Cabotage?! ....

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Localizer
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Cabotage?! ....

Post by Localizer »

U.S. Department of Transportation Reverses Bush-Era Decision on Cabotage
ALPA scores advocacy hat trick, protects your flying
August 12, 2009



After months of ALPA’s efforts in lobbying and educating U.S. regulators about the negative effect of cabotage, the Department of Transportation on Monday reversed a decision made last year by the Bush administration that allowed a series of charter flights by Air Canada to provide transportation for the National Hockey League’s Boston Bruins during the 2008–2009 season. That decision opened the door to additional contracts the carrier has secured since with the Milwaukee Bucks and the St. Louis Blues.

“When it comes to fighting cabotage, ALPA scored a hat trick with this DOT decision,” said Capt. Paul Rice, ALPA’s first vice president. “After basically getting stonewalled by the Bush administration, we kept in the game by engaging the new administration on this issue, and working with the AFL-CIO and the TTD, as well as the major U.S. airline trade associations—ATA and NACA—to put a stop to this blatant violation of the U.S. code.”

The department’s investigation into this matter found that Air Canada carried cabotage traffic on these charter operations, concluding that in light of “the inherently variable nature of a sports team’s personnel during a season, there appears to be no practical means to ensure that there would not be carriage of U.S. domestic-only traffic during any season-long contract.” The letter, which DOT sent to Air Canada’s regulatory lawyer on Monday, went on to state: “We do not see any way in which Air Canada can continue to market and operate season-long charter contracts in the future for sports teams,” and advises the carrier “to take steps to cancel any such current contracts.”

ALPA began to work on overturning DOT’s decision to permit Air Canada to carry the Bruins immediately after the department issued it last year. ALPA then teamed up with industry partners to build the argument for the DOT that the charter flights—which at one point included 18 consecutive segments between U.S. cities over a two month period—directly violated U.S. Code Title 49. The Association also engaged congressmen, including Rep. James Oberstar (D-Minn.), who urged the DOT to revisit its decision on this matter.

“ALPA brought it to the Obama administration’s attention, and the DOT started an investigation,” Rice said. “While the investigation is still under way, this letter proves that we were right. It shows how your union protects your flying and works to reverse bad decisions that could set devastating precedents for undermining laws that every country and every airline should adhere to and respect.”

:roll:
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tonysoprano
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Re: Cabotage?! ....

Post by tonysoprano »

“ALPA brought it to the Obama administration’s attention, and the DOT started an investigation,” Rice said. “While the investigation is still under way, this letter proves that we were right. It shows how your union protects your flying and works to reverse bad decisions that could set devastating precedents for undermining laws that every country and every airline should adhere to and respect.”
I wonder if ALPA would have done this if AC was represented by ALPA. Anyway, I actually was wondering how we were getting away with this but sure didn't think it required ALPA to get involved.
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Re: Cabotage?! ....

Post by squawk 7600 »

a hint of irony (but not really) since ALPA represents Air Canada Jazz pilots.
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Re: Cabotage?! ....

Post by Flying Low »

Isn't ALPA the biggest representative of airline Pilots in the US? Not surprising they are protecting their "turf".
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Re: Cabotage?! ....

Post by RFN »

For what it's worth, I would doubt very much that any of the Jazz guys, myself included, support our union going after our biggest customer like this.
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Re: Cabotage?! ....

Post by yyz monkey »

Guess that posting for a ramp lead to travel with the team will be coming down shortly.
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Re: Cabotage?! ....

Post by teacher »

I'm sure we'd complain too if an American airline was doing point to point within Canada.
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Re: Cabotage?! ....

Post by Jaques Strappe »

teacher wrote:I'm sure we'd complain too if an American airline was doing point to point within Canada.

Absolutely. ACPA has apparently agreed to support the company with lobbying in Ottawa. This does not exactly sit well with me because ALPA is only trying to protect the flying within it's borders and rightfully so IMO. I would rather see a unified stand by pilots on both sides of the border against foreign airlines flying point to point.
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Re: Cabotage?! ....

Post by yyz monkey »

teacher wrote:I'm sure we'd complain too if an American airline was doing point to point within Canada.
Scheduled, yes. Charter ops for sports teams, not so much.
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Re: Cabotage?! ....

Post by teacher »

The same rules still apply. Charter or Sched. You wouldn't want US charter companies coming up here doing our oil patch work I'm sure.
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Re: Cabotage?! ....

