Impressions of BCIT and its graduates?

[markymarkl]

BCIT NEW building=BIG $$$$ and bring in the students and keep recycling them got to pay for that building.

Confed ACE New Building=BIG $$$$ and bring in the students and keep recycling them got to pay for that building.

Candore New Building=BIG $$$$ and bring in the students and keep recycling them got to pay for that building.

Enrollment is way down across the board "do more with less" "puppy mil" You here them all at the colleges (I know I work for one)

Get the idea folks the institutions (and I mean all the institutions) are money money money driven gone are the day's of quality education!!!!

[conehead]

hey twotter, did you hear about the apprentice our neighbours just canned? was checking tire pressure by touching the sidewall with the tire gauge

Apparently had no clue how to do it. Guess where he got his training....

C'mon..... that's pretty hard to believe....

[chowda]

It came right off the floor. You can add that to not knowing what "nut in safety" is, and leaving tape under prc until after it cures, to some of the stuff I've seen from BCIT grads. Also not having a clue on how a cordless drills settings work. Caught one genius with it set on "drill" cranking on panels. If you give me some more time, I know could remember more, because there is more.
Not saying all are bad 'cause we have some good ones from there, but its just the fact the terrible ones still manage to graduate that pisses me off.

[emoutal]

I completely agree with the fact that the horrible ones still manage to graduate. And the tire pressure story doesn't surprise me at all seeing some of my peers.

You look around and see rampant cheating on tests. I don't know if the teachers are blind or just don't feel like they can do anything. They might not have any concrete proof, but how can a student who gets stumped by the easiest questions that the teacher asks before the quiz (and they aren't even close to right), get 100% on the test right after that. Maybe its because all the tests are exactly the same as all the previous classes have had, so as long as you know a few people, the answers are there for you.

Also, for the practical part, most can just ride on the work of others. Team projects are a joke when only 1 or 2 people are doing anything. Some don't even feel it's worth being in the hangar for them, and would rather be playing facebook poker in the library, just coming back when it's done. But they still manage to pass. I think partly it's because the practical part is so subjective, that teachers don't want to fail students. I've seen a teacher fail a student, only to have that student argue it and get let through.

[SeptRepair]

It came right off the floor. You can add that to not knowing what "nut in safety" is, and leaving tape under prc until after it cures, to some of the stuff I've seen from BCIT grads. Also not having a clue on how a cordless drills settings work. Caught one genius with it set on "drill" cranking on panels. If you give me some more time, I know could remember more, because there is more.
Not saying all are bad 'cause we have some good ones from there, but its just the fact the terrible ones still manage to graduate that pisses me off.

Next thing your gunna say is that pink paint stripper isnt bubble gum flavored.

[conehead]

I completely agree with the fact that the horrible ones still manage to graduate. And the tire pressure story doesn't surprise me at all seeing some of my peers.

You look around and see rampant cheating on tests. I don't know if the teachers are blind or just don't feel like they can do anything. They might not have any concrete proof, but how can a student who gets stumped by the easiest questions that the teacher asks before the quiz (and they aren't even close to right), get 100% on the test right after that. Maybe its because all the tests are exactly the same as all the previous classes have had, so as long as you know a few people, the answers are there for you.

Also, for the practical part, most can just ride on the work of others. Team projects are a joke when only 1 or 2 people are doing anything. Some don't even feel it's worth being in the hangar for them, and would rather be playing facebook poker in the library, just coming back when it's done. But they still manage to pass. I think partly it's because the practical part is so subjective, that teachers don't want to fail students. I've seen a teacher fail a student, only to have that student argue it and get let through.

All this speaks of some very, very serious problems at the school. I can't believe the instructors are allowing this to happen. There are some simple ways to alleviate these problems.

I'm just gobsmacked.... really, don't know what else to say...

[Yutty]

royalties

[fortis risk]

BCIT grad in Calgary just filed down the nickel leading edge of a B1900. Proud school, great instructors. Ha

[bombardierfixer]

Well at least they weed themselves out quickly! But I have to ask, did he do it on a pilots request? I have had a pilot ask me to dress stuff on a dash prop. He didn't like it when I laughed then showed him the hamilton sunstrand CMM. If he was left alone with the pilot and didn't know and was badgered into doing it...

[SDflyer]

Last year had a new alternator and voltage regulator installed by a BCIT apprentice working under a fairly large AMO here in the lower mainland. I figure I I ended up paying for his training time since it took a l-o-n-g time. After the cowls were slapped back on and the plane pushed out of the hanger, a flip of the master switch an doh! no power... Not bashing here but if you cant remember to reconnect the battery cables and double check everything maybe you shouldn't be touching my plane. Next flight out my ailerons got jammed up after doing a spin in Glen Valley and we managed to limp it back to the airport and guess what I find hanging out underneath the panel, a coax that I swear was zap strapped up somehow made its way into the control column linkages... hmmm... fix it myself and the AMO signed the maintenance release without ever questioning maybe they are at fault since they were the last people mucking about under the panel.

