Non biased facts.

[double-j]

Seeing that I'm communicating through a keyboard I can't "prove" it other than you having to believe what I type. I did hear it from the horse's mouth in regards to 5T and from a senior employee at Calm Air.

Yes, I am new here and was pointed to this forum. Where I work doesn't matter but I do have a vested interest in the north and myself, like many others, aren't too happy with the way WJ entered the northern market. I also know many people at Westjet, both very senior and junior FWIW.

When I suggested proof, I meant like a link to an article or anything that would substantiate your slag on WJ. Since you cannot I doubt its true for the following reasons..

1. WJ does not code share with anyone. So you want us to believe that WJ approached 5T and 'led' them to open their very confidential info.

2. If they already did the same thing with Calm Air, either 5T must be really trusting or foolish to 'fall' for the same thing that calm air did.

3. If they were duped in this matter as you say, would 5T not be crying foul to any newspaper that would listen? We all know that they are no stranger to using the media as their forum on the 'cherry picking' of the northern route.

4. And finally, this article..

The governments of the Northwest Territories, Nunavut and Yukon are being urged by northern carriers to adopt a "buy local" policy when booking flights for passengers and cargo. "This is just good business and certainly not charity," Northern Air Transport Association president Joseph Sparling said in a three-page letter to NWT Premier Floyd Roland, Nunavut Premier Eva Aariak and Yukon Premier Dennis Fentie. Mr. Sparling, a co-founder of Whitehorse-based Air North, said WestJet Airlines Ltd. and Air Canada are seeking to "displace northern carriers from the market." The association's members include Air North, Canadian North and First Air. Mr. Sparling said it's unfair for Ottawa to supply loans to Air Canada, and he criticized WestJet for declining to enter partnerships with northern carriers, many of which have "significant aboriginal ownership." Mr. Sparling said he worries that Air Canada and WestJet have too much clout, alleging that "irrational" fares are "putting the viability of northern airlines at risk."

It actually criticizes WJ for not wanting to enter a code share agreement with the northern carriers (big suprise, to date WJ has no code share with any domestic airlines).

The only thing I can see as evidence is a new poster (which signed on the very next day after FICU's last post.. just sayin') who claims he heard all this big news from 5T's CEO themself. One who has an obvious disdain for WJ being up in YK.

You can understand why I think this is BS. Furthermore, without proof can be construed as libel. If you are unsure of the definition http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation with my compliments.

respectfully,

[double-j]

P.S.

My sincere apologies to the AC guys for hijacking this thread..

jj

[Spit-IX]

1. WJ does not code share with anyone. So you want us to believe that WJ approached 5T and 'led' them to open their very confidential info.

From what I was told, and I have no reason to disbelieve it, an agreement was in the final stages of being worked out when WJ pulled the plug.

2. If they already did the same thing with Calm Air, either 5T must be really trusting or foolish to 'fall' for the same thing that calm air did.

I have no idea of Calm Air's communications with 5T so it's possible 5T didn't know about it.

3. If they were duped in this matter as you say, would 5T not be crying foul to any newspaper that would listen? We all know that they are no stranger to using the media as their forum on the 'cherry picking' of the northern route.

If it was me I wouldn't bring it up because it would make me look foolish for opening the books up to competition in the first place.

4. And finally, this article..

it actually criticizes WJ for not wanting to enter a code share agreement with the northern carriers (big suprise, to date WJ has no code share with any domestic airlines).

Like I said, they were very close to an agreement.

The only thing I can see as evidence is a new poster (which signed on the very next day after FICU's last post.. just sayin') who claims he heard all this big news from 5T's CEO themself. One who has an obvious disdain for WJ being up in YK.

Why would I make it up and post it here? As for FICU, not related, sorry.

You can understand why I think this is BS. Furthermore, without proof can be construed as libel. If you are unsure of the definition http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation with my compliments.

I know what libel is thanks. Don't you think some of your colleagues on this board should be looking up the definition of "slander" since we're talking of definitions?

Regards

[Jastapilot]

I'll make it easy. Here's a search of every post I've ever made.

Might not be bashing AC but not very professional way to represent your company:

you're a fucktwit
you're only a moron
I do think you're a pretentious, arrogant, hypocritical asshole
you're a putz
I have zero respect for a leech.

That's just page 1 and 2 of 16 pages of your posts.

I suggest you take a lesson from KAG on how to represent your company on a public aviation forum because you never know who's watching.

Seriously? Is that the best you can do? You're new to this 'internet' thing, aren't you? Now put my comments back in context and let's see how I was being spoken to.

[double-j]

Why would I make it up and post it here?

My guess is to generate sympathy to 5T and anger towards WJ and the new northern routes. But whatever you 'proved' my point sort to speak. Without some sort of proof, your example is just heresay and not credible in the least.

jj

[Spit-IX]

Seriously? Is that the best you can do? You're new to this 'internet' thing, aren't you? Now put my comments back in context and let's see how I was being spoken to.

