Why am I getting such attitude when I call places??

[AntiNakedMan]

I try to avoid being rude or sarcastic, but it is hilarious when a pilot calls and the convo goes like this:

Him - "Hi, can I speak to Mr. XXXXXXXX (the CP)"

Me - "Sorry, he's out flying, is there something I can help you with?" (I can already tell that it is a pilot looking for a job calling)

Him - "Well, I'd really like to speak to him if possible about a job."

Me - "Oh, yeah, the position has been filled, sorry."

Him - "Oh... well do you need anyone else?"

Me - "Umm... well we advertised one position, and we've already filled that position... so no."

Him - "Can I ask how much experience the guy who got hired has?"

Me - (Its a slow day and I have nothing better to do, so I play this out) "Sure, he's got about 300 hours and a multi-IFR."

Him - "Oh yah. I have about 400 hours and a multi-IFR as well."

Me - "Oh, I see...."

Him - "So, do you think that I could do the job as well?"

Me - "Umm.... well the job is already filled...."

Him - "Can I ask how much the guy you hired is getting paid?"

(The FNK happens to be sitting in the office, him and the other pilot laughing at my side of the convo, and I cover the phone and ask him if he minds if I indulge the caller. He doesn't mind."

Me - "Yeah, he is starting at $XXXX a month."

Him - "Hmm.... so do you think, maybe If I came up and paid half of his wage, I could do half of the flying he will do?"

Me - (Trying not to laugh out loud) "Well I don't think it quite works like that... plus you know there is the cost of training and everything which the company has to bear..."

Him - "How much is that?"

Me - "Oh I think around $5-10,000."

Him - "Oh, I don't have a problem paying that."

Me - "Yeah, you see, we only advertised for one position and there is only really enough work for one position...."

Him - "Hmm well can you mention this to Mr. XXXX? My name is XXXXX and my number is XXXXX."

Me - "Yeah, sure, let me just write all of that down...." (I think I was drawing a kitty on the notepad)

Him - "Ok, thanks!"

Me- "Yup, bye."

Then me and the other guys have a really good laugh for the next week over this.

[dannyjet]

Dissapointing, to say the least.

[iflyforpie]

I answer phones more than I fly right now and the sheer volume of 'junk' calls pisses me off. So when I see another number pop up from Ontario or Quebec with no name, I am milliseconds from slamming the phone down.

But I like talking to pilots. It's better than talking to maintenance customers (how much this time?, what are you going to replace?, when is my plane going to be ready?) and all the other garble that seems to envelope a small business phone line. Unfortunately, since I'm not the CP or the owner, I don't have all the answers regarding hiring.

Sometimes I have time to chat. Sometimes I've got to get ready to go flying or do something else. Some pilots will take my being friendly and informative as a sign that we are hiring, so I usually have to be blunt if they say they are going to make a trip out that there won't be a position for them.

And then there are the ones who will offer to pay or work for free to get ahead. I would love to tear a strip off of these jokers but I will say politely that we don't have a position and hang up.


Cold calls are awkward, but they are necessary IMHO. A resume is just a piece of paper with no flesh and blood. But just showing up unexpectedly can leave a poor impression--especially if it is at a bad time.

Best of luck to you guys out there! Wish I could help but right now I am just glad I have my own job.

[VikVaughan]

Thanks anyway

[iflyforpie]

Had one guy who was a 'volunteer' tow pilot for the local soaring club. He wasn't getting as many tows as he would like and wanted to see if he could get more hours (don't know why, he had a gazillion doing top-dressing in NZ). We told him we didn't have a position open. He said, 'don't worry, you don't have to pay me!'



(He was a nice guy otherwise, but JEEEZ!)

[mattedfred]

Then me and the other guys have a really good laugh for the next week over this.

what a wasted opportunity to offer some guidance to someone who obviously needed it

[scopiton]

AntiNaked,
Next time you're looking for a job you'll remember your own post, and I will laugh out loud...