So unless they can learn the most simple things like double or triple checking their work I'd rather work on it myself even if it means taking my whole day just to learn and fix it but at least I know I checked it 20 times over.

Checking, checking and re-checking would seem like rule number 1 taught in school when it comes to signing off a plane. yes?

I'm sure there are some that will become great AME's eventually but if they cant figure out how to do simple repairs and know enough to check their work over it makes you wonder what exactly what kind of knowledge and experience is being passed down.

[bombardierfixer]

Well time to go to a different AMO. If they are not inspecting the work and just pencil whipping stuff then you are taking a chance with your own neck. Checking your own work is one thing but your going to miss stuff, just because you have been looking at the same thing for a couple of hours, you need a second set of eyes. Hell I left my flashlite jammed between a AC gen and a Hydrolic pump to work on a prop PCU on a PW 121. I was just finishing a 21 day shift that was 12hr days and I was going home the next day. I wouldn't have had a clue untill I went looking for my flashlite. I did my initial inspection, then the inspector did his and low and behold he gave me my flashlight back. Granted I was asking for trouble (name your dirty dozens) but after this particularily long winded approach to make my point, experianced guys do it all the time, noobies are going to do it everytime and if no one is going to check up after them, well hopefully you can walk away from the "landing" oh and thas why you need close inspections too.

[iflyforpie]

Reading through this sure brings back fond memories.

I took a couple part-time courses at BCIT over ten years ago now and then went to SAIT for my AME course.

It doesn't matter what school you go to. It is one big cluster-@#$! between the old fossils who couldn't hack it in the field (those who can't, teach...right?) and young uns full of piss and vinegar whining about how terrible the course is and bragging about how much they already know.

Just like the flight training industry, there is no effective quality control on instructors, courses, or facilities. I was awed by what BCIT had in the old Boeing hangar in terms of equipment, but I probably got just as good of instruction at SAIT with a fraction of the facilities. Many of my instructors were great guys. Many weren't. Many courses were useful. Many had me wondering if they were just in the curriculum to provide employment for the instructor.

Likewise each student is different too. Of the classmates I am still in contact with, only just over half are still in aviation. Several I am not in contact with never touched an aircraft (and hopefully never do).

What you've got to realize is that all an AME course does is provide you a shaky foundation. Remember that it wasn't all that long ago where most of the training a civil AME needed was done on the job. And there are many who are drawn into the AME field without a mechanical background (like yours truly) who might not know what many of us would take to be common knowledge.

After a year in the industry you 'detox' from all the garbage that they taught you and learn how it is in the real world. An experienced AME will recognize a good apprentice who is eager, attentive, and humble and will tutor him or her in the proper way. Mistakes and brain farts happen (every single AME here has at least one story), but you will be on a pretty tight leash when first entering the industry.

[Yutty]

for data

[bombardierfixer]

Apply to SAIT see if you get in, Its a little cheaper to live in YYC as well.

[Yutty]

csec

[iflyforpie]

Yutty.

My info is over ten years old so I don't know what the right choice is. I was living in Richmond and applied to BCIT, but at the time I could get into SAIT a year earlier. The BCIT program actually looked better than the SAIT one according to the brochures and websites. In spite of having to move to Calgary where I would now have to pay rent, I decided that entering the industry a year earlier would be beneficial--and it was.

No school could hurt your chance of apprenticeship if you are dealing with an intelligent person hiring you and you show an eagerness and willing to learn.

I remember being in second-year at SAIT and someone from Canadian Regional came in (dating myself a bit ) and asked the class what a 'schraeder valve' was. Nobody knew and no answer was forthcoming from my instructor or the Regional guy. He was complaining that his new apprentices from last year didn't know what it was, so we were told to go look it up. I must have had an attention span of about five microseconds that day for whatever reason 'cause I didn't bother.

A year later I was at Kelowna Flightcraft trying to get the nitrogen out of a shock strut on a CV-580 and I come up against this 'schraeder valve' again that I didn't know how to operate. It took a licensed guy 30 seconds to show me how it worked and I've never forgotten, even though it's been almost five years since I've seen one.

If I was you, I'd go into BCIT. It gets you in sooner and during a downturn. I went in during a downturn and got hired right away after graduating during a boom.

[bombardierfixer]

I'd still at least contact SAIT, it dosn't hurt and I would bet you would still get in. I got accepted to the M program Aug 18th, after being accepted to the S program and then the E program. I carpet bombed saits programs. If you go to SAIT though just don't get all SAIT-ified and thinking you should be DOM, it seems to happen to their apprentile units. I really don't know whats worse incompetence or overconfidence...Depends in the end though where you want to be, the coast or the eastern slope.

