Pros/Cons of Air Tindi and Buffalo Airways

[Darman]

Hi guys,

Does anyone have any info on Air Tindi and Buffalo Airways? Average rampie time, living cost, perdiems, medical plan, pros and cons, anything really.. Thanks

[SayAgain]

Check your pm's

[LePhraz]

Sorry I missed that reply.

I have the same question. Love to hear the answer.
Thanks.

[dannyjet]

I'd appreciate I get the information on my Inbox as well, thanks in advance.

[Justapilot]

Same here please.

[Doc]

"Average rampie time......." Hint....even Wasaya has got out of the "wannabe" business. Because it's wrong......YMMV

[raven54]

I worked at both. Buffalo is cool if you're into the old big piston machines however, the ramp job is usually 7 days a week. It's been some time since I worked there so my info is a little dated. Tindi is good because of the diversity of their fleet with different routes to take however, you may work the ramp for some time before seeing a seat. ....but...the schedule was VERY good on the ramp.

Doc has made his opinion quite clear. But that is just HIS opinion. If you want to be around airplanes go do the ramp, or you can go pump gas. But you'll not be called by either company for a right seat if you're filling cars. Not to hijack here....but I really enjoyed working the ramp, it was a great time with great people. When I did get flying it was well worth it as ATL was a fantastic company to work for.

[vmc_demo]

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[raven54]

Hey VMC, I agree that it sucks to not start flying right away. But in some cases (which it was for me) there wasn't too many options out there, so I made the best of it. The flying jobs would not be available any faster if pilots didn't work the ramp. But I'd much rather be exposed to airplanes and the industry waiting for a seat then say being exposed to a deep fryer and a burger grill while I wait. Maybe I'm retarded, but hey....what can you do?

[vmc_demo]

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[Just another canuck]

what you can do is continue your education and get your instructor rating,

I would rather ramp, or receive 1000 lashes for that matter, than instruct. If I were to "continue my education", that would mean going back to school and getting a degree. Since when is getting an instructor rating considered "continued education"??

[Hoov]

what you can do is continue your education and get your instructor rating,

I would rather ramp, or receive 1000 lashes for that matter, than instruct. If I were to "continue my education", that would mean going back to school and getting a degree. Since when is getting an instructor rating considered "continued education"??

Agreed, get off your high horse VMC.

[Doc]

what you can do is continue your education and get your instructor rating,

I would rather ramp, or receive 1000 lashes for that matter, than instruct. If I were to "continue my education", that would mean going back to school and getting a degree. Since when is getting an instructor rating considered "continued education"??

Agreed, get off your high horse VMC.

So, you think "1000 lashes" is better than being an instructor, or continuing an education? Enjoy the ramp guys. Sure hope you get along with everybody, or you're just swinging at windmills.

[vmc_demo]

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[volez]

No buddies , lots of employers are looking for "operational time" whether you agree or not . I know it s not pleasant to read but that s the truth, although I personnaly think than instructing allows you to developp something which is really worth it even if it's far from the real world.
And all the friends I know went instructing had a very hard time to find a job with 1000 of hours spent instructing on a 172, the one that got on FO or Navajo pic spot were the one who got that close to 500 multi PIC.

On the other hand although you ll not fly, ramping can really bring you that operational experience. Plus there's ramping and ramping, some people think that rampees spend their time throwing their bags in the plane, that's not true all the time, some prepare weight and balance, passenger manifest, get a real idea of what is at stake through daily situation, fuel delivery issues, mechanical issue, global logistic, at the end of the ramp time, you ll get a big picture of the way the company has to work to make profits and so forth.

I would say that one is not better than the other one, some people will tell, yeah but the career goes really faster if you choose to instruct, yeah well it all depends what period of time you consider, plus does it really matter if there's a 3 years difference between the two fields in the general progression ? Seriously, you have to think on a long term, when you ll be 60 and you ll think back about this kind of false debate, it will make you smile ...

So, no sweat, both have advantages and disadvantages but at the end of a the day , it doesn't change a lot on long term career plan.

[vmc_demo]

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[volez]

I respect your opinion whether I agree or not no offense.

That's an interesting one, thanks for your reply. I hope you have found or will find what you're looking for. Fly safe.

[Just another canuck]

No need to get too defensive there vmc... what I meant by the "1000 lashes" statement was that I don't think I could handle instructing. The very idea of hanging out at a flight school all day makes me nauseous to think about. I can't even stand stepping foot in one.

