IATRA VAILIDITY ?

[tunacan]

I wrote my IATRA in 2007 and then got a PPC on a Be 20 in 2008. Does anyone if that means my IATRA will expire in 2009 or because of the PPC it is valid indefinitely ?

Thank you for your comments

[Louis]

Did TC send you a licence where you can read BE20 below the "All non high performance..." part? or if you have the booklet the line "Type: BE20" below the SMEL (or or whatever you may happen to have) line?

If so: congratulations, you're the holder of a type rating, which does validate your IATRA exam. A PPC in itself does not. A PPC is something done in commercial, and CARs 604 operations only, though a PPC also provides you with the type rating as appropriate. You could be a private pilot flying a high performance airplane, have the type rating, but no PPC.

I mixed up. As written below by others, the type rating has to be on an aircraft required to be two-crew by its certification.

[airbournesailor]

Your type rating (IATRA) will remain valid with a PPC ONLY IF the aircraft is certified to fly 2 crew. That does not mean the company SOP's require 2 crew but the certification of the A/C does. I could be wrong, but I don't think the KA 200 does. There is a list of all A/C types and their certification onTransport site somewhere.

[Grey_Wolf]

There is a list of all A/C types and their certification onTransport site somewhere.

http://www.tc.gc.ca/civilaviation/gener ... rcraft.htm

[alti2d]

I believe this is the chart, I could be wrong, and likely have been, but only in the past.

http://www.tc.gc.ca/civilaviation/regse ... t42102.htm

[altiplano]

BE20 on your license doesn't cut it. Type rating or not your IATRA will expire.

[Spokes]

From CARs 421.40 (3) Individual Type Rating Requirements

(a) Aeroplane - Two Crew

(i) Knowledge

An applicant for an individual aircraft type rating for aeroplanes with a minimum flight crew requirement of at least two pilots shall have completed a program of ground school instruction and flight training on the aeroplane type, and
(amended 2006/12/14; previous version)

Private Pilot Licence - Aeroplane or Commercial Pilot Licence-Aeroplane

(A) in the case of the holder of a Private Pilot Licence-Aeroplane or Commercial Pilot Licence-Aeroplane, within the 24 months preceding the application for the first endorsement of the two crew rating, an applicant shall have obtained a minimum score of 70 percent (70%) on the Type Rating-Aeroplane (IATRA) written examination;

This sounds to me like your IATRA does not expire if you have done a type rateing within the previous 24 months.

http://www.tc.gc.ca/civilaviation/regse ... htm#421_40

edited to add link

[altiplano]

-

[Pugster]

I know this one first hand and 100%...so this is - the REAL ANSWER. IE: It happened to me back in the day, on exactly the same aircraft, with a PPC type rated on my licence.

NO.

Because the BE20, in some variations, can be flown single pilot, it does not count. Your IATRA or ATPL exams will expire after 2 years. As dumb as it sounds, it doesn't matter that the BE20 is typically flown 2 crew, or if you were 2 crew, etc. It only matters that somebody out there can fly a BE20 single pilot (VFR even) if they want to. If that's true (which it is for the BE20) than no dice.

Dumb eh?

[Check Pilot]

Be 20 isn't an aircraft that requires 2 pilots according to the Type Certificate. Some Beech 200's might be a high performance aircraft that need a type rating on your Licence, but that still doesn't mean it is a 2 pilot aircraft by Type Certificate.

A PPC on a Be20 - i.e. - Beech 200 does not fall under the requirements - with or without a type rating will not meet the requirements to keep the IATRA 2 year requirement valid. Like everyone else that writes exams too early, you can now panic because the time is or is about to run out and the exam will have to be written before you can qualify for a true 2 pilot aeroplane. If you did not apply for a qualifying type rating within the previous 2 years, you are out of luck.

In simple terms, you have to the first day of the 25th month to get a qualifying type rating on your Licence or the exam results are trashed. Of course, if you now have the time it would likely be a different situation and take a stab at the ATPL exams instead of the IATRA.

If you aren't flying that much just sit it out and wait for the "deferred opportunities" to show up and then try the exams again. Don't be in such a big rush to make yourself look good. That'll come along in due time.

[Check Pilot]

Sorry Pugster, thanks, you beat me to it.

[Pugster]

Sorry Pugster, thanks, you beat me to it.

No problemo!

