Question about joining AC as a pilot

[a340x]

Hey everyone!

I know that Air Canada pilots either start on the E190's as F/O or on the B777, B767 or the newer B787 as S/O (relief pilot)...My question is, after the relief pilot's have reached enough seniority, do they become F/O directly on the B777, B767 or the B787 or do they start flying a different type of airplane? Also about how many years do pilots at AC expect to get an upgrade?
Just curious

Thanks everyone!

[CanadianEh]

Seniority, seniority, seniority.

[acidgambit]

Everything about Air Canada is SENIORITY. Like the guy said upstairs. Don't have enough seniority don't even think about having dessert. Same goes with mechanics, flight attendants, and other categories.

I wish you luck.

Not trying to shoot you down. But I don't think AC will be hiring pilots for awhile. Unless if you have good connections then that's another story. Anyways, best of luck! Cheers!

[PilotFlying]

Unless if you have good connections then that's another story.

There's absolutely no truth to this. I'm not sure how it works in other departments, but in Flight Ops having connections no longer does anything for you. My guess is other departments are the same too. Applying is all it takes and your qualifications will do the rest.

As other posters have mentioned, progression is based purely on seniority. If you wait long enough in the R/P seat then, yes, you would be able to transition directly to F/O on a widebody. Others may choose to fly F/O on a narrowbody for a while and then F/O on a widebody, or F/O to Captain. Technically, there's nothing that says you couldn't sit as an R/P for so long that you could transition directly to a widebody Captain seat - but by then it may be so long since you've had any stick time that the command course may be a bit too much to chew!

Cheers,

[sepia]

Latest and greatest is fall hiring now. Just like last falls hiring rumor, i know, i know.

[yycflyguy]

Latest and greatest is fall hiring now. Just like last falls hiring rumor, i know, i know.

Sure, you gotta confuse the troops with possible good news mixed in with the Age60 and Jazz 757/CPA all at the same time, that way things can get passed because of the promise of better things coming soon.

[sepia]

nah, I can't fathom anyone being stupid enough not to understand that fly past 60 isn't a huge dropkick to the nuts.

[yycflyguy]

nah, I can't fathom anyone being stupid enough not to understand that fly past 60 isn't a huge dropkick to the nuts.

Isn't that what they said about an un-negotiated TA that was accepted by 55%? Get your nuts ready for another dropkick

[Dhc6to8]

"Unless if you have good connections then that's another story".

"There's absolutely no truth to this. I'm not sure how it works in other departments, but in Flight Ops having connections no longer does anything for you. My guess is other departments are the same too. Applying is all it takes and your qualifications will do the rest".

Sorry pal, that is the biggest load of shite I have ever read on the forum about AC.... back in the early '90's I was working a small gig on floats at the Vancouver South Terminal... my best friend (who was working together with me) had less time than I did, and didn't even have a degree (which I do)... but, here it is: his father was and still is an A320 check Captain based in YVR... his father walked both our resumes in... I came out negative (it was my 1st try to get into AC) and my friend was in... Just like that. We still are in touch and I don't hold any bad feelings, I am happy for him. He got in at the right time (24 years old) and he enjoys his roster and seniority now. His father was very candid and told me that it was nepotism first, then "off the street".. and, he was sorry he couldn't help me (nice guy his father - survived a career on the Starfighter). In a way I am happy that my career has gone how it has, another friend of ours has already lost his medical at 40… so life could be worse! Nepotism and connections do run in AC’s blood just as well as it did at Canadian and Canada 3000 (for that matter almost the whole industry). So, please don’t sit there and force lies down our throats… the majority of aircrew are intelligent and observant people, and to be told such a load of crap is an insult to your fellow brethren who hold just as many aviation dreams and aspirations as you once did or still do…
Fly safely brother....
6to8

[balfour]

Awesome!

[Inverted2]

I know of a few that got on with AC, that at my previous company were nothing but trouble. Poor attendance, disciplinary problems, numerous failed rides etc. The one thing that they had in common was a parent at AC. I don't blame them for going, but it does happen. One person in particular I can think of would never have made it through the hiring process in a million years.

[mattedfred]

Unless if you have good connections then that's another story.

There's absolutely no truth to this. I'm not sure how it works in other departments, but in Flight Ops having connections no longer does anything for you.

he said no longer is true. perhaps things have changed at AC in the last few years. we all know sons and daughters of AC pilots that got on in the late 90's or early 00's. maybe it doesn't work that way anymore. i don't know.

i didn't have any connections at AC, didn't have a military background, a degree or time on any of their types. i sent them 1 resume plus 3 updates as per their program at the time (99 - 00) and was offered an interview.

it is luck and timing and who you know except when it isn't

[yycflyguy]

"Unless if you have good connections then that's another story".

"There's absolutely no truth to this. I'm not sure how it works in other departments, but in Flight Ops having connections no longer does anything for you. My guess is other departments are the same too. Applying is all it takes and your qualifications will do the rest".

