http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8323711.stm
Pilot dies saving nine,RIP
Caribean plane ditching
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sky's the limit
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Re: Caribean plane ditching
Nine passengers? Plus a pilot=ten? What have they got? 250 HP per side? A pair of Aztec engines? Fixed gear. About 2000 pounds of persons, plus fuel and what have you? Can't imagine having to ditch one of those things. A little lucky anybody got out. Not good news. Thoughts are with his friends and family.
D
D
Re: Caribean plane ditching
Ah the BN-2 surely sad to hear, my condolances! The islander has five bench seats two a seat, and most models have 260 a side. Can haul approx 2400lbs.
The more you know the more trouble you can get in!
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Chaxterium
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Re: Caribean plane ditching
I worked with the pilot down in the Caribbean. Fantastic guy and a fantastic pilot. This is terribly sad.
He will be missed.
He will be missed.
Re: Caribean plane ditching
So the Islander is basically a single-engine aircraft? I flew one years ago but I thought it would be ok at sea level on one. I suppose temperature and a load of baggage would make that worse. I have a feeling the one I flew was 300/side? I always wondered how you would ditch one with the gear dangling like that.
Sad accident - my condolences to anyone who knew him.
Sad accident - my condolences to anyone who knew him.
"What's it doing now?"
"Fly low and slow and throttle back in the turns."
"Fly low and slow and throttle back in the turns."
Re: Caribean plane ditching
Temps were +30 at the time...with 9 pax on board, the odds are unfortunately quite high that they were overweight...at the very least the numbers were probably fudged...average adult weight in the caribbean is pathetically low for flight planning purposes.
A sad reminder that even though that Islander or Twin Otter might fly just fine right at gross (or a smidgeon above gross) it won't be as forgiving on one engine. Stay safe folks and don't let dispatch/management/pax push you into putting that extra pax or bag on board just to get the job done.
A sad reminder that even though that Islander or Twin Otter might fly just fine right at gross (or a smidgeon above gross) it won't be as forgiving on one engine. Stay safe folks and don't let dispatch/management/pax push you into putting that extra pax or bag on board just to get the job done.
Re: Caribean plane ditching
Wise words.HavaJava wrote:Temps were +30 at the time...with 9 pax on board, the odds are unfortunately quite high that they were overweight...at the very least the numbers were probably fudged...average adult weight in the caribbean is pathetically low for flight planning purposes.
A sad reminder that even though that Islander or Twin Otter might fly just fine right at gross (or a smidgeon above gross) it won't be as forgiving on one engine. Stay safe folks and don't let dispatch/management/pax push you into putting that extra pax or bag on board just to get the job done.
Re: Caribean plane ditching
Something to think about. A few years ago I put in some time on a BN-2 in the Caribbean. The was an interconnect switch with respect to the pilots door. The left engine couldn't be started if the door wasn't closed and latched. Could this switch have impeded the pilots escape. The passenger in the right seat would have to climb over the seat back to use a rear exit or if the front door did open, go across the pilot. Can't remember if the right window is an exit.
Re: Caribean plane ditching
Yeah that interconnect switch is a real pain sometimes. Doesn't it also lock the door while the left mags are on as well to prevent accidental opening with engine running?
The more you know the more trouble you can get in!
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ScudRunner
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Re: Caribean plane ditching
Far as I know there was just a good alarm on the door connected to the Mags on the #1 Engine.
Basically if you tried to open the driver side door with the Mags on it would let out quiet the Squeal, this is the only thing that every scared me with the Islander. Now I will admit this particular BN2 was well used (STL can attest to this) I don't think it would stop a guy from starting the engine with this switch disabled or prevent the door from actually opening with the mags on. Don't think I ever tried it and I recall something about the door switch being broken for awhile.
As for flying single engine in the BN2, of my 1100 hours in the Islander about 4 hours of that is logged under column 2 in the logbook. I will say that being fairly light it definitely was a bit of chore to maintain altitude at first and wasn't going all that fast but once you found the sweet spot and all trimmed out she would happily sit there with one engine screaming away. As for altitude I took what I could get up in the Yukon.
Sad Deal, glad at least their where survivors.
Basically if you tried to open the driver side door with the Mags on it would let out quiet the Squeal, this is the only thing that every scared me with the Islander. Now I will admit this particular BN2 was well used (STL can attest to this) I don't think it would stop a guy from starting the engine with this switch disabled or prevent the door from actually opening with the mags on. Don't think I ever tried it and I recall something about the door switch being broken for awhile.
