* AvCanada's Home Page * Photo Gallery * Directory * Topsites *Weather *Enter Chat * Media Kit
It is currently Sat May 25, 2013 8:08 am

View unanswered posts | View active topics




Board index » TOP AVIATION FORUMS » ATS Question Forum

All times are UTC [ DST ]

Who is chatting
Who is chatting
Enter Chat




Post new topic Reply to topic  Page 2 of 2
  [ 42 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2
  Print view Previous topic | Next topic 
Author Message
Jerricho
PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2009 4:34 am 
Offline
Rank 7
Rank 7
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2005 12:32 am
Posts: 544
Location: Winterpeg, Manitioba
At least somebody appreciates us.

(Thanks SAR_YYQ)


Top
 Profile  
 
ywgflyboy
PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2009 12:48 pm 
Offline
Rank 6
Rank 6

Joined: Wed Mar 18, 2009 3:48 pm
Posts: 440
Most of the restrictions for Winnipeg are for VFR but at some times it can be anything that isn't scheduled. If you plan on doing work in the WInnipeg TCA, it is always worth a call to the shift manager to see if their is any time available to get in. When I do my IFR work we always pre-arrange with them so that we are not interfering with the rush hour traffic coming into the area.

If you read the actual NOTAM carefully it will say without prior permission. Pick up the phone and ask, hey does any time work for you.

Exceptions to this of are course the long weekend :P I am not speculating or anything but last weekend we got a call and 3 controllers just happened to not be at work.

If all else fails, red line the plane out 30 miles then do what you want.


Top
 Profile  
 
Jerricho
PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2009 3:49 pm 
Offline
Rank 7
Rank 7
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2005 12:32 am
Posts: 544
Location: Winterpeg, Manitioba
The PPR for training slots is certainly working, and a big thank you to those folk who have moved their slots to smooth things out during the day. Unfortunately, there have been occasions where slots have been book for holds/approaches where the aircraft doesn't turn up, and we've received no notification to cancel. That's a slot somebody else could have used, or freed up a time that was more beneficial to somebody who was asked to move to another time.

Can I also give a friendly reminder that simply calling/faxing the CSM at the ACC IS NOT the same as filing a flight plan. Confusion has occurred a few times where a trainer has pitched up telling us they have approval, yet hasn't filed a flight plan and expecting IFR service and alerting.


Top
 Profile  
 
Easy Flyer
PostPosted: Sat Aug 08, 2009 8:03 pm 
Offline
Rank 1
Rank 1
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jul 24, 2009 6:05 pm
Posts: 22
arictaylor wrote:
Exceptions to this of are course the long weekend :P I am not speculating or anything but last weekend we got a call and 3 controllers just happened to not be at work.


I keep hearing this over and over from both controllers and pilots. Obviously the system for sick days is being abused by some of these bad apples. How do we get the ball rolling to investigate this situation? Service is suffering because of it.


Top
 Profile  
 
invertedattitude
PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 5:53 pm 
Offline
Rank 10
Rank 10
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2004 9:12 pm
Posts: 2339
Easy Flyer wrote:
arictaylor wrote:
Exceptions to this of are course the long weekend :P I am not speculating or anything but last weekend we got a call and 3 controllers just happened to not be at work.


I keep hearing this over and over from both controllers and pilots. Obviously the system for sick days is being abused by some of these bad apples. How do we get the ball rolling to investigate this situation? Service is suffering because of it.

You want to start an investigation into controllers sick calls?


Top
 Profile  
 
ywgflyboy
PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2009 1:44 pm 
Offline
Rank 6
Rank 6

Joined: Wed Mar 18, 2009 3:48 pm
Posts: 440
invertedattitude wrote:
Easy Flyer wrote:
arictaylor wrote:
Exceptions to this of are course the long weekend :P I am not speculating or anything but last weekend we got a call and 3 controllers just happened to not be at work.


I keep hearing this over and over from both controllers and pilots. Obviously the system for sick days is being abused by some of these bad apples. How do we get the ball rolling to investigate this situation? Service is suffering because of it.

You want to start an investigation into controllers sick calls?