Sorry pal, that is the biggest load of shite I have ever read on the forum about AC.... back in the early '90's I was working a small gig on floats at the Vancouver South Terminal... my best friend (who was working together with me) had less time than I did, and didn't even have a degree (which I do)... but, here it is: his father was and still is an A320 check Captain based in YVR... his father walked both our resumes in... I came out negative (it was my 1st try to get into AC) and my friend was in... Just like that. We still are in touch and I don't hold any bad feelings, I am happy for him. He got in at the right time (24 years old) and he enjoys his roster and seniority now. His father was very candid and told me that it was nepotism first, then "off the street".. and, he was sorry he couldn't help me (nice guy his father - survived a career on the Starfighter). In a way I am happy that my career has gone how it has, another friend of ours has already lost his medical at 40… so life could be worse! Nepotism and connections do run in AC’s blood just as well as it did at Canadian and Canada 3000 (for that matter almost the whole industry). So, please don’t sit there and force lies down our throats… the majority of aircrew are intelligent and observant people, and to be told such a load of crap is an insult to your fellow brethren who hold just as many aviation dreams and aspirations as you once did or still do…
Fly safely brother....
6to8

So you are assuming that the hiring practices in place today are EXACTLY as they were 20 years ago?

[Old fella]

Unless if you have good connections then that's another story.

There's absolutely no truth to this. I'm not sure how it works in other departments, but in Flight Ops having connections no longer does anything for you.

he said no longer is true. perhaps things have changed at AC in the last few years. we all know sons and daughters of AC pilots that got on in the late 90's or early 00's. maybe it doesn't work that way anymore. i don't know.

i didn't have any connections at AC, didn't have a military background, a degree or time on any of their types. i sent them 1 resume plus 3 updates as per their program at the time (99 - 00) and was offered an interview.

it is luck and timing and who you know except when it isn't

When I went through YQM flying school in the early 70's there were a couple of young fellas there at the same time whose father's flew for AC( daughters flying for AC wasn't a thing in those days). From what I remember/know/keep in touch those youngins did get positions with AC entry level which was SO on a DC-8 and you may be surprised but there wasn't any animosity towards the sons. It was an accepted thing and if I remember the hiring practices with Air Canada(it wasn’t all that much in those days, as no movements due retirements/new airplanes/routes) was usually from the military. Also a university degree was considered a valuable asset all things being equal. In those days not many of us with degrees got into flying. So from what I saw your chances with AC were good if you father was a pilot at AC or you had a military background or university degree with a CPL and multi- Class 1 instrument rating.
Also in those days there were EPA, Nordair, Quebecair, Pacific Western and I do believe the entry requirements for those were Senior Commercial with multi-Class 1 or ATR. A lot of the flying instructors ended up with the Regionals…. EPA, Nordair et al. Canadian Pacific was going strong in those days and I believe their requirements were similar to Air Canada’s

[yycflyguy]

When I went through YQM flying school in the early 70's there were a couple of young fellas there at the same time whose father's flew for AC( daughters flying for AC wasn't a thing in those days). From what I remember/know/keep in touch those youngins did get positions with AC entry level which was SO on a DC-8 and you may be surprised but there wasn't any animosity towards the sons. It was an accepted thing and if I remember the hiring practices with Air Canada(it wasn’t all that much in those days, as no movements due retirements/new airplanes/routes) was usually from the military. Also a university degree was considered a valuable asset all things being equal. In those days not many of us with degrees got into flying. So from what I saw your chances with AC were good if you father was a pilot at AC or you had a military background or university degree with a CPL and multi- Class 1 instrument rating.
Also in those days there were EPA, Nordair, Quebecair, Pacific Western and I do believe the entry requirements for those were Senior Commercial with multi-Class 1 or ATR. A lot of the flying instructors ended up with the Regionals…. EPA, Nordair et al. Canadian Pacific was going strong in those days and I believe their requirements were similar to Air Canada’s

Not too far off from what they look for today.

Flight experience along with:

1. University degree
2. Aviation degree/diploma
3. Second language
4. Jet time
5. Military Experience

That will get you the interview. What you do with the interview/tests/medical is up to the candidate. Nepotism is not as predominate as it used to be.

[Old fella]

I agree with your statement YYCflyguy as I personally never subscribed to the notion of nepotism as the sole reason for not getting inside. As mentioned, I never worked for any airline, although I was offered an interview with a Regional but never took them up on it. Perhaps I might not have passed the interview process as well - may have been possible that I may not have gotten through the course had I been accepted - who knows. Speaking from experience I applied to the Regulator (TC) way back, got through their process/interview/written skill tests and was inside the top 3 out of 15 candidates. I had nobody working on my behalf and it was through my own merit that I got accepted. Competition was keen for those TC jobs as they were attractive with the pay/benefits/time off/vacation and job security especially for us industry only airframe drivers who did time with the low pay/god awful hours and working conditions.

[PilotFlying]

Sorry pal, that is the biggest load of shite I have ever read on the forum about AC....

Hi, pal.

