O.K. 5X5 :
That was a good post.
I hope you do not put me in the "old cronies sitting around the stove" catagory just reminiscing about what used to be?
I did not see you comment on something like teaching students how to lean the mixture and why.
What did you think of using carb heat to check for excessive lean, and have you been taught to do that?
I also have some problems with some of the goofy things being taught in the multi engine field that you may clear up for me.
Cat
Generalizing
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Cat Driver
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Some of you are advocating to increase the time requirements to get a certain license to make better pilots. I have a couple of problems with that.
1) The average student will pay 30-45000 dollars for the training they already do, and now you want to make them pay more to get the same license....essentially making flying a rich mans job...and then you will pay them less than what it cost to do their training as we already get paid. Whos going to want to do that? Does end your pilot surplus though.
2) From the beginning of aviaition time requirements for licenses have been increased... just ask cat driver how many hours it took for him to get a comercial license... then ask him if his skill level at the commercial then is better than todays newly minted commercial license
3) instructor experience is a key factor. Only problem is to get experience you have start with none and build from what your instructor gave you. There are very few career instructors...why, because nobody pays for the career instructor. No stability, A decent wage not likely unless you land a job at a college.
4) They are looking at changes to get the atpl, im not sure exactly what they will be but from what i remember there will be turbine time and specified 700 cars time requirements...these are only rumours.
As for PDM and Human Factors... yes it should be taught, it will be better learned through scenarios or as said before indirectly on every flight.
And you have to admit they have been taught and learned by some of the more experienced pilots. When was the last time you did a spin in ifr conditions to break out of clouds for a vfr landing...they used to do it you know...wonder why they stopped?
Not every student will do it in minimums, but does that give us the right to say you didnt do it because you required more time or because you spent 4 years to do it because you have to pay for the flying as you go, which required more review. Why dont we make it easy and say if you arent a blue eyed, blond hair val kilmer look alike then you just dont make the grade and dont bother even trying, k "ICE"?
It is up to the chief pilots and owners to make sure their pilots are up to standards for the company not for tc, if they feel you dont make the grade then they have some options. Reminds me of the safety letter where a pilot up north did his training, blew his ndb approach totally and was signed off anyways, went out on a charter and killed him and his passengers, now whose fault, the operator, the pilot or transpots lower minimums?
As they say the aviation license is a learning license, if you have stopped learning then you have maxed out on your experience and should either get out or try something new.
1) The average student will pay 30-45000 dollars for the training they already do, and now you want to make them pay more to get the same license....essentially making flying a rich mans job...and then you will pay them less than what it cost to do their training as we already get paid. Whos going to want to do that? Does end your pilot surplus though.
2) From the beginning of aviaition time requirements for licenses have been increased... just ask cat driver how many hours it took for him to get a comercial license... then ask him if his skill level at the commercial then is better than todays newly minted commercial license
3) instructor experience is a key factor. Only problem is to get experience you have start with none and build from what your instructor gave you. There are very few career instructors...why, because nobody pays for the career instructor. No stability, A decent wage not likely unless you land a job at a college.
4) They are looking at changes to get the atpl, im not sure exactly what they will be but from what i remember there will be turbine time and specified 700 cars time requirements...these are only rumours.
As for PDM and Human Factors... yes it should be taught, it will be better learned through scenarios or as said before indirectly on every flight.
And you have to admit they have been taught and learned by some of the more experienced pilots. When was the last time you did a spin in ifr conditions to break out of clouds for a vfr landing...they used to do it you know...wonder why they stopped?
Not every student will do it in minimums, but does that give us the right to say you didnt do it because you required more time or because you spent 4 years to do it because you have to pay for the flying as you go, which required more review. Why dont we make it easy and say if you arent a blue eyed, blond hair val kilmer look alike then you just dont make the grade and dont bother even trying, k "ICE"?