[bbb]

As Cat said, it doesn't take much to be polite. But...
Try looking at it from the employer's point of view - as lots of people are speculating/saying, chief pilots are often quite busy.
If you get told, sorry, not hiring right now (or other similar statement) leave it alone, thank the person, and consider sending in your resume the old-fashioned way - mail. It can get read at their convenience, and sounds weird, but email is too easy to delete, and it seems harder to discard some- (not all - see lots of advice about cover letters addressed properly, and a good resume) one's good attempt at summerizing their life that you are holding in your hands- far easier to file in the resume file. Which, when its hiring time, likely gets a go-thru to see if theres a fit already in there, and received in recent memory.
Aso, to who-ever suggested calling after business hours, have you considered that someone is on call and has a life that doesn't want to be bothered with not-immediately-pressing or revenue-producing business? it may be another line pilot, it may be a manager etc, but pretty much guaranteed, unless you know the company has a phone system that doesn't immediately go to the poor person on-call, DON'T USE THIS IDEA!
good luck to everyone looking, and good luck to those of us who are still employed!

[VikVaughan]

[jp7500]

In response to Mattedfred and Scopiton and there opinion of AntiNaked Man, you guys are dead on, can't believe a professional pilot would post something like this!!! This post says alot about the maturity and professionalism of this character.

Good luck guys and to everyone that is searching,


J

[E-Flyer]

Ok, so another phone call to a company to get some contact info so I can find out who and where to send my resume. But I got some attitude from the guy I talked to. He said he wasn't a pilot, so I don't know his position. But in general, when I'm calling places, everyone, especially the CP always seem like they hate life and everyone else.

The one I called today, I just asked for an email and a fax number to send a resume to, and was given the info. But then I asked how business in general was for them, and the guy was like "what kind of question is that"?. I was kinda shocked, what kind of question is it not?!! I ask so I can have some sort of idea how companies are doing, and what my chances are of getting a job are. But this guy seemed kinda offended. So I told him that I was just curious because in these economic times there are a lot of companies struggling, and I was just curious. He then said that they just hired 2 pilots, and I responded by saying "ok good, that's what I like to hear"!(actually, what I really wanted to hear was that they NEEDED to hire 2 pilots, but ok, already hired 2 is still better than getting rid of 2). But then he played "there's my other line" and hung up.

I'm an honest person, and I believe that all information is good information because knowledge is power. But why do I seem to get attitude from people when all I want is some basic info? I'm polite and non intrusive with my questions.

I would assume anyone with half a brain would understand why someone applying would like to know how business is. Am I missing something?

Ask yourself this question, do you see yourself working for a company that shows you attitude? If you do, you wouldn't be on here complaining ! So, move on from those that give you attitude, and look for the company that is right for you !

For example, Air Canada is a great company, but it's not the place for every pilot. Maybe you are more of a West Jet guy...

Apples or Oranges !


Find your favorite fruit, and have fun (and yes that can be comprehended differently, I am aware of that)

[tzu]

Simple answer:

TYPICAL AVIATION BULLSHIT.

Always remember that it's the operator who is doing you a favour if they hire you. Their role will then be to treat you like a worthless nightwalker on Jarvis, then giving you less than McMinimum wage for pay. If you think you're receiving attitude now, well, just wait for the moment when you exercise your professional judgement and axe a flight because of weather - It will be all smiles and hugs for sure....
But hell, you'll get hours right?

4 years from now, you'll be really thankful that you passed on that accounting degree and getting a real career.

[AntiNakedMan]

Then me and the other guys have a really good laugh for the next week over this.

what a wasted opportunity to offer some guidance to someone who obviously needed it

What guidance? I'm not going to get all preachy with someone who calls me on the phone asking for a job. I made it clear enough that his idea was not a tenable one.

In response to Mattedfred and Scopiton and there opinion of AntiNaked Man, you guys are dead on, can't believe a professional pilot would post something like this!!! This post says alot about the maturity and professionalism of this character.

Not sure what you are getting at - the original poster was inquiring about why they get attitude when they call companies. I offered an experience I had, and I am sure many pilots who might call a company about a job now know that offering to pay for training or another pilot's salary is a bad idea.

