Interesting findings on Perimeter gear-up March/09

[ywgflyboy]

The damage was very minimal," he said, noting it cost less than $30,000 to fix

That would be a complete right off for a perimeter metro.

It was back in service a few weeks later (so I am told).

[impress]

hmmm let's crunch some numbers:

Repaired prop with 4 new blades..... 25K x2
Limited prop damage TPE 331 engine inspection.... 10-15K x 2 (if nothing found wrong)
2 weeks worth of sheet metal work ?? maybe 10K
Damaged reputation $$$??

I would estimate actual hard cost closer to 80-100k

Either way, just a comment.

[the_professor]

$30k -- what a load of horsesh*t.

I have a hard time believing anything out of the mouth of the Wehrle group; a family so greedy that they ripped all the insulation out of their fleet -- which are aircraft that are deafening to begin with, just so they could load more stuff onto them -- all at the expense of the long term hearing of their pilots, to whom they paid ridiculous wages until recently. FO's made around $18k not too many years ago. What a joke. Rip out the insulation, and then hand your passengers earplugs when they board the plane. Then go sit at home like a fat cat and wait for the cheques to roll in.

Some operation.

[boeingboy]

With Perimeter - It's always someone elses problem.

But, Wehrle said "tires tend to grow from the heat and the centrifugal force.

This quote is what really kills me.

[Widow]

Seems odd that the TSB is talking about this, unless the report has been released. Does anyone know if it has, but is not translated yet so not up on the TSB site?

[jigger79]

Thats funny, flying by YTH tonight, Perimeter declared an emergency due to gear problems. CYYQ - CYTH 5 pax and 2 Crew and 1200 lbs of fuel. Listening in on the YTH MF, FSS guys were out with a spot light seeing if the gear was down as they made 3 fly-by's. seems to me that this outfit has numerous gear issues. I have been an fo and capt on a metro 3 and 23 and in 2 years never had any gear issues. As well, last month we were put into a hold in YTH due to another perimeter metro with gear issues. I Think it's time to retire the metro's, this gets embarrassing after a while.

[ywgflyboy]

If you check out the CADORS for Perimeter, they have a report almost every week of "unsafe gear indication". Maybe there is a pattern??

[mattedfred]

i flew the II for PAG and Morningstar. i had unsafe gear indications on both fleets. the system is poorly designed and often fails to indicate that the gear is down and locked when in fact it is. that said, i never had to land with the gear unsafe as we eventually obtained a safe indication. i assume this happens every fall. it would be nice if they could redesign the system but i would be shocked if they did. perhaps the III and 23 have a different system.

[flap16]

Thats funny, flying by YTH tonight, Perimeter declared an emergency due to gear problems. CYYQ - CYTH 5 pax and 2 Crew and 1200 lbs of fuel. Listening in on the YTH MF, FSS guys were out with a spot light seeing if the gear was down as they made 3 fly-by's. seems to me that this outfit has numerous gear issues. I have been an fo and capt on a metro 3 and 23 and in 2 years never had any gear issues. As well, last month we were put into a hold in YTH due to another perimeter metro with gear issues. I Think it's time to retire the metro's, this gets embarrassing after a while.

That doesn't seem too "funny" to me.

[Investigator]

.

[boeingboy]

i flew the II for PAG and Morningstar. i had unsafe gear indications on both fleets. the system is poorly designed and often fails to indicate that the gear is down and locked when in fact it is. that said, i never had to land with the gear unsafe as we eventually obtained a safe indication. i assume this happens every fall. it would be nice if they could redesign the system but i would be shocked if they did. perhaps the III and 23 have a different system.

I'm sorry - your statements are complete BS. The system is actually well designed. It all boils down to how well your machine is maintained. There was never a redesign for the system - it was the same for all machines. They did come out with a more enviromentally sealed mircoswitch - but even the old ones worked very well, just a little more labour intensive.

[Widow]

Thanks Investigator. I had done a thread search, but had missed it ... threads now merged.

[mattedfred]

[I'm sorry - your statements are complete BS.

do you kiss your mother with that mouth? i mean seriously. i welcome a difference of opinion but i would prefer it if you would speak to me as though we were in the same room.

