in light of mikasew...

[oldncold]

inlight of this I m wondering how many operators have nominated candidates to mgt for 703 operations only tro have then rejected by a tc inspector with an axe to grind.

recently ( company name withheld ) a 703 nominated a good candidate then a regional office rejects the nomination. candidate checks 2 other regions that have no issuse with candidate but poi of 703 operator will not back down offer of employment to candidate is with drawn . as 703 oc holder does not want to deal with the wrath of tc . . loss of offer cost candidate 90k+yr ..only option candidate has are to sue tc for enough to retire on ,which is conterproductive as they will being "gunn for"candidates licenses.

[looproll]

TC has the money and the power! Don't fight "the man", because you will lose. We are forced to bow down, submit to authority. It's 1984.

"We are not content with negative obedience, nor even with the most abject submission. When finally you surrender to us, it must be of your own free will. We do not destroy the heretic because he resists us; so long as he resists us we never destroy him. We convert him, we capture his inner mind, we reshape him. We burn all evil and all illusion out of him; we bring him over to our side, not in appearance, but genuinely, heart and soul. We make him one of ourselves before we kill him. It is intolerable to us that an erroneous thought should exist anywhere in the world, however secret and powerless it may be. Even in the instance of death we cannot permit any deviation . . . we make the brain perfect before we blow it out."

[oldncold]

looproll that was damn eloquent!!

maybe everybody that wants to be 703 mgr should just apply for pre approval beforehand to work for tc, forget the nomination process and forget the PRIVATE enterprize, the oc holder, that pays the salary, or the competition for the position, the interetviews .heck just hire tc to take up an office. that way it will be safe and within 3yrs every 703 will be broke paying overtime after 4pm ( to be fair there are some really good practical poi's out there ) that can think and are flexible in finding ways for "alternate means of compliance that meet the requirements and are safe" but there are some real... holes

[xsbank]

I suspect that Looproll was quoting George Orwell... That rumbling sound you hear is the old gentleman spinning in his grave as he contemplates the Canadian Government, Homeland Whatzit, airport "security," and all the rest of the crap and twaddle we have to deal with nowadays.

Cat would have something to say about all this; seems if we knock all the rough edges off this site it will not be a site worth visiting any more.

[Ogee]

inlight of this I m wondering how many operators have nominated candidates to mgt for 703 operations only tro have then rejected by a tc inspector with an axe to grind.

recently ( company name withheld ) a 703 nominated a good candidate then a regional office rejects the nomination. candidate checks 2 other regions that have no issuse with candidate but poi of 703 operator will not back down offer of employment to candidate is with drawn . as 703 oc holder does not want to deal with the wrath of tc . . loss of offer cost candidate 90k+yr ..only option candidate has are to sue tc for enough to retire on ,which is conterproductive as they will being "gunn for"candidates licenses.

If this is the prairie company I think it is, there is good reason TC is keeping a very close eye on who the new Ops Manager is. It is a company that has disfunctional management that is trying to get an Ops Manager that will do what the company wants, not what the law requires. It has been trying to get a figurehead, yes man type of Ops Manager to replace the old ops manager who was a straight shooting by the book stood up for the pilots kind of guy. Long story, great case study for an aviation management course, but not to identify it here. Doesn't matter, the point is that TC is aware that the company's game is getting a weak kind of person and is going to ensure this company has a proper ops manager with the necessary authority to carry out his or her role.

I think that there is going to be a greater emphasis on the role of the Flight Ops Manager by TC in the future, with more emphasis on professionalism and specific training in the processes of management. Mikey from Buffalo is on the right track with that business admin course he's taking.

[The Old Fogducker]

Too bad TC won't just rubber stamp the recommended candidate and let life go on the same as before. How pitiful is it when they expect the nominee to pass a qualification interview and work his/her way through the regulations by which he/she must operate the company when offering transportation services to the general public?

Yes, that sort of thing is a pitiful abuse of power I say ... totally unrealistic requirement because everybody knows you can't run a company by the regulations and stay in business ... surely there must be a great deal more to this concept of denying a person for a nominated position in a leadership role within a company than first meets the eye .... there must surely be some sort of bribery going on to cause the TC guy to change those answers on an exam or interview so somebody would flunk. Obviously a personal vendetta of the same magitude of a Mafioso power struggle.

They should just allow anybody who will do whatever is required for the company to make a buck ... like the good old days of a now very long defunct company called "Grovel Airways."

Their business cards used to read something like this ....

Grovel Airways, of Lac La Merde Saskatchewan.

Operating a complete line of maintenance-free aircraft such as the Cessna 180, Norseman, Beech 18, Piper Apache, and Cessna Crane. The multi-engine aircraft are all flown IFR, and equipped for "all weather operations."

Owner ... Hugh G. Reckshun

Operations Manager ... Kenny Doowitt

Chief Pilot ... Ben Dover

Company Specialty Operations:

-Flight in weather that keeps cowards from other companies on the ground. We do the job, then write the invoice.