It is up to the chief pilots and owners to make sure their pilots are up to standards for the company not for tc, if they feel you dont make the grade then they have some options. Reminds me of the safety letter where a pilot up north did his training, blew his ndb approach totally and was signed off anyways, went out on a charter and killed him and his passengers, now whose fault, the operator, the pilot or transpots lower minimums?
As they say the aviation license is a learning license, if you have stopped learning then you have maxed out on your experience and should either get out or try something new.
Ah yes,
Forgot to mention there is some stuff that needs to be changed in the syllabus and they way and why it is taught.
I will agree TC can be stuck in theirs ways on how to teach procedures and other aspects of flying. Which also will be dependent on what inspector you are talking to.
Cat driver:
Nope never been taught to check the carb heat for lean mixture, so what am i looking for when i pull the carb ht?
i have been taught, and have taught my students on how to use the mixture and why (hopefully i am correct in the matter) biggest problem i have with this is we do not have enough practice doing it for real while training students.
Now, do i fault tc and their syllabus or my instructors for not teaching me everything in the world of aviation, can we even reasonably teach everything to a student in the time allotted to us, or can we learn off each other as we go and hope we dont kill ourselves doing it. As well, are we talking practical knowledge or book knowledge, who is right and who is wrong on a subject, for everyone who has an opinion there is sure to be one that differs and who is right and who is wrong. The only way to prove it is by actually doing it. Only problem is when both techniques or opinions work, then what?
As well Cat, How many hours would it take to teach a student all of the experience and knowledge you have Cat?
Not that i disagree with you Cat, somethings need to be changed.
Cheers
Apache64
Forgot to mention there is some stuff that needs to be changed in the syllabus and they way and why it is taught.
I will agree TC can be stuck in theirs ways on how to teach procedures and other aspects of flying. Which also will be dependent on what inspector you are talking to.
Cat driver:
Nope never been taught to check the carb heat for lean mixture, so what am i looking for when i pull the carb ht?
i have been taught, and have taught my students on how to use the mixture and why (hopefully i am correct in the matter) biggest problem i have with this is we do not have enough practice doing it for real while training students.
Now, do i fault tc and their syllabus or my instructors for not teaching me everything in the world of aviation, can we even reasonably teach everything to a student in the time allotted to us, or can we learn off each other as we go and hope we dont kill ourselves doing it. As well, are we talking practical knowledge or book knowledge, who is right and who is wrong on a subject, for everyone who has an opinion there is sure to be one that differs and who is right and who is wrong. The only way to prove it is by actually doing it. Only problem is when both techniques or opinions work, then what?
As well Cat, How many hours would it take to teach a student all of the experience and knowledge you have Cat?
Not that i disagree with you Cat, somethings need to be changed.
Cheers
Apache64
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justplanecrazy
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Apache,Apache64_ wrote:Some of you are advocating to increase the time requirements to get a certain license to make better pilots. I have a couple of problems with that.
It is up to the chief pilots and owners to make sure their pilots are up to standards for the company not for tc, if they feel you dont make the grade then they have some options. Reminds me of the safety letter where a pilot up north did his training, blew his ndb approach totally and was signed off anyways, went out on a charter and killed him and his passengers, now whose fault, the operator, the pilot or transpots lower minimums?
I guess I gotta clear up my point. My point is not to increase hours but rather increase the amount of talent required to pass. I was suggesting that by the time you've reached the minimum hour requirements. 99.9% of the students are able to pass their commercial ride without any real challenges. Everyone I've spoken with, thought the commercial ride was a joke. So why not weed out those pilots that are unable to make a smooth landing after 2000 attempts and those pilots who continuously lose 500' as soon as they turn beyond 30 degrees. Increase the standards that are there as well as introducing more types of stalls Climbing/Descending Turns, Crosswind Landings, Short Field landings within limits, Soft Field landings without touching the nosewheel. If a person is paying $30,000 for their commercial why not increase the actual ride length for the licence. 1 hour isn't enough time to determine if someone is a competant pilot and doubling the cost to $250 is less than a 1% increase in the overall cost.