[The Hammer]

The current metro landing gear indication sytem is already a redesign. It originally had only one "down& locked" microswitch. When they went to the 2 switch system it increased false "gear unsafe" indications but eliminated the chance of a false "down &locked" indication that was found to be possible on the original design.

PS PAL removed insulation in freighter only a/c and actually added weight to their aircraft by putting 4 blade props on Metro2 fleet to reduce noise. They did the flight testing for the new prop as well.

[Guido]

If you check out the CADORS for Perimeter, they have a report almost every week of "unsafe gear indication". Maybe there is a pattern??

Couldn't possibly be... SMS would've caught it by now

[Disco Stu]

You morons who think Perimeter has poor maintenance have obviously never spent any time in the hangar. I was at PAG for 5 and a half years, and never once had any mechanical failures attributed to poor maintenance. Any time I had an issue, it was addressed and fixed.

Not sure where this hatred of Perimeter comes from from so many. Perhaps it's jealousy, or just misinformation, either way, as someone who worked there for quite a while, and flew in all areas of the operation, from sked to medivac, to charters, to the bag run, 99% of the bashing of PAG on here is all crap.

PAG has survived many, many TC audits. If their maintenance program was so flawed, do you really think they'd be flying? Lets go through the list of MB operators who have been shut down or warned over the last few years and you won't find PAG among them.....

[boeingboy]

Not sure where this hatred of Perimeter comes from from so many. Perhaps it's jealousy, or just misinformation,

All you have to do is read the first post again!

I wonder why all these people vigrously defend companies that are not all they seem to be. Same thing happened to Westex, say one thing that is not very favorable and everyone else starts getting upset, like "oh my god - they are the best operator. How dare anyone say anything bad." When half the time - they were lucky to come home in one piece.

[BusDriver]

Disco, perhaps the dislike of Perimeter stems from forcing all Manitoba/N.Ontario pilots to listen to the dumbest position reports we have ever heard! "Perimeter..........blah blah blah 190 north of YWG blaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, any conflicting....................blah blah.

[mattedfred]

seriously?

that's your justification?

[fallex]

Disco, perhaps the dislike of Perimeter stems from forcing all Manitoba/N.Ontario pilots to listen to the dumbest position reports we have ever heard! "Perimeter..........blah blah blah 190 north of YWG blaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, any conflicting....................blah blah.

FAIL.

[YWG gearcleaner]

In addition to fail, Fluckmachine just totally ripped off .'s joke.

Double fail

[Disco Stu]

Disco, perhaps the dislike of Perimeter stems from forcing all Manitoba/N.Ontario pilots to listen to the dumbest position reports we have ever heard! "Perimeter..........blah blah blah 190 north of YWG blaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, any conflicting....................blah blah.

Thanks for proving my point moron.

[Captain Crunch]

Hey Stu,
I'm with you
Maybe everyone is jealous because we pay Dash 8 captains 100K a year to be home every night, (FO's are paid higher then the 16 year FO at jazz) and as for those of us on the 703/704 fleet making 65K after a year, and up to 95K to fly a light twin half the month... i could see where the jealousy comes from
Sure things break, but they are also fixed, and our mtce staff is among the best at relationships with our pilots...
I enjoy reading all this perimeter nonsense on here on my 15 days off this month... it helps the time pass

As for our radio calls, first to admit we have some TERRIBLE calls, but I cant say i give a shit about "you know who" taxiing for 27 Pikangikum on 126.7 when I am trying to talk to a Fast Air King Air before they run me over...

But hey, nobodies perfect...

CC

[Jastapilot]

I once loaded metros for a certain northern airline. If you overloaded the pits there was a chance the gear wouldn't properly retract in the wheel-wells after takeoff, or worse yet, not extend. Jast say'n

[mattedfred]

Hey Stu,
I'm with you
Maybe everyone is jealous because we pay Dash 8 captains 100K a year to be home every night, (FO's are paid higher then the 16 year FO at jazz)
I enjoy reading all this perimeter nonsense on here on my 15 days off this month... it helps the time pass

do you guys have hourly rates?

what is the top hourly rate for a CA and FO on your Dash8? $106.10 and $65.64 per flight credit hour

what is your minimum guaranteed days off per month? 12 unless training outside the window than it is 10

feel free to pm if necessary and say hello to name edited
thanks