-Flying a Mexican bus load of anything that will fit in, or on an airplane to anywhere it needs to go, and burn less gas doing it.

-Hiring new pilots and AMEs.

-Avoiding Transport Canada Inspections and audits.

The company motto:

"Nos Adepto Per"

Translation ..... "We get through"

Regrettably far too many Chief Pilots and Ops Mgrs have been co-opted by company owners or sometimes good old fashioned greed .... the owners often have been disallowed from holding sr mgt positions by Transport ... and their employee CPs and Ops Mgrs are only there to satisfy TC in name only. The owner still is the real Ops Mgr, Chief Pilot, DOM, and everything else in the company.

The employee Ops Mgr and CPs do nothing except serve to keep the AOC alive for a few months longer until the next candidate comes along who isn't quite as "lippy" when it comes to complaining about flying overloads, flying beyond inspections, falsifying hot section inspections that were done overnight, forcing AMEs into signing out airplanes that have only had "an oil change annual," faking the training records of pilots, firing pilots who snag defects in the logbook ... that serves as an example to the rest of the lazy jerks on staff, threatening people with firing right after they have taken on obligations like having a child, getting married, or buying a house .... that's a perfect time to tighten the thumscrews on an employee and increase the stress level on a "workin' stiff" who will be in deep caca if he/she goes without a paycheque for a week.

A pilot doesn't like flying into some runway with 9 inch deep gumbo in heavy rain? Oh, we'll "straighten him out" by leaving him at home for a couple of weeks with no dispatches while everybody else flys and he/she contemplates whether they can pay the rent this month.

Yup ... in Canada, we sure need a lot more companies with those managerial skills flying the general public around, and hiring a whole new crop of AME apprentices and commercial pilots and "teachin' 'em right" so they are of some use to somebody.

The Old Fogducker

edited to remove some typos that I missed

[polar one]

First of all foggy, I am not going to complain for you using my real name and identifying me in your rant.

Actually quite humerous...almost sounds like a TC sponsored post..Seriously, in other jurisdictions they pretty much do allow anyone to hold the ops mgr and CP positions. But...and this is a big but...they have an accountable manager, and if the ops mgr or CP screws up, it is the accountable manager that is held responsible. It is, in my opinion, a better system. Allows the very senior mgt/owner to chose someone that has attributes other than TC wants, and , even better, puts the responsbility for the operations squarely back on them.

Which brings me to my point. Sometimes there are other options than the TC, lets tow the line one. Trying to make a flawed policy unflawed by humor or draconian enforcement is not necessarily the best way. Maybe TC should look at alternatives.

[lost in the north]

fogducker,can a person hold all positions in a small vfr company,if not that can be a nightmare for the operator due to high turnover

[Dust Devil]

fogducker,can a person hold all positions in a small vfr company,if not that can be a nightmare for the operator due to high turnover

One person can hold all positions in a small IFR operation depending on the individual although it is discouraged. In my operation I divided the responsibilities up but I also have the staff to handle it. In an operation like my company used to be before I took it over the owner held all three jobs he was also the only pilot on staff. (this was before an accountable executive was needed)

[The Old Fogducker]

Lost:

It is as the erudite Dust Devil explained.

But ...it must be a small operation ... like maybe 2 or 3 airplanes and have a laid out plan as to how it will be managed, and self-audited to catch errors and then have a way to make sure they won't happen again... or maybe have someone from outside do an annual audit ... it comes down to having some way which will be effective for the amount of flying being done without a single person becoming overloaded and then start to make stupid errors and things slip through ... which in turn leads to ......

Trouble with a capital T, and that rhymes with P.....which stands for "Popped" .... which is what will happen to the AOC. The first big step on the road to degredation ... first its medicinal wine from a teaspoon, then its beer from a bottle! Before ya know it, your son is playing for money in a pinch-back suit and ... well, the rest isn't very pleasant.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qam1fbQmA_s

OFD

[Big Pistons Forever]

Has an accountable executive ever been held "accountable" in any meaningfull way ?

[The Old Fogducker]

BPF ... I think I recall one being told "You'd better watch it fella. We may have to contemplate further action."

Seriously though, I wonder that too.

The owner of Fast Air may have had action taken against him as the AE in the recent TC investigation of the company and assignment of somewhere around a quarter million dollar assessment of liability. Frankly, I don't know.

OFD

[lost in the north]

fogducker,Having a discussion with another pilot and need your help.Can the prm in a vfr company with no mel defer a un servicable altinator,vac pump,or art. horizon till next inspection or or must they be fixed before further flight.

[VRC9170]

I was a 703 operator with three airplanes. I was owner, Accountable executive, Ops manager, Directer of maintenance, Chief pilot, one of three pilots and I even washed the planes once in awhile.
V

[VRC9170]

Another matter of interest. I originally appointed the Chief engineer of my contract maintenance contractor as my director of maintenance, but TCa disallowed it as it was percieved as a conflict of interest. Wouldn't it seem an owner as DOM would more likely be the one with the conflict of interest?