Post by yyz monkey »

teacher wrote:The same rules still apply. Charter or Sched. You wouldn't want US charter companies coming up here doing our oil patch work I'm sure.
If a private business wants to hire a firm outside its country to run charter flights because that firm made the best/cheapest/whatever reason have you offer, than why should a government get in the way?
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Re: Cabotage?! ....

Post by disco »

If a private business wants to hire a firm outside its country to run charter flights because that firm made the best/cheapest/whatever reason have you offer, than why should a government get in the way?[/quote]

:shock:

Because of the vast difference in economies, currencies and safety and work standards? Do I understand that you feel that if a Chinese, Turkmenistanian, Dogcrapistan or Russian airline could show up with 18 duty hour crews and offer flights dirt cheap since their crews are earning $73 dollars a month, that should be ok here? We would all be put out of work by the lowest bidders who pay bags of rice or nothing and have no safety standards. Governments have a duty to help us protect our work, wage standards and way of life. They are our elected representatives...we the taxpayers pay them to "get in the way"!
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Re: Cabotage?! ....

Post by yyz monkey »

disco wrote:Because of the vast difference in economies, currencies and safety and work standards? Do I understand that you feel that if a Chinese, Turkmenistanian, Dogcrapistan or Russian airline could show up with 18 duty hour crews and offer flights dirt cheap since their crews are earning $73 dollars a month, that should be ok here?
Yes. That is exactly what I mean. :roll:
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Re: Cabotage?! ....

Post by ZBBYLW »

I read somewhere else that the Toronto Blue Jay's use a US company to charter them selfs around. If this is the case I truly hope that they are forced to take a Canadian company starting next year. Or will Canada simply bend over backwards and take it up the ass like so many times before...
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Post by SMP »

The problem with JETZ was a Canadian airline operating on USA point to point flights. The Jays are all transborder flights, unless the Expos are making a comeback...
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Last edited by SMP on Sun Aug 16, 2009 8:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by tripleseven »

The difference is that the Blue Jays don't do any point to point in Canada.

**The above post wasn't there when I posted this, honest.
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Re: Cabotage?! ....

Post by ZBBYLW »

I understand that argument, however when say the Vancouver Canucks fly from San Jose, Denver, Dallas, St. Louis, New York then Montreal would that not be Cabotage as well? Sure the Canucks at some point fly Vancouver, Calgary, Edmonton back home but they also fly direct non-stop US to US flights. So where do we draw the line? Just because the team "at some point during the season" fly's within Canada they should be allowed to use AC Jetz? The Raptors (similar to the Blue Jay's) will never have a domestic flight within our borders, however they use Jetz.

How about when U2 charted Jetz for their Vertigo tour. Many of those flights would have been US-US flights. They were allowed to use Jetz. What would happen if a US city where to get a CFL team (hypothetically speaking) and where to charter Jetz to do their flying? All points would be either Can-Can or US-Can, Can-US I think the ALPA would put up a stink for that too...
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Re: Cabotage?! ....

Post by whiteguy »

ZBBYLW wrote:I understand that argument, however when say the Vancouver Canucks fly from San Jose, Denver, Dallas, St. Louis, New York then Montreal would that not be Cabotage as well? Sure the Canucks at some point fly Vancouver, Calgary, Edmonton back home but they also fly direct non-stop US to US flights. So where do we draw the line? Just because the team "at some point during the season" fly's within Canada they should be allowed to use AC Jetz? The Raptors (similar to the Blue Jay's) will never have a domestic flight within our borders, however they use Jetz.

How about when U2 charted Jetz for their Vertigo tour. Many of those flights would have been US-US flights. They were allowed to use Jetz. What would happen if a US city where to get a CFL team (hypothetically speaking) and where to charter Jetz to do their flying? All points would be either Can-Can or US-Can, Can-US I think the ALPA would put up a stink for that too...
The point is, none of the flights you talked about carried US passengers! The problem is when they fly the Bruins from BOS to LAX. It would be the same as Miami Air flying the Habs from YUL-YYC.
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Re: Cabotage?! ....

Post by Donald »

When the ice road had a bad year and one diamond mine in particualr needed some freight in a hurry, notice how quick a russian company was given approval to operate in Canada.

Granted some of that freight was very specialized and needed an MI-26 to be moved, but the stuff that dirty old antonov was hauling around? Not so much...
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Post by whiteguy »

Donald wrote:When the ice road had a bad year and one diamond mine in particualr needed some freight in a hurry, notice how quick a russian company was given approval to operate in Canada.

Granted some of that freight was very specialized and needed an MI-26 to be moved, but the stuff that dirty old antonov was hauling around? Not so much...
Which company in Canada had a chopper big enough to do the work? Not really the same.
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