Sure the CP's and owners are responsible in selecting their crew but how can you give them full responsibility. If I own a computer programming company and I have someone hand me a Resume showing that they have their doctors in Computer Programing from Harvard, I have no doubt that he meets the qualifications as a programer. Do I know he's a good employee? No. But I know that he's a good programmer. Harvard is a good school and requires an above average student to be able to get his doctors.
So does a licence that meets the TC requirements gaurantee a good pilot? Hell no. Rather it doesn't gaurantee anything. Was anyone on here challenged to make a passing grade on their CPL ride??? Or was it simply a challenge to get the best grade. No pilot should take more than 250 hours to be able to pass. Many people receive a mark on their PPL that would pass them on their CPL ride. This is at 45-65 hours. So what challenge do they have to overcome for their CPL ride? A limited panel and spin? this should take no more than another 5 hours of training. What else is there to learn in their upcoming 150 hours?
If I didn't do a Multi IFR rating well building time, I wouldn't have come anywhere near the required amount of dual. Yet I didn't require anymore dual to be able to pass a CPL ride.
Teach us masters!!!! Obviously there are skills that can be taught. If the student is taught to a higher level, the instructor will be also. If a student can do something, the instructor has to do be ablet to do it well. If the student isn't challenged, then the instructor will be asleep and it compounds to end up with a bunch of pilots that simply don't know the meaning of stick and rudder.
mcrit had a good point with the champ and cub requiring a lot more skill to fly but these skills should still be able to be taught in a 150 or 172. I've seen pilots cross over to the champ and immediately have the skill, and others barely be able to keep the thing airborne. Why the variance? Probably more skills taught in their initial instructing.
We have no effective screening methods to make sure pilots are sane.
— Dr. Herbert Haynes, Federal Aviation Authority.
— Dr. Herbert Haynes, Federal Aviation Authority.
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Cat Driver
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Apache:
Once you have set the mixture in what you feel is the optimum setting if you apply full carb heat that is a positive check that you are not running to lean.
If you get no drop in RPM you are slightly to lean....if you get an increase in RPM you are definately to lean...
Remember hot air is less dense than cold so carb heat will make the mixture richer.
It is a very simple check and as long as physics remain the same it is fool proof.
How many flying hours would it take to learn what I have maybe learned?
Hmmmm I have somewhere between twenty five and thirty thousand hours, I don't know for sure because I haven't kept a close record for decades...it has no real meaning to me. For what it is worth about ten years ago TC's records showed me with around twenty five thousand hours, but that was in the good old days when they wanted me to clean up a mess they had with a large airplane operator that was under an OC suspension.....different TC guys though.
The puzzeling thing to me is TC decided that they did not want people like me owning a flight school, and went out of their way to prevent me from doing so. From their standpiont, I guess what I do or do not know really makes no difference.
.
Once you have set the mixture in what you feel is the optimum setting if you apply full carb heat that is a positive check that you are not running to lean.
If you get no drop in RPM you are slightly to lean....if you get an increase in RPM you are definately to lean...
Remember hot air is less dense than cold so carb heat will make the mixture richer.
It is a very simple check and as long as physics remain the same it is fool proof.
How many flying hours would it take to learn what I have maybe learned?
Hmmmm I have somewhere between twenty five and thirty thousand hours, I don't know for sure because I haven't kept a close record for decades...it has no real meaning to me. For what it is worth about ten years ago TC's records showed me with around twenty five thousand hours, but that was in the good old days when they wanted me to clean up a mess they had with a large airplane operator that was under an OC suspension.....different TC guys though.
The puzzeling thing to me is TC decided that they did not want people like me owning a flight school, and went out of their way to prevent me from doing so. From their standpiont, I guess what I do or do not know really makes no difference.
.