[Dust Devil]

Lost:

It is as the erudite Dust Devil explained.

But ...it must be a small operation ... like maybe 2 or 3 airplanes and have a laid out plan as to how it will be managed, and self-audited to catch errors and then have a way to make sure they won't happen again... or maybe have someone from outside do an annual audit ... it comes down to having some way which will be effective for the amount of flying being done without a single person becoming overloaded and then start to make stupid errors and things slip through ... which in turn leads to ......

Trouble with a capital T, and that rhymes with P.....which stands for "Popped" .... which is what will happen to the AOC. The first big step on the road to degredation ... first its medicinal wine from a teaspoon, then its beer from a bottle! Before ya know it, your son is playing for money in a pinch-back suit and ... well, the rest isn't very pleasant.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qam1fbQmA_s

OFD

I had to look up erudite in case it meant "rounded at the free end".

10 points to the person who remembers that reference.

[Dust Devil]

Another matter of interest. I originally appointed the Chief engineer of my contract maintenance contractor as my director of maintenance, but TCa disallowed it as it was percieved as a conflict of interest. Wouldn't it seem an owner as DOM would more likely be the one with the conflict of interest?

You would think so.

[J31]

fogducker,Having a discussion with another pilot and need your help.Can the prm in a vfr company with no mel defer a un servicable altinator,vac pump,or art. horizon till next inspection or or must they be fixed before further flight.

An alternator, vacuum pump, or artificial horizon are all most likely on the type certificate thus required to be serviceable. Items like an ADF if unserviceable need to be removed before flight.

TC does have a MEL program that operators can set up very easily for their aircraft.

[lionheart27]

So just so I can read between the lines here.
Are we taking a company violation or a management violation?
It was mentioned that the said company had a figurehead type management structure to perform illegal activity
A companies name was mentioned by "Foggy". Interesting how I just read up on them
Is this a correlated story or a past example?
Is it possible to original poster to PM me the info on the said company talked about. My interest is to avoid such companies if they are in violation.

[The Old Fogducker]

Grovel Airways is not affliated with the subject of this thread.

However, the described events are played out on a regular basis, and happened at a company for whom I worked earlier in my career. At the time, it was the fourth largest air carrier in the country by vitue of the total number of aircraft (fixed wing and rotary) on the registry.

Same routine as we see here, but before the internet .... TC would take action ... (or at least attempt to) ... and the letters would start ... "Oh, they are a great company. Must be an Inspector with an axe to grind, and a hate on for a particular rooster in the barnyard. They couldn't make it in the real world, so they want to take down anyone who is successful."

In other words, after almost 40 years in this business, I regret to say, "its the same old same old."

Maybe we need another MLA or MP to be killed so they have the political will to shine a bright light on the situation as was the case in Northern Alberta about 25 years ago.

Still, I'd like to give Martin Eley a chance. He's the first TC boss to at least say the right things when he took office instead of the usual weasel-worded senior Civil Servant lexicon excerpted from an episode of "Yes Minister." Now, lets see if the walk matches the talk.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FRVvjGL2C0

The Old Fogducker

[1000 HP]

I suspect that Looproll was quoting George Orwell... That rumbling sound you hear is the old gentleman spinning in his grave as he contemplates the Canadian Government, Homeland Whatzit, airport "security," and all the rest of the crap and twaddle we have to deal with nowadays.

Cat would have something to say about all this; seems if we knock all the rough edges off this site it will not be a site worth visiting any more.

I have a copy of 1984. Read it in the seventies, it seemed like apocalypse sci-fi. Now, as I drive down the street, I look up and see cameras everywhere. I have a cell phone, but I take the battery out now and then. My computer does not have a cam. Paranoid?

[lionheart27]

I guess in 1984 terms we'd be dealing with "PAR 101" not Room 101

Ran into this on YouTube showing a on going issue in the registration process for a 135 cert and the like.
Sometimes waiting up to 2-3 yrs because of a computer regulator of FAA Inspectors. Is this the same in TC's case and operators getting annoyed with this?

Foggy...I was referring to Fast Air?

[oldncold]

The issue really is 2 fold

1/ fairness if one region say ok and the other says no then it is no wonder there is a credibility gap and especially when the candidate has to read between tea leaves. the car 723. 07 (2)(a)(i)A a says have or have held not not be current on. When a tc superintendant from cyyz region says ok he would not stop the nomination especially since the canditate has passed the exams before, has no violations that would prevent the nomination from going to due process gives one interpertation and a bull headed poi says no to the candidate and won't allow the exams to be written . yyz region says even if the type rating were an absolute must there are "internal risk assements" that are done usually an audit 6 months after granting nomination to verify or correct any weakness if any." but for a poi to bar someone from employment runs smack into the canadian charter not a smart move. "

2) when tc creates a process and fails to follow their own due processes to go forward. how in the world due they expect or morally have the right to demand the rest of us to as well to follow the rules?

fly safe big brother is watching