Landing Long.

[iflyforpie]

Since we've hashed out backtracking already, thought I would do a poll to see how many of us land long. I'm not really considering anything where there is more than 2000ft of runway remaining for light aircraft.


Myself, I am at a 3000ft strip with no parallel taxiway and the apron at one end and a sky 'infested' with gliders.

I aim for just past the halfway point and roll out in the last 1000ft to expedite clearing the runway and to save time. I fly single engine Cessnas.

[Four1oh]

Talk about a vague poll. yes/no? I can't vote because my answer is both. I never land my boeing long, yet, on runway 36 in YYC I'd land a cessna anywhere on that runway.

[AuxBatOn]

Talk about a vague poll. yes/no? I can't vote because my answer is both. I never land my boeing long, yet, on runway 34 in YYC I'd land a cessna anywhere on that runway.

Aren't you based in YYC

[iflyforpie]

No meaning never, and yes meaning under certain circumstances.

[CelBatrin]

Do I intentionally land long?
- Yes

Do I unintentionally land long?
- That has happened too, but overall I'd say NO.

[Four1oh]

Talk about a vague poll. yes/no? I can't vote because my answer is both. I never land my boeing long, yet, on runway 34 in YYC I'd land a cessna anywhere on that runway.

Aren't you based in YYC

Oops! Been flying to YWG too much lately!! 34 in YYC, 36 in YWG... same philosophy!

[Hedley]

Do http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_France_Flight_358 get a vote?

[Donald]

Does this guy get a vote?

(Video was posted earlier in another thread)

[Big Pistons Forever]

The issue is not landing long versus not landing long, it is about having the ability to make the aircraft consistently touch down at the point of your choosing, not where ever the airplane falls out of he sky. For commercial pilots this should be at the most operationally efficient spot consistent with a safe and prudent assessment of the conditions. The chosen touch down point could be the numbers or well down the runway depending on the situation.

[Ralliart]

For commercial pilots this should be at the most operationally efficient spot consistent with a safe and prudent assessment of the conditions. The chosen touch down point could be the numbers or well down the runway depending on the situation.

This is my preferred method.

[G3]

This topic reminds me of:

"What is one of the three most useless things to a Pilot?"....Alex

G3

[Double Wasp]

I agree with BPF on this one as well.

It seems to me that the less experienced of us out there only consider a good landing to be a "greaser" at any cost. I once had a copilot get upset with me not letting them land on the shorter airstrips when they would use up 2500' of a 5000' runway prior to touching down trying to milk a smooth landing. When we finally came to a stop and started backtracking for the taxiway at the 3000' mark I asked; "Do you consider that a good landing?". The response was "yes" and I proceeded to explain that until this particular FO was able to bring the airplane to a stop in less than 2000' on pavement, with out being aggressive, there was no way I was going to let them have a go at a 3000' gravel strip. The person was a upset at first but eventually we go to see eye to eye. I was flying a Beech 99 at the time.

I guess there are two points here for newer people:

1. Pick a spot and hit it. Once you can do this it a lot of the risk of landing long is diminished. Being completely smooth will come and eventually you will be able to do both. This applies for every type from C150's to the biggest transport.

2. A firm landing isn't a bad thing. In fact in a lot of ways it is better to have a positive tire spin up (in case of frozen brakes) and it actually decreases tire wear slightly by not allowing the tire to drag along while it spins up. I actually blew a tire on a chieftain once because the brakes froze after I departed. I had a smooth landing on a snow covered runway and the tire just didn't spin up.

Take care
DW

[iflyforpie]

I guess the point I was trying to make is do you have the confidence to land your aircraft and get it stopped within a certain distance, and do you sometimes test that ability by setting a conservative but hard distance (ie: runway remaining) to get the aircraft stopped. Floating down half the runway after a botched approach and flat landing doesn't count.

Complex aircraft with SOPs don't really apply because they are (supposed) to be landed within the TDZ.

BPF and Double Wasp, excellent posts. There are many circumstances where I will not land long (variable gusty winds, unfamiliar downslope runways, etc) and I have heard the mantra that a rough landing in the TDZ (or where you are aiming) is better than a smooth landing beyond it.

What is one of the three most useless things to a Pilot?

Elaborate. We've tested our brakes and evaluated the surface and weather. An engine failure is going to stop us sooner. Is there something I've missed?

[Double Wasp]

Quote:
What is one of the three most useless things to a Pilot?


Elaborate. We've tested our brakes and evaluated the surface and weather. An engine failure is going to stop us sooner. Is there something I've missed?

I believe the three things being referred to are:

1. Runway behind you.
2. Altitude above you.
3. Fuel in the truck.

I stand to be corrected.
DW

[CP]

Do http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_France_Flight_358 get a vote?

That was unintentional. Not what he is talking about here.

[flyingdan]

When I was at CYHM, sometimes the tower controller (who was also covering the ground position) would instruct me to expect the taxiway at the other end of the runway so my instructor told me I should would aim for farther down the runway so I didn't have to taxi along the whole length of the runway. This was in a Cherokee mind you.

[G3]

Spot on Double Wasp.

I am surprised that even got questioned or asked to be explained.

I guess I am getting old, but I knew that one even before I even had my private license, that was 25 years and 15000+hr.s ago and no over runs.

G3

[Flaperons]

Landed the 175 on 4R in MDW today. 74000lbs, wind 010/6kts, flap full. Greased it, and got off at 13L. 3200 feet.

Don't land long. Instead, aim for the earliest plausible turnoff, and hone your skills.

Look in your POH, and see what the published performance is for your weight/environment/config. If you can't at least do that, you need to work harder. The most dangerous maneuvers are the ones people don't like to practice.

My 2 cents.

[Panama Jack]

I don't do it intentionally on the A340 (the Captain seems to get terribly nervous and the Company gets hot and bothered about it), but I do it as requirements dictate on the glider to avoid having to push it for 1000's of feet.

[tiny]

There are to many variables to landing. Touching down on the numbers on 16 yyc in a 172 and then taxiing to the Esso is painfull.. On the other hand landing long on a short cub strip in the mountains could be the last landing you do.

[KenoraPilot]

who bloody hasn't landed long!!

[rsandor]

I think it totally depends on circumstance and I think that people who play 'high and mighty' and claim never to do it are full of poop. If you are flying a cessna 172 into an airport with a 10,000' runway and the parking spot is at the FAR END - you'd be an absolute retard to land on the first 10,000'. (especially if there is traffic behind you)

end of story.

[square]

I don't even turn for final til I get to the numbers, first taxi way is like 4500 feet down from em

[BTD]

I think it totally depends on circumstance and I think that people who play 'high and mighty' and claim never to do it are full of poop. If you are flying a cessna 172 into an airport with a 10,000' runway and the parking spot is at the FAR END - you'd be an absolute retard to land on the first 10,000'. (especially if there is traffic behind you)

end of story.

Gotta say when I land on a 10 000 foot long runway I usually land in the first 10 000 feet

[rsandor]

I think it totally depends on circumstance and I think that people who play 'high and mighty' and claim never to do it are full of poop. If you are flying a cessna 172 into an airport with a 10,000' runway and the parking spot is at the FAR END - you'd be an absolute retard to land on the first 10,000'. (especially if there is traffic behind you)

end of story.

Gotta say when I land on a 10 000 foot long runway I usually land in the first 10 000 feet

har har..