The hardest thing about flying is knowing when to say no
After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
Whew,
glad we are all on the same page. I dont think we need to increase hourse as well, we definetely need to make the commercial license standards tougher and put some variance into what is tested. maybe look at what the states are using for commercial standards as some of the manuevers they teach will challange a student further than the basic commercial license we have now. Depending on the student it only really takes about 5 hours of dual and 5 solo to get to commercial standards (on average give or take a few)
Definetely didnt know about the carb heat check once the mixture is leaned to find out how well i did.
justplanecrazy of course the operator doesnt have full responsibility, as an instructor we try to discourage those who cant and never will (the total anti-pilot) then if they can manage to pass the commercial ok not much of challenge, if then they can manage to make it past the scrutiny of the company we should let them fly the plane.
But yes if after 2000 smash n gos, cant fly straight and level and has yet to figure out how to adjust the throttle to make the a/c go down, then yes tell them to take a hike.
We should lobby atac or caap to get the requirements for the commercial more stringent.
AS to the aircraft, 152/172 are fairly docile, but think the next generation aircraft are even easier to fly katanas, from what I hear, use very little rudder, the cirrus, when I flew it can do a hands of steep turn at 45 degrees of bank without a change, in attitude or airspeed, the most complex thing was the avionics, and after a little bit would actually be pretty easy, so when flight schools upgrade to aircraft like this, then what are flight test going to be like. Somehow we have to find a way to teach the feet and rudder skills of days of old, so when students get into the industry then they can actually fly what they are put in.
Cat Driver, transport should be encouraging pilots with your time to open a school and teach us youngins on how to fly, hell if you got a float plane i might just come an get a float rating with you, i always wanted to try some float flying. Unfortunately somehow you got screwed.
Cheers
Eric
glad we are all on the same page. I dont think we need to increase hourse as well, we definetely need to make the commercial license standards tougher and put some variance into what is tested. maybe look at what the states are using for commercial standards as some of the manuevers they teach will challange a student further than the basic commercial license we have now. Depending on the student it only really takes about 5 hours of dual and 5 solo to get to commercial standards (on average give or take a few)
Definetely didnt know about the carb heat check once the mixture is leaned to find out how well i did.
justplanecrazy of course the operator doesnt have full responsibility, as an instructor we try to discourage those who cant and never will (the total anti-pilot) then if they can manage to pass the commercial ok not much of challenge, if then they can manage to make it past the scrutiny of the company we should let them fly the plane.
But yes if after 2000 smash n gos, cant fly straight and level and has yet to figure out how to adjust the throttle to make the a/c go down, then yes tell them to take a hike.
We should lobby atac or caap to get the requirements for the commercial more stringent.
AS to the aircraft, 152/172 are fairly docile, but think the next generation aircraft are even easier to fly katanas, from what I hear, use very little rudder, the cirrus, when I flew it can do a hands of steep turn at 45 degrees of bank without a change, in attitude or airspeed, the most complex thing was the avionics, and after a little bit would actually be pretty easy, so when flight schools upgrade to aircraft like this, then what are flight test going to be like. Somehow we have to find a way to teach the feet and rudder skills of days of old, so when students get into the industry then they can actually fly what they are put in.
Cat Driver, transport should be encouraging pilots with your time to open a school and teach us youngins on how to fly, hell if you got a float plane i might just come an get a float rating with you, i always wanted to try some float flying. Unfortunately somehow you got screwed.
Cheers
Eric
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Cat Driver
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Hi again Apache:
Naw, I didn't get screwed I just decided I was not going to take uncalled for crap from some self serving TC prick that was using his authority to try and bully me.
And I was well aware of the probable out come before I started taking on their top management.
You see if people like me don't stand up to them you guys will be even worse off.
There is nothing more they can do to me now that I am no longer wanting an FTU OC so I am free to say anything I want as long as I can back it up with facts....so fu.. em and their system I don't need them.
If you want to fly floats I can use Imrich Rutu's Luscombe on floats if you get out this way.
We all seem to eventually agree that flight training needs some major revamping..sadly it is not going to happen.