Had you actually read my words carefully you would have realized (as other readers did) that I was referring to current hiring practices - not those 2 decades old. I am well aware that nepotism was alive and well at Air Canada as recently as 2 or 3 years ago. I, too, have many colleagues that benefited to some extent by this process. But the fact is, there has been official word from the HR department within the last couple of years that they no longer accept hand delivered applications and that all applications are processed through the online form.

That's not to say that the odd 'family' application doesn't find it's way onto someone's desk here and there - but no more than it would at any other organization and certainly not to the point where it would hinder 'Joe Pilot's' chances of getting an interview. After all, this is Canada, right? Where we are ALL equals. And this is the national, privately-held airline with no obligations to follow government protocols or 'acts' that are in place to ensure that we do, right? Right.

Who knows - maybe the rules for the next round of hiring will change again. But the most recent information that I have (and, yes, 2007 is more current than 199x) is what is stated above.

Keep it real, brother.

[balfour]

I can say for a FACT that evey fucink idiot, no personality, spinless knuckle dragger I have ever had the displeasure of sitting beside, now works for guess who. Every class act, fly by the books go getter never got past the interview.

My ASSumpiton is, they want nothing but spineless followers with no opinion that will do what ever ACPA wants. This of course ,is not true all of the guys that I know at your company but I gota say, you scraped the bottom of the barrel for your hiring in the last 4 years. Like I said, not a broad paint brush, but the idiots that should never have graced another cockpit, now work for you. The Elite.

I can say for SURE, that nepotism, is one reason these idiots grace your list.

....and another reason why I DONT!

[Jaques Strappe]

I can say for a FACT that evey fucink idiot, no personality, spinless knuckle dragger I have ever had the displeasure of sitting beside, now works for guess who. Every class act, fly by the books go getter never got past the interview.

My ASSumpiton is, they want nothing but spineless followers with no opinion that will do what ever ACPA wants. This of course ,is not true all of the guys that I know at your company but I gota say, you scraped the bottom of the barrel for your hiring in the last 4 years. Like I said, not a broad paint brush, but the idiots that should never have graced another cockpit, now work for you. The Elite.

I can say for SURE, that nepotism, is one reason these idiots grace your list.

....and another reason why I DONT!

WOW.........after reading a post like that, I can only say that apparently, our current screening process may actually have some merit.

[tellmemore]

I like turtles.

//personal attack removed by Sulako. Not nice. Next time is a strike.

[rigpiggy]

what does the FOM say about autopilot in RVSM airspace? Admittedly 99.9% of the folks you get have put in their time and are competent, the issue becomes when you get the "Others" that we speak of. I know several folks that when they are announced that I would get off of the plane. Your PsychTest does seem to be looking for followers. Besides which, if I couldn't be a pilot, I guess being a "Florist" wouldn't be bad.

[Jaques Strappe]

I know several folks that when they are announced that I would get off of the plane.

..............huh??? General sentence structure is helpful.

Besides which, if I couldn't be a pilot, I guess being a "Florist" wouldn't be bad.

The florist question keeps coming up. I think the general consensus among the psychology profession is that florists generally work alone and not as a team.

[SteveMcGarrettsHair]

My ASSumpiton is, they want nothing but spineless followers with no opinion that will do what ever ACPA wants.

ACPA doesn't do the hiring for AC flight ops......that should reflect on the validity of the rest of the posters comments.

[yycflyguy]

When I went through YQM flying school in the early 70's there were a couple of young fellas there at the same time whose father's flew for AC( daughters flying for AC wasn't a thing in those days). From what I remember/know/keep in touch those youngins did get positions with AC entry level which was SO on a DC-8 and you may be surprised but there wasn't any animosity towards the sons. It was an accepted thing and if I remember the hiring practices with Air Canada(it wasn’t all that much in those days, as no movements due retirements/new airplanes/routes) was usually from the military. Also a university degree was considered a valuable asset all things being equal. In those days not many of us with degrees got into flying. So from what I saw your chances with AC were good if you father was a pilot at AC or you had a military background or university degree with a CPL and multi- Class 1 instrument rating.
Also in those days there were EPA, Nordair, Quebecair, Pacific Western and I do believe the entry requirements for those were Senior Commercial with multi-Class 1 or ATR. A lot of the flying instructors ended up with the Regionals…. EPA, Nordair et al. Canadian Pacific was going strong in those days and I believe their requirements were similar to Air Canada’s

Not too far off from what they look for today.

Flight experience along with:

1. University degree
2. Aviation degree/diploma
3. Second language
4. Jet time
5. Military Experience

That will get you the interview. What you do with the interview/tests/medical is up to the candidate. Nepotism is not as predominate as it used to be.

I forgot one:
6. Big wang

[TopperHarley]

I forgot one:
6. Big wang

So if I have a reaallly big wang but don't have any millitary experience, do you think I'd score enough points to get an interview?

I'm pretty sure that if . Norris applied to AC, he'd get an interview. His wang alone would make up for his complete lack of flight time and education.