I've been trying to say and it's hard to get a point across on a forum. The industrial revolution is over a century old, it's how we live, it's how we have been expected to live. If it's right or wrong is a none issue. Thats the way it is snd to change it is going to take time....period. To listen to and watch that asshole David Miller destroy Toronto is exactly what needs to be avoided on a Geographical scale. Of course this is just one example. The Toronto Transit system is a joke and pretty much non existent. How are people expected to park there cars and use a Trasnsit system that is useless? To want to implement tolls on all major highways and a downtown access fee of $20.00 is a good plan? This is how the Government plans to deal with the environment.....through punishment? They allow walls and walls of condos to go up and expect peole to pay $300'000.00 for a 400 square foot unit? So every one moves to the suburbs so they can afford to live. Now there supposed to give up there cars and use a transit system that does not work? How can they afford tolls on Highways that are already payed for through punishing gas tax? Build the transit system, make it work and work well, then give the option. Infrastructure needs to happen first. To go about it as you and others suggest is not going to work. Where causing more damage to the economy than we are saving anything in the environment. And economy is important, don't tell me otherwise, I'm sure you work for a living.

[BoostedNihilist]

Are you serious?

Solar, Wind, Geothermal, Nuclear, Wave, Hydro... should I go on?

Better question is where do get all the friggin oil to run those cars?

Did you even think when you came up with this gem? Where do you put that power? The only effective way I know of storing electricity is a battery and they aren't exactly environmentally friendly. BAtteries do NOT last forever and when they do go bad it takes ENERGY to recycle them. To obtain the materials and chemicals to produce batteries requires very environmentally unfriendly practices. Not to mention, is there even enough of that material on earth to sustain the demand these types of vehicles will create? THis is the problem with the green logic. As long as you are getting rid of carbon emissions you are solving the problem, but robbing peter to pay paul is not the correct way to solve a problem, any problem.

THe same thing with those ultra efficient five year lights you can buy for the same price as five years worth of regular light bulbs. Yes, they last five years BUT they have mercury in them, so when you 'pitch' them you're also spreading mercury. now imagine if we all used them the amount of mercury we would have to dispose of and the energy that would take.

I will admit it. I like gasoline. I like the smell, I like the sound and I like to burn it in my car. I like to burn it in my plane. I Like v8s and I like big suv's. That is my right and I will go to my grave burning as much smelly inefficient fossil fuel as I can. You want to see the problem? Go to china, go to any third world country where they burn kerosene instead of diesel, go to guatemala where their main mode of transportation still runs on two stroke engines then get back to me. By buying modern vehicles of whatever manufacturer I am doing my part and anyone who thinks I should sacrafice more than I have can suck my tailpipe.

nuclear is the solution, but it isn't nuclear power it is nuclear genocide. WHoever said the explosion of population is our problem got it right, and so long as that trend continues what we do and how much fossil fuel we burn to get ourselves from point a to point b is the least of our worries. Until genocide becomes a politically acceptable problem solution this global warming fix is going nowhere fast.

Judge me however you see fit, but I refuse to make any more a sacrifice than I am forced to because I pay for what I burn and that is my choice not yours thank you very much.