.
Naw, I didn't get screwed I just decided I was not going to take uncalled for crap from some self serving TC prick that was using his authority to try and bully me.
And I was well aware of the probable out come before I started taking on their top management.
You see if people like me don't stand up to them you guys will be even worse off.
There is nothing more they can do to me now that I am no longer wanting an FTU OC so I am free to say anything I want as long as I can back it up with facts....so fu.. em and their system I don't need them.
If you want to fly floats I can use Imrich Rutu's Luscombe on floats if you get out this way.
We all seem to eventually agree that flight training needs some major revamping..sadly it is not going to happen.
.
The hardest thing about flying is knowing when to say no
After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
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Shiny Side Up
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The biggest unfortunate thing about the whole PDM thing is that there's no way to weed out those with incredibly poor attitudes towards aviation. When I teach the PDM classes you can see immediately that most students take the advice to heart but you can spot the odd one immediately who ain't listening. You know those five poor aviation attitudes? Hey you in the back! I'm describing you! Just because someone has good stick and rudder skills doesn't mean they're a good pilot. I'd rather pass through a mediocre skilled pilot who at least has the sense to keep themselves out of trouble and know that they have some limitations than some of the hellions who I've sent for rides who I know are going to make a smoking hole in the ground sometime and I just hope they don't take someone else in the process.
Unfortunately it seems for the best way for some people to learn is to scare themselves good. If you're lucky you'll survive when you do. The bad thing is some people are too stupid or oblivious to scare themselves.
Unfortunately it seems for the best way for some people to learn is to scare themselves good. If you're lucky you'll survive when you do. The bad thing is some people are too stupid or oblivious to scare themselves.
We can't stop here! This is BAT country!
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Cat Driver
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Fill me in, what are the five poor attitudes?
That stuff was not part of instructing when I had a rating, we just showed them a good example.......
But hey...I'm gonna make a bet that the five poor attitudes will mean I won't live to survive the next flight.................so maybe I had better not know.
Cat
That stuff was not part of instructing when I had a rating, we just showed them a good example.......
But hey...I'm gonna make a bet that the five poor attitudes will mean I won't live to survive the next flight.................so maybe I had better not know.
Cat
The hardest thing about flying is knowing when to say no
After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
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Cat Driver
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Oh my God.....
I can never fly again or I'm dead.
Damn you, Abramin why didn't you just leave me ignorant of those rules.
Now what do I do?
Hey I know I'll just wait until there is a TC freeby on that and I'll discise myself as a normal person and attend...then I will be safe to fly again.
Cat
I can never fly again or I'm dead.
Damn you, Abramin why didn't you just leave me ignorant of those rules.
Now what do I do?
Hey I know I'll just wait until there is a TC freeby on that and I'll discise myself as a normal person and attend...then I will be safe to fly again.
Cat
The hardest thing about flying is knowing when to say no
After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
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shitdisturber
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F**k you, you can't tell me what to do, although you probably will anyway; but i'm not gonna listen cause nothing will ever happen to me. Ya gd pussy! Screw it, I think i'm gonna go rob a bank.ahramin wrote:Anti authority
Resignation
Invulnerability (it can't happen to me)
Macho
Impulsive
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Cat Driver
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Shiny Side Up
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Get some money for me while you're there so I can keep doing this volunteer work. I gotta get some money so my Mom still thinks I got that gig as a piano player in a brothel. I can't let her find out I've been insructing all this time.shitdisturber wrote:F**k you, you can't tell me what to do, although you probably will anyway; but i'm not gonna listen cause nothing will ever happen to me. Ya gd pussy! Screw it, I think i'm gonna go rob a bank.ahramin wrote:Anti authority
Resignation
Invulnerability (it can't happen to me)
Macho
Impulsive
We can't stop here! This is BAT country!
You know, i am used to being the wittiest guy in the room and all of a sudden i am not even in the running. My hat is off to you shitdisturber.