As for flying single engine in the BN2, of my 1100 hours in the Islander about 4 hours of that is logged under column 2 in the logbook. I will say that being fairly light it definitely was a bit of chore to maintain altitude at first and wasn't going all that fast but once you found the sweet spot and all trimmed out she would happily sit there with one engine screaming away. As for altitude I took what I could get up in the Yukon.
Sad Deal, glad at least their where survivors.
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sky's the limit
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Re: Caribean plane ditching
2R wrote:What is the shoulder hareness like ?
Lousy, car style in the one .. and I flew.
stl
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2.5milefinal
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Re: Caribean plane ditching
wow
This thing sounds like a beauty piece of machinery.
This thing sounds like a beauty piece of machinery.
Opinions cant be proven false.
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sky's the limit
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Re: Caribean plane ditching
2.5milefinal wrote:wow
This thing sounds like a beauty piece of machinery.
It actually is.
I always found it a great machine for what we used it for - semi off strip work - and it was a joy to fly. Just a few things I would have changed. That said, when one quit at rotation, it took good care of me.
stl
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2.5milefinal
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Re: Caribean plane ditching
okay
I LL have to take your word for it. Closest I ever got to one is watching it taxi by me on the ramp.
I LL have to take your word for it. Closest I ever got to one is watching it taxi by me on the ramp.
Opinions cant be proven false.
Re: Caribean plane ditching
I'm not too familiar with PJ-SUN other than knowing it was Divi Divi's and that it had the 4 bladed composite props.
Some BN2's however do have a door lock plunger which is connected to the left mags, just like the horn is. In a lot of cases the plunger has stopped working and is not repaired, or is purposely disconnected. There is a little 'override' lever just aft of the door entrance that you can move if the plunger fails. They are just as likely to get stuck locked as they are open, and that is why most operators disconnect them.
That all being said, if the media reports are to be believed (which is rare) it doesn't appear to be a factor. Several agencies are reporting that the pilot was knocked unconscious, and 'pinned' between the seat and instrument panel. Apparently some of the passengers tried to get him out but the aircraft was sinking to fast. There are also news reports about the pilot complaining to his family that the operator was routinely flying overweight. Keep in mind however, that although some,all, or none of this might be true, news reporters are generally as reliable as crackheads.
Regarding the seat belts, there are a few different types, none of them particularly good. A three point inertial reel, or a regular waste belt with the quick attach shoulder belt, which some pilots have been known to leave unattached. I have no idea what kind was on PJ-SUN.
It's certainly sad to hear about this accident, and as it was something I used to do, it hits close to home. The BN2 has taken me into, and out of, more jeopardizing situations than I care to remember. I've known two pilots who've ditched BN2's and survived, and I generally took comfort in the fact that the slow speed made it very survivable, but perhaps that comfort may have been misplaced.
My sincere condolence go out to the friends and family of the pilot.
Some BN2's however do have a door lock plunger which is connected to the left mags, just like the horn is. In a lot of cases the plunger has stopped working and is not repaired, or is purposely disconnected. There is a little 'override' lever just aft of the door entrance that you can move if the plunger fails. They are just as likely to get stuck locked as they are open, and that is why most operators disconnect them.
That all being said, if the media reports are to be believed (which is rare) it doesn't appear to be a factor. Several agencies are reporting that the pilot was knocked unconscious, and 'pinned' between the seat and instrument panel. Apparently some of the passengers tried to get him out but the aircraft was sinking to fast. There are also news reports about the pilot complaining to his family that the operator was routinely flying overweight. Keep in mind however, that although some,all, or none of this might be true, news reporters are generally as reliable as crackheads.
Regarding the seat belts, there are a few different types, none of them particularly good. A three point inertial reel, or a regular waste belt with the quick attach shoulder belt, which some pilots have been known to leave unattached. I have no idea what kind was on PJ-SUN.
It's certainly sad to hear about this accident, and as it was something I used to do, it hits close to home. The BN2 has taken me into, and out of, more jeopardizing situations than I care to remember. I've known two pilots who've ditched BN2's and survived, and I generally took comfort in the fact that the slow speed made it very survivable, but perhaps that comfort may have been misplaced.
My sincere condolence go out to the friends and family of the pilot.