No. Just their tee times :P

In all seriousness though. Their may be problems within the system like staff shortage but I feel the following

1) Why are senior controllers from within the same center deciding if new candidates meet the standards or not. I have heard from numerous inside people this is a serious problem because they LIKE their overtime and having more staff takes away from that. Again, I have no reference to that statement, it just has made its may through ears in the last little bit.

As someone who is always asking, why the F am I paying this much for a map etc! Then I think about the millions in OT some people are getting in the industry. OT is dangerous to work performance and should be limited to a max per month. I love making OT myself but it is stupid from a rested mind point of view, and financial point of view.
2) They save most of our asses a few times in our career so lets trust them when they say they are too busy and to reconsider your flight path/altitude.


Top
 Profile  
 
kevenv
PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2009 5:08 pm 
Offline
Rank 6
Rank 6

Joined: Thu Apr 12, 2007 2:19 pm
Posts: 425
arictaylor wrote:
Why are senior controllers from within the same center deciding if new candidates meet the standards or not. I have heard from numerous inside people this is a serious problem because they LIKE their overtime and having more staff takes away from that. Again, I have no reference to that statement, it just has made its may through ears in the last little bit.


Why are senior pilots within the same airline deciding whether or not new hires meet the standard? I have heard (no reference of course) that they want to protect their jobs because they like them! Perhaps junior controllers from another center should be the ones to decide who is qualified to work?

arictaylor wrote:
As someone who is always asking, why the F am I paying this much for a map etc! Then I think about the millions in OT some people are getting in the industry. OT is dangerous to work performance and should be limited to a max per month. I love making OT myself but it is stupid from a rested mind point of view, and financial point of view.


We are federally limited to a maximum number of hours every 8 weeks. This includes regular hours and overtime. You could love all overtime you want, you are not allowed to exceed the total hours. If we just refused to work any overtime at all, there would be even more restrictions for people to complain about.


Top
 Profile  
 
ywgflyboy
PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2009 8:32 pm 
Offline
Rank 6
Rank 6

Joined: Wed Mar 18, 2009 3:48 pm
Posts: 440
Defend the situation as you wish but when staff from the inside speak of these problems it is time to address the issue. Same with pilots.


Top
 Profile  
 
kevenv
PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2009 8:39 pm 
Offline
Rank 6
Rank 6

Joined: Thu Apr 12, 2007 2:19 pm
Posts: 425
arictaylor wrote:
Defend the situation as you wish but when staff from the inside speak of these problems it is time to address the issue. Same with pilots.


Defend it as I wish? What did you expect? You posted that there should be a limit on overtime, I posted that there is. A simple thanks for the correct info would have sufficed.

On the issue of perceived problems, do you honestly believe that the only course of action open to anonymous "inside" workers is to tell anonymous outsiders and have them complain here? Why don't you stand up and take the info to someone who can do something about it if a problem exists?


Top
 Profile  
 
ywgflyboy
PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2009 9:41 pm 
Offline
Rank 6
Rank 6

Joined: Wed Mar 18, 2009 3:48 pm
Posts: 440
TCA's exists in their locations for a reason. There is higher traffic and a need for control. Cramming planes under the floor of the airspace is making things more dangerous. Someone is not doing their job if this is the way things are going. Period.


Top
 Profile  
 
Braun
PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2009 11:09 pm 
Offline
Rank 6
Rank 6

Joined: Fri Mar 24, 2006 7:32 am
Posts: 414
?


Top
 Profile  
 
Jerricho
PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 2:58 am 
Offline
Rank 7
Rank 7
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2005 12:32 am
Posts: 544
Location: Winterpeg, Manitioba
....


Last edited by Jerricho on Thu Mar 11, 2010 1:47 am, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
ywgflyboy
PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 7:32 pm 
Offline
Rank 6
Rank 6

Joined: Wed Mar 18, 2009 3:48 pm
Posts: 440
Sure lets argue a little bit more and bash heads because then the problem will be addressed without question. Right?