But here's a question for you... say a 200 hour CPL wants to fly as a co-joe on a Twin Otter. They've been dreaming about it since childhood. What do you think would be the fastest route to that? Instructing or ramping at Tindi/Transwest/Sunwest? Or they want to fly a 206 in the Yukon? Ramping or instructing? Or they want to fly float planes in BC or NWO? Dockhand or instructing?

The point is it depends what you want to do as volez has already pointed out... which brings me to the original question in this thread. Darman, it all depends on what you are looking for on your path to a career in aviation.

employers want flight time, not how many hrs you logged sweeping the hangar floor

Most employers are also smart enough to know the difference between "hours or flight time" and "experience". IMHO, a 2000 hour instructor is less experienced than a guy/gal who has a five hundred hours right seat in a Twotter or King Air or Navajo or whatever. And unless contracts dictate otherwise, the person with real industry experience is better suited for any given position than any instructor. So vmc, maybe you don't want to fly floats or work in the bush... maybe you want to get on a 1900 down in S. Ontario somewhere, which would mean you've chosen the right path for yourself. But if you were hoping to fly a Twotter on floats out of YZF, for example, you have made a mistake.

And lastly, when I was in YZF, instructors have shown up at our base with 500 or more MPIC and an ATPL, all instructing and wanted to fly our planes. With the right attitude, they were offered ramp positions, but most resumes were filed under "G" because the instructors thought they had it all figured out already... remind you of anybody?? Meanwhile, as far as my boss was concerned, they had still never had a "real" job in this industry.

[vmc_demo]

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[Just another canuck]

You're the man!!!

I'm out.

And BTW, you still didn't answer the question...

[av8tor_assrope]

Why do these threads always get side tracked? No one cares what YOU think about ramping or instructing. The guy asked about the two companies.

To answer your question Darman.....
I haven’t worked for either of them however, I’ve worked with a lot of ex Tindi guys in the otter world and for the most part they’ve all had nothing but positive things to say about Tindi. All of the ex Tindi guys I’ve flown with are top notch guys and great pilot’s.

Cheers

[Cat Driver]

i grew up wanting to fly A320's not fucking 206's

Then you sure wouldn't want to fly the little airplane I fly.

Is it true that some pilots think the size of an airplane determines how good a pilot they are?

[Doc]

One point, then I'm gone on the subject...for now..

The math.....250 hour pilot after two years on the ramp, you have a 250 hour pilot who can do a weight and balance?
The instructor after two years? 1200-1500 hours. The lion's share of it PIC. Some would have an ATPL.

Both resumes come across a CP'S desk......pretty much a "no brainer"? I know which one I'd hire. We have an ex instructor working for us right now. I don't think we'd have done as well if he'd been driving forklifts/slinging bags/filling out passenger manifest/etc. for the past two years.

You know how long it takes to learn to fill out a weight and balance? About 15 minutes. About the same to fill out a passenger manifest! Some "operational experience"!

You want to work a ramp to be next to airplanes, that's your choice. But don't feed us the "crap" that it's "operational experience", because it's manual labour. With airplanes.

[young grasshopper]

I got into the industry shortly after 9/11, and NOBODY was hiring. If I had waited for a "flying only" job, I can gaurantee I wouldn't be where I'm at now (Captain on a 12,500+). I'm not bragging, just stating the facts. Some of my buddies who waited to get a flying gig eventually got one, but by that point (I had already done my 14 months, 18 days on the ramp), I already had 1500+ hours, and I was being paid the entire time. While I obviously didn't treasure my time on the ramp, I felt (at the time) lucky to have a job.

I look at this situation like going to the grocery store...I don't like to wait in line. BUT, if I want to get what I need, I gotta wait. What will happen if I say to everyone "I'm refusing to wait in this line"? Exactly...nothing will happen, and you won't get your groceries. SO, either they need to open more tills (yes...jobs)...or ya gotta wait in line.

[Donald]

Take a job as an instructor, and you are pretty much guaranteed to be looking for a new job in about 2 years, unless you are in it for a career.

Take a job on the ramp somewhere large-ish (like Tindi in this example), and you could easily find yourself there for 5-10 years or more.

As for the accumulation of hours, the guy who does the ramp for 2 years, then ends up on a twin otter/caravan/185 for the next three years, will have 3000+ hours, an ATPL, and a job with larger aircraft in the future. For sure the instructor gets hours quicker out of the gate, but in time this evens out.


The choice is yours and in the end it's about the journey, not the destination...