On a serious note i have met a couple instructors who think that any student that questions their teaching is "anti-authoritarian". Sure as hell didn't try to explain the concept to them. Just get labelled myself.
ahramin
On a serious note i have met a couple instructors who think that any student that questions their teaching is "anti-authoritarian". Sure as hell didn't try to explain the concept to them. Just get labelled myself.
ahramin
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Shiny Side Up
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Cat Driver
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In the mid eighties and early ninties my wife and I owned a flight school both fixed wing and helicopter.
I decided to renew my class two instructor rating which lapsed in 1965, the first thing TC advised me was it would be difficult to reach their standards because I had been out of the instructing game for so long..so I said I had not quit flying just instructing. The TC guy looked me in the eye and said "then its really going to be difficult for you because you have to many ideas of how it should be done"
Well it turned out he was right, because when I started to study for the renewal I wes flummoxed with some of the methods and ideas that I had to learn...
BUT:
It was the laws of learning that really showed me the intelligence and background of the people who set up the teaching program for TC.
I asked my wife to explain the laws of learning that were in the instructors book...she said what laws?
Anyhow I gave her the book and she said this is garbage, I never ever heard of these laws of learning.
My wife has a BA in Education, a Masters In education and almost finished her Doctorate in education...so she phoned some of her profs, including the one at Berkley who had worked with her on her doctorate....
None of them knew what in hell she was talking about as they also had never heard of these "laws of learning"
So go figure.
( By the way, I never managed to renew my Class two, I ran out of money and couldnt afford the lobotomy. )
Cat
I decided to renew my class two instructor rating which lapsed in 1965, the first thing TC advised me was it would be difficult to reach their standards because I had been out of the instructing game for so long..so I said I had not quit flying just instructing. The TC guy looked me in the eye and said "then its really going to be difficult for you because you have to many ideas of how it should be done"
Well it turned out he was right, because when I started to study for the renewal I wes flummoxed with some of the methods and ideas that I had to learn...
BUT:
It was the laws of learning that really showed me the intelligence and background of the people who set up the teaching program for TC.
I asked my wife to explain the laws of learning that were in the instructors book...she said what laws?
Anyhow I gave her the book and she said this is garbage, I never ever heard of these laws of learning.
My wife has a BA in Education, a Masters In education and almost finished her Doctorate in education...so she phoned some of her profs, including the one at Berkley who had worked with her on her doctorate....
None of them knew what in hell she was talking about as they also had never heard of these "laws of learning"
So go figure.
( By the way, I never managed to renew my Class two, I ran out of money and couldnt afford the lobotomy. )
Cat
The hardest thing about flying is knowing when to say no
After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
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Cat Driver
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OW :
Yeh, seems one of the gurus that gave birth to the the flight instructors guide was called Moose something or the other, and I believe he was ex military....
Cat
Yeh, seems one of the gurus that gave birth to the the flight instructors guide was called Moose something or the other, and I believe he was ex military....
Cat
The hardest thing about flying is knowing when to say no
After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
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Cat Driver
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shitdisturber
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I'm not morally bankrupt, I just learned a long time ago that it's much easier to give in to my inner child right away. Since i'm going to give in eventually anyway I might just as well get it over with and save myself a lot of internal debate. bootyshakeShiny Side Up wrote:Its best not to encourage shitdisturber, he's morally bankrupt. He'll turn on you faster than a Swiss blacksmith at a corkboard convention.
Oh and by the way, I'm not getting any money for you when I rob the bank; i've decided you're the patsy who's taking the fall for me.
Cat
First I spelled the Moose's name wrong. It should be McMillen.
I have before me an autographed copy of the book "IT by Moose", that's Instructional Techniques, published in 1994.
The original program goes back much further. I would have to do a little digging but I do have a copy of the military training manual that the Moose wrote. I'm not sure that it has a date on it.
The book has a list of companies that have attended his training sessions (that would be after the military thing) and Wardair is listed as one. How far back would that put it?