AntiNaked,
Next time you're looking for a job you'll remember your own post, and I will laugh out loud...

If you think that I would ever, ever offer money to fly for someone, you have got your head all kinds of fucked up. I value my work very highly, and so does my employer. Besides, flying for family gives pretty good job security. In fact, likely the best job security I will ever have.

If you're implying that it is horrible that I am making fun of someone else when they call me - get a life. I didn't mention any names, for all you know I could've made it up. If it was you that called, and are upset about it - I hope you learnt something.

I'm getting excited for my retirement from commercial flying (for awhile at least) and working in a profession where the average maturity level is consumate with the responsibilty excercised - only 3 months left!

Anti

[rayban]

I remember looking for my first jobs as a pilot. Some CP's blew me off and some gave me a few minutes of their time and offered some great advice. I still remember the companies who's CP treated me with respect and to this day I've got a very high opinion of certain companies and a rather negative opinion of some companies where the CP was rude based on those initial experiences. Maybe not much of a big deal really but every now and then one of those companies I respect has a plane come through where I am and I tend to go the extra mile for them.

[mattedfred]

anti,

my objection isn't to your disappointment with the caller's ethics. i object to the way you handled a call from an unethical pilot. how will he learn unless someone of higher moral fortitude tunes him in?

[privateer]

Well said rayban. I as well remember the companies that were nice and some that were not so nice. I remember standing in a line up at Navair that was out the door. Some guys were wearing suites even. But I was impressed by the fact that he took the time every Tuesday to talk to up and coming people. Anyways, other times the secretaries were trained how to get rid of pilots who wanted to talk to the CP. I usually stayed away after experience like that. Its not like you were ever going to get the truth. At the time the boom was happening emails were the best way to go about sending a resume. But the paper mail wouldn't be a bad idea now though.

[Hawkeye4077]

I answer phones more than I fly right now and the sheer volume of 'junk' calls pisses me off. So when I see another number pop up from Ontario or Quebec with no name, I am milliseconds from slamming the phone down.

What difference does the provenance of the guy looking for work make? I understand the number of calls CP's are receiving are on the high side but making your mind on a pilot calling regarding employment opportunities just on the caller id seems unfair. I'm sure when everybody was looking for a pilot you would have offer to pay for his long distance call just to talk to you.

Maybe not I don`t claim to know you but I'm sure you get my idea..


Hawk

[iflyforpie]

I answer phones more than I fly right now and the sheer volume of 'junk' calls pisses me off. So when I see another number pop up from Ontario or Quebec with no name, I am milliseconds from slamming the phone down.

What difference does the provenance of the guy looking for work make? I understand the number of calls CP's are receiving are on the high side but making your mind on a pilot calling regarding employment opportunities just on the caller id seems unfair. I'm sure when everybody was looking for a pilot you would have offer to pay for his long distance call just to talk to you.

Maybe not I don`t claim to know you but I'm sure you get my idea..


Hawk

Naw... you took it out of context. Most of the people who call me from half a country away can barely speak English and want to sell me a magazine subscription, which pisses me off. So if someone calls from there, I've got my 'thanks I'm not interested' already loaded and I have to defuse it if it is a pilot calling.

Like I said before:

I like talking to pilots.

I like chatting with pilots who come and visit too.

canpilot and I had a good chat on the phone a few weeks back.

[Hawkeye4077]

FFP: Fair enough. I probably misinterpreted you.

So If I was to call you for a chat, Would you have any good news for me?

[scopiton]

If you're implying that it is horrible that I am making fun of someone else when they call me - get a life. I didn't mention any names, for all you know I could've made it up. If it was you that called, and are upset about it - I hope you learnt something.

No it was not me unfortunately, I don't pay to work and am not in such a distress, I don't give a @#$! that you didn't mention any name.
what you mentioned is your attitude and I'm glad a prick like you is not part of this industry anymore.

One day you'll need something and being asking for it might be painfull. you don't have the right to humiliate someone with your fellow pilots over the phone, neither here on the net.
remember : one Day you'll beg for food and someone will laugh at you...