[TwinOtterLover]

worst is those who are incompetent and overconfident at the same time but atleast they only last about a week before getting fired. As for the topic of this thread i havnt been to BCIT or SAIT but graduated from canadore however i work right now with someone from BCIT and someone from SAIT they both seem to have gotten the same amount of general knowledge but it amazes me that the basics we seemed to have gotten at canadore they didnt get at their schools. like building up a tire or washing an airplane.

[supersoniccble]

I graduated from SAIT's E course 6 years ago, and most of the guys I graduated with had the same feelings...The course was a joke, most of the instructors sucked and we didn't learn as much in certain subjects as I would have liked (autopilot).

6 years later, I'm licensed and endorsed, and still have basically the same opinions. In our course we rarely were on the aircraft, but rather in the classroom or lab. When we did go to the hanger it was for an instructor demo.

At SAIT we did learn the basics, and it did help a lot when I had to work by myself for the first 14 months of my apprenticeship (up north). After realizing that I wanted to actually have some sort of "mentor" I left for a larger company, to finish my license(YVR).

I now have a few BCIT grads as apprentices working with me, and I think most of them are as smart as a bag of bricks. Most can not read paperwork properly, want to be spoon fed, and have no knowledge of basic wiring practices.

Was I like that when I finished school? Maybe a bit, but I knew how to use most of the test equipment, could read a wiring diagram, and could use all the crimpers, insertion/extraction tools. Also I asked a lot of questions, and hung out in the cockpit with the maintenance manuals learning on the plane during my spare time.

The core guys from BCIT that I have under me now are lazy, can't use most of the equipment, and have little to no idea about standard practices.

I'm not here to say SAIT is better than BCIT, or I'm an avionics god, because I'm not. I feel that at this point in time with all these schools getting new facilities, and donated twin engine aircraft the students are getting lost in the shuffle. These schools are about making money and only care about shareholder value. The students are secondary. Until there is a change I will continue to teach new grads how to use an infrared heat gun.

[bombardierfixer]

Now here is a sweeping comment sure to raise the rancor of folks but, hey why not. Its a Gen Y thing! Or millenials, what ever you want to call them, they for the most parts are usless tits, at least in our eyes. Gen X is stuck between the old ways and the new ways, the Generation before X all they did was work. You know 35 years at the same job retire. Gen X: get a job then try to figure out how to work for yourself. Gen Y: work for yourself...period. My wife is a manager at a Cable company and she bitches about the Gen Y kids all the time. They actually starting to gas these kids, problem is we need them, blame their parents. Of course when you run into a switched on kid now a days it is a great thing, cause shit they are smart!

[NeverBlue]

Yutty...Please...quit pussy foot'n around and just do it already. It doesn't matter which certified school you go to it's entirely up to you as to how much you get out of it.

The problem today is that every student expects to receive some sort of "package" at school that they will carry with them for the rest of their life and everytime a problem arises they can just reach in and pull out a solution. Come on!

"we were all taught how to speak but I'm sure we all had to learn how to express ourselves"

...and I know for a fact that I graduated highschool at the same time my best friend did but he could do calculus a lot better then I could.

Does this mean I should blame my highschool?

[ourkid2000]

Every school seems to let these people through, don't let those stories discourage you. People like that are everywhere.

Don't expect to be a pro when you come out of your training program. Just try as get as much experience at school as you can and remember that the best place to make mistakes is in school.

When I graduated, I was well aware that I was probably more dangerous than anything and the way I handled it was to double check my work and always ask someone else to take a look. Take the advice they give you too, do not act like you know everything. The worst thing you can be is over-confident because it will bite you in the ass. Always be humble!

Even now I sometimes ask people to have a quick look at stuff I've done.

I'm gonna plug my school here once more.......CONA in Gander, NL. You will graduate with both M & E certifications and you will pay less than $1000 per semester for your books & tuition. It's a great deal and a really good program.

[dibunchau]

The whole program is ridiculously short. With the xmas time,holidays and non instruction days, the whole course is only about 10 to 11 months long. Spent almost 5 months to learn non-related materials, another half to rush thru the rest.
Materials were verbally given to the class and expected us to be able to fully understand. Projects and Group projects are ridiculously easy, can't even compare to the real world level. Career support? none at all. Only had one company willing to come visit the school. Only half of the class are currently employed, and offers are based on racial priority. In other words, minorities please go back to your own countries.

[plhought]

Meanwhile...in Dawson Creek...

[SuperchargedRS]

Something tells me Blue and Bite are the same person, or maybe just two propaganda spammers from said school.

It appears this forum is getting alot of shit disturbers / spammers with <20 posts that just post some propaganda, or shit talk on certian threads (mainly about services or schools), hope this site isnt becoming infested with spammers and school reps.