First I spelled the Moose's name wrong. It should be McMillen.
I have before me an autographed copy of the book "IT by Moose", that's Instructional Techniques, published in 1994.
The original program goes back much further. I would have to do a little digging but I do have a copy of the military training manual that the Moose wrote. I'm not sure that it has a date on it.
The book has a list of companies that have attended his training sessions (that would be after the military thing) and Wardair is listed as one. How far back would that put it?
Pilots get higher, SCUBA Divers do it deeper!
Well Cat I couldn’t agree with you more that the learning factors are complete garbage. But it's easy to call something trash, what's harder is to suggesting a worthwhile replacement.
So how would you teach instructor candidates to teach?
When I think back on it, I had previous teaching experience to draw upon, plus like everybody else I had been through the training system and saw what worked and what definitely didn’t work. But other than sending someone to get a BA in education, or some other actual teaching requirements, how do we improve or change the system.
Honestly I want to know what you would do if TC suddenly had a shakedown and got rid of all the inept and crooked people, and in reward for your years of effort to expose them, you are awarded a sweet salaried position at Transport. Your first job, change the whole flight training system from the bottom up.
Where would you start, how would you teach the teacher to teach?
So how would you teach instructor candidates to teach?
When I think back on it, I had previous teaching experience to draw upon, plus like everybody else I had been through the training system and saw what worked and what definitely didn’t work. But other than sending someone to get a BA in education, or some other actual teaching requirements, how do we improve or change the system.
Honestly I want to know what you would do if TC suddenly had a shakedown and got rid of all the inept and crooked people, and in reward for your years of effort to expose them, you are awarded a sweet salaried position at Transport. Your first job, change the whole flight training system from the bottom up.
Where would you start, how would you teach the teacher to teach?
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Right Seat Captain
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There are more theories on teaching than there are types of aircraft in the world.
From my time in the Air Cadets, I was taught how to teach. When I got my instructor, there were very many similarities. This leads me to believe these teaching techniques that TC insist on come from the military. I know it works in the military, because I have seen some of the best instructors and teachers in the military, far better than a school teacher armed with a Bachelor or Masters of Education. I'm not bashing school teachers or their education (my girlfriend is becoming a school teacher, and I have great respect for her doing so). But its just the way they are used by individuals. I ihate to defend TC on this one, but the idea behind the teaching principles work quite well if used, or taught properly.
Its been my experience that many instructors ignore techniques they have learnt until they become Class 1s and have to know them much better to teach new instructors. Maybe thats why Class 1s are regarded as such good insructors. But I think some instructors are too preoccupied to getting the hell out of instucting and into the airlines that they do the bare minimum to scrape by instructing duties, and teach substandard lessons.
I realize this might seem to be opposing views from my defending of instructors earlier, but I'm just saying that material in essence is still be ccovered, maybe just instructors attitudes are what the problem is (and I just like stirring the pot)
From my time in the Air Cadets, I was taught how to teach. When I got my instructor, there were very many similarities. This leads me to believe these teaching techniques that TC insist on come from the military. I know it works in the military, because I have seen some of the best instructors and teachers in the military, far better than a school teacher armed with a Bachelor or Masters of Education. I'm not bashing school teachers or their education (my girlfriend is becoming a school teacher, and I have great respect for her doing so). But its just the way they are used by individuals. I ihate to defend TC on this one, but the idea behind the teaching principles work quite well if used, or taught properly.
Its been my experience that many instructors ignore techniques they have learnt until they become Class 1s and have to know them much better to teach new instructors. Maybe thats why Class 1s are regarded as such good insructors. But I think some instructors are too preoccupied to getting the hell out of instucting and into the airlines that they do the bare minimum to scrape by instructing duties, and teach substandard lessons.
I realize this might seem to be opposing views from my defending of instructors earlier, but I'm just saying that material in essence is still be ccovered, maybe just instructors attitudes are what the problem is (and I just like stirring the pot)