What does context have to do with bashing your aviation peers, you're a professional aren't you? You're also the one who offered up all your posts to scrutiny.

You represent your colleagues at WJ on this board and you're attitude, and a few others, in the way you treat your peers here doesn't reflect well on them or your company.

Seeing that you joined this board a few months ago I'd wager you are a very low seniority F/O from one of the last 2 classes who will be in the right seat the majority of your career at WJ. Think about your company and your colleagues and how you represent them before you press "submit". Many of your fellow WJ colleagues lurk on this board and possibly some who hold a position that you should care about.

[Spit-IX]

My guess is to generate sympathy to 5T and anger towards WJ and the new northern routes. But whatever you 'proved' my point sort to speak. Without some sort of proof, your example is just heresay and not credible in the least.

I think 5T has gone to the media enough to try to get sympathy, they don't need my help.

It's pretty hard to prove anything on any board as 99% of discussions can only be taken as opinion and hearsay anyway.

[Jastapilot]

Seeing that you joined this board a few months ago I'd wager you are a very low seniority F/O from one of the last 2 classes who will be in the right seat the majority of your career at WJ. Think about your company and your colleagues and how you represent them before you press "submit". Many of your fellow WJ colleagues lurk on this board and possibly some who hold a position that you should care about.

You shouldn't wager any assumption based on how long a poster has been registered. So you treat people with low post counts different than the ones with thousands of posts? I will say again, I respond to others in the same tone they respond to me. I call BS when I see it and will graciously correct it as graciously as it was dealt. Maybe I'm a lesser person for not taking the high road, but if you want to fling poo, you're going to get it back, sometimes even a little more than was thrown. Don't mistake me for a troll, unless you want to label just about everyone on this forum with an opinion as such.

Anyhow, beat the horse all you want, I think I've made my point.

[complexintentions]

Yes, it is safe to say you have given us a good idea of what you're all about.

[5dayer]

I dont see the big deal. Edmonton to Yellowknife is only 1 route. Westjet wont be going to Rankin Inlet or any of the other places served by the Northern carriers. Doesnt it make sense to service Yellowknife so people can check in and go anywhere Westjet flies. Im sure a lot of the people on that flight are connecting and going to other places. I hope Westjet services Whitehorse too sometime.

[tonysoprano]

If you're an Air Canada employee you have nothing to preach about regarding 'ethics'.

Excuse Me?

Where the hell did that come from?

No idea. Absolutely no idea. He's one of their finest. Who knew? Um, wake up? smell, um, coffee?

[whiteguy]

I dont see the big deal. Edmonton to Yellowknife is only 1 route. Westjet wont be going to Rankin Inlet or any of the other places served by the Northern carriers. Doesnt it make sense to service Yellowknife so people can check in and go anywhere Westjet flies. Im sure a lot of the people on that flight are connecting and going to other places. I hope Westjet services Whitehorse too sometime.

I think the point is that WS won't be going to Rankin or anywhere else. 5T makes it money on the YZF to YEG route to help make up what it loses doing the nothern flying.

[CanadaEH]

5T makes it money on the YZF to YEG route to help make up what it loses doing the nothern flying.

That's a stupid strategy if the airline subsidizes its entire operation on one route.

[whiteguy]

5T makes it money on the YZF to YEG route to help make up what it loses doing the nothern flying.

That's a stupid strategy if the airline subsidizes its entire operation on one route.

I didn't say it was stupid or smart, just pointing out the part that he may not understand why people are unhappy with the way WS operates.

[Jastapilot]

If you're an Air Canada employee you have nothing to preach about regarding 'ethics'.

Excuse Me?

Where the hell did that come from?

No idea. Absolutely no idea. He's one of their finest. Who knew? Um, wake up? smell, um, coffee?

Back for more?

[KAG]

you get the idea...what was this thread about again...

[tonysoprano]

KAG, my sincere apology for taking part in the stupidity. I began the thread simply to point out that some good reporting was done by a real airline magazine which doesn't use too many adjectives and little opinion using only the facts about AC's troubled times. It also offered some stuff that had not been reported by our national papers. I should have known better. Inevitably, as is the customary thing to do these days a couple of your colleagues decided to piss in my cereal once again and here we are. Three pages of stupidity. No I wouldn't expect anything different, after all apparently they call it "opinion" and so I feel obliged to respond with my own opinion as well which just makes things worse. What I can't understand is the constant need to kick someone when they are down and calling it "opinion" and "fact". The need to constantly state and repeat and restate what has been in the news for months and see only one side of a sad story and calling it "opinion". I apologize for giving in to the stupidity and taking part in it. Sadly, we just can't seem to find any light at the end of this tunnel. It is what it is. It's Canadi>n and AC of the 1980s/90s all over again, but without comparable merit.