See my second post below. I don't give a shi+ why they are restricting traffic, I am saying start working on a solution. It is becoming unsafe.

arictaylor wrote:
TCA's exists in their locations for a reason. There is higher traffic and a need for control. Cramming planes under the floor of the airspace is making things more dangerous. Someone is not doing their job if this is the way things are going. Period.


Top
 Profile  
 
Jerricho
PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 10:30 pm 
Offline
Rank 7
Rank 7
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2005 12:32 am
Posts: 544
Location: Winterpeg, Manitioba
Stand by sunshine.

You level an accusation against Air Trafficers based on pure rumour and conjecture which is refuted............and you view that as arguing? Never let the facts stand in the way of a good story eh?

As to working towards a solution, don't be so damn insulting. If you think for one second anyone is sitting back enjoying the situation, you need your head read.


Top
 Profile  
 
sakism
PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 6:00 pm 
Offline
Rank 5
Rank 5

Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:32 pm
Posts: 398
Jerricho wrote:
As to working towards a solution, don't be so damn insulting. If you think for one second anyone is sitting back enjoying the situation, you need your head read.


It may not be being enjoyed, but its hard to see that it is being worked on. As said before this is the third summer in a row that these restrictions have been in place.

What about all the NavCan "Level of Service" reviews I've seen since then? The ones that end up closing Radios, decommissioning NavAids, etc. Why have I not seen in there that YWG TCA suffers staff shortages during summer months and that in order to solve this:

A - people from decommissioned Radio sites are being retrained for IFR work. They must be going somewhere.
B - incentive programs are being offered to people for them to temporarily relocate to YWG to help cover shortages during these months
c - etc, etc, etc

I have no idea if those are workable ideas, and they are not intended to be such. The point that we are all trying to make is that one summer is understandable, two summers is acceptable, three summers is disgraceful.

If you showed up in January for your flight to Mexico and were told that the flight would not be going for about three months because of pilots with holidays, how would you feel? If your garbage was not collected for the entire summer? If the snow wasn't plowed all March? And how would you feel when this happened three years in a row?


Top
 Profile  
 
grimey
PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 6:13 pm 
Offline
Rank 10
Rank 10
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 9:01 am
Posts: 2851
Location: somewhere drunk
sakism wrote:
A - people from decommissioned Radio sites are being retrained for IFR work. They must be going somewhere.


They entered training less than a year ago, have no significant advantage over other people to qualify, and are still in training. I don't know if any have even hit the floor yet.

Quote:
B - incentive programs are being offered to people for them to temporarily relocate to YWG to help cover shortages during these months


Short term temporary relocations wouldn't do anything. The people would still take months to qualify at a new position, during which time a qualified controller would have to be over their shoulder. And they'd have to come from somewhere, I don't know of any ACCs that are overstaffed.


Top
 Profile  
 
sakism
PostPosted: Sun Aug 23, 2009 6:17 pm 
Offline
Rank 5
Rank 5

Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:32 pm
Posts: 398
As I said, those were not meant to be workable ideas as I don't know the inner workings of the system.

There are people who do know the system, however, and three years should be more than enough time for them to come up with some workable solution.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  Page 2 of 2
  [ 42 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2


Board index » TOP AVIATION FORUMS » ATS Question Forum

All times are UTC [ DST ]

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Driving Comet and 4 guests

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group

Advertisements by Advertisement Management
 
For questions/comments please send them to
webmaster@avcanada.ca

AvCanada Topsites List
AVIATION TOP 100 - www.avitop.com Avitop.com
While the administrators and moderators of this  forum will attempt to remove or edit any generally objectionable material as  quickly as possible, it is impossible to review every message. If you feel a  topic or post is inappropriate email us at support@avcanada.ca .  By reading these forums you acknowledge that  all posts made to these forums express the views and opinions of the author and  not the administrators, moderators or webmaster (except for posts by these  people) and hence will not be held liable. This website is not responsible or liable in any way for any false or misleading messages or job ads placed at our site.   

Use AvCanada's information at your own risk!

We reserve the right to remove any messages that we deem unacceptable.
  When you post a message, your IP is logged and may be provided to concerned parties where unethical or illegal  behavior is apparent. All rights reserved.