[Check Pilot]

Regarding the exam re-write panic -

In my time with TC we had a couple of guys that would wait until the last minute to renew an Instrument Rating. These guys would wait until just the 2 year expiry of their rating was coming due and then request a renewal check ride.

One guy used to expire on January 1st so he would always schedule a check ride on December 31st. I used to go out on New years Eve for this guys renewal - sometimes he'd want it at 6 or 7 at night. I didn't care about that but it finally bit him because the aircraft he wanted to use froze up in the -35C temps that night. There was nobody else around to rent an aircraft for him so his time ran out at midnight and he had to write the exams again if he wanted to renew his rating. He pleaded with me to extend the requirement for another month. I refused. He tried to call my boss to appeal. My boss was out that night imbibing with a bunch of other folks and it was before the days of cell phones so he wasn't available to reverse my outlandish, outrageous and mean decision.

I know it was a heartless decision on my part. I thought that the rules were being presented to me regarding the legal renewal requirements so it seemed to me that the rules should be followed as far as the situation developed as well. In the ultimate end, my only real concern was for his innocent passengers and anybody else out in the airspace in IMC that trusted that folks were going to follow the basic rules when see and be seen is not available in crappy visibility..

Mean, heartless, cruel, bureaucratic, - in the long run, it's the way it was. I probably could have done something different. But I didn't.

Later in January the candidate came in to re-write the INRAT and unfortunately scored 37%.

He never tried again. I probably did wrong for that individual's ego that night. Should he have been flying IFR again? I wonder.

[Spokes]

This sounds to me like your IATRA does not expire if you have done a type rateing within the previous 24 months.

???

Maybe you just have your wording backwards... or maybe I just can't read right tonight. Anyway - the key is two crew requirement. I BE20 is a single pilot aircraft. If your type rating was on a BE02 you'd be good - certified two pilot

An applicant for an individual aircraft type rating for aeroplanes with a minimum flight crew requirement of at least two pilots...

...within the 24 months preceding the application for the first endorsement of the two crew rating

Ok, I think I see where your comming from. I missed this subtle difference. Nothing like a nice simple system.

[airbournesailor]

With regards to not writing the IATRA because it will expire in 24 months, I'd say study and write it. You'll learn alot of stuff (or at least I did) that you should know that's not in the CPL, especially duty times, free from duty times etc for different operations. The exam is not that hard and is only $30 I think. Better to have it if something comes up unexpectant, saw guys put it off and missed oportunities for upgrades because they had no IATRA!!! I had to write it the second time because mine expired and only studied for a night or 2 and done well. Not a big deal 2nd time around!

Good Luck!!

[AV8R]

24 months unless you acquire a type rating with a minimum of two crew inside of this period. IE BE02, DHC8 etc
Then the IATRA is good for life.

[sakism]

Regarding the exam re-write panic -

In my time with TC we had a couple of guys that would wait until the last minute to renew an Instrument Rating. These guys would wait until just the 2 year expiry of their rating was coming due and then request a renewal check ride.

One guy used to expire on January 1st so he would always schedule a check ride on December 31st. I used to go out on New years Eve for this guys renewal - sometimes he'd want it at 6 or 7 at night. I didn't care about that but it finally bit him because the aircraft he wanted to use froze up in the -35C temps that night. There was nobody else around to rent an aircraft for him so his time ran out at midnight and he had to write the exams again if he wanted to renew his rating. He pleaded with me to extend the requirement for another month. I refused. He tried to call my boss to appeal. My boss was out that night imbibing with a bunch of other folks and it was before the days of cell phones so he wasn't available to reverse my outlandish, outrageous and mean decision.

I know it was a heartless decision on my part. I thought that the rules were being presented to me regarding the legal renewal requirements so it seemed to me that the rules should be followed as far as the situation developed as well. In the ultimate end, my only real concern was for his innocent passengers and anybody else out in the airspace in IMC that trusted that folks were going to follow the basic rules when see and be seen is not available in crappy visibility..

Mean, heartless, cruel, bureaucratic, - in the long run, it's the way it was. I probably could have done something different. But I didn't.

Later in January the candidate came in to re-write the INRAT and unfortunately scored 37%.

He never tried again. I probably did wrong for that individual's ego that night. Should he have been flying IFR again? I wonder.

HUH?

Wouldn't it have been better to tell the poor guy that he didn't have to rewrite the INRAT until his IFR has been expired for two years?