The next hiring wave

[rocco1]

You do remember 3 years ago`. It was a great hiring wave, dispite what most of people says:`` there are more pilots then jobs``. But 3 years ago the situation was so different?

We are like are surfers awaiting for the next hiring wave. When it will be?

[merlin]

early 2020s.

[iflyforpie]

It ranges from intolerable (the good times) to impossible (the bad times).

The good times still mean there is an oversupply of pilots, which means low wages, questionable working conditions, bonds, and going into the middle of BFN to learn how a float pump or fork lift works.

The bad times mean that even in spite of all the above concessions, nobody will hire you...

Give it a couple more years.

[rocco1]

I still do not understand how possible was the last wave... I dont think that the last 3 years Canada gave birth to an incredible number of new pilots. What is going on? 3 years ago, flight schools made a lot of maney selling the pilot certificate program, based on the great hiring wave. After 3 years it looks like it was just a dream:`` opss! wake up it was just a dream!

[lionheart27]

Its also quite possible our looking in the wrong places!

[rocco1]

what do u meam with ``looking in the wrong place``

[loopa]

I still do not understand how possible was the last wave... I dont think that the last 3 years Canada gave birth to an incredible number of new pilots. What is going on? 3 years ago, flight schools made a lot of maney selling the pilot certificate program, based on the great hiring wave. After 3 years it looks like it was just a dream:`` opss! wake up it was just a dream!

I agree with you, but the previous unemployed numbers are still rather high I think.

[rocco1]

http://thetruthabouttheprofession.weebly.com/

have a good reading

[JohnnyDrama]

So much negativity... Yes times are tough right now but it is not impossible. For all the guys who are just starting out and can't find work...it will turn around. Don't give up. In my opinion things are starting to get better but it will take a bit of time.

2020? Really? I'd be willing to bet that by next spring we will see a noticeable difference. Maybe not a big "hiring wave" but a lot less pilots out of work.

Good luck to everyone who is looking.

[merlin]

well depending who you listen to and what you think of past trends.... the next major economic up swing is likely to be in the early 2020s.

forsure I think there will be more hiring than the current state before then.... but next big wave....

[Rowdy]

I can see things swinging already. it may not be amazing.. but it's deffinatly getting better.

[tsgas]

You know times are bad when Voyageur still has pilots laid off.

[Panama Jack]

From what I have read, expect the next wave in two years from now. Get ready.

[co-joe]

Right now the only "major" hiring is WJ and they only hire from other airlines. As long as Jazz and AC aren't hiring we know we're at least a year away from seeing lots of hiring at a 703 level. Once Jazz and AC start doing interviews start your timer and wait a full year, then there will be a trickle down effect as everyone starts clamouring for a better seat. "This is know as the music playing."

First the companies down south will start to loose their highest time pilots to the airlines but they will only be looking for direct entry captains or recalling laid off crews. The people lost up north and forgotten about will start getting interviews down south and eventually moving. The companies up north will start upgrading or hiring more direct entry captains since there are many experienced drivers out of work willing to go north to get back into the industry.

Then and only then will there start to be holes to fill and jobs will start showing up for the rest of humanity. Unfortunately it's very quiet on the dance floor right now.

[Carrier]

Quote: "As long as Jazz and AC aren't hiring...."

There must be some movement. Has nobody retired from AC? I suspect some retire each year so they would need to be replaced just to maintain the staff complement. Similarly, if WJ or AC have taken any Jazz people then those would need to be replaced to maintain the Jazz complement.

[Mihai]

Don't forget Air Transat - They hired 16 new pilots this year

[JohnnyDrama]

The above statement is only partially true. AC and Jazz are not the only companies that make our industry move. Yes they impact things a lot when they are hiring tons of people in a short period. There are guys retiring all over the place all the time including small 703/704 operators. You don't have to be in the airlines to retire...

The reason things are bad right now is not because Jazz and AC are not hiring but because of all the guys who were laid off due to the recession. Companies all over the place have started to get moving again and a lot of them have recalled these laid off pilots. I know there are still guys out of work but just give it a bit longer.

It's true that we probably wont see a major hiring wave until the airlines start picking things up a lot but I wouldn't be surprised if that starts to happen later on this year/early next year.

[rocco1]

I think is not that predictable. 1 year 2 years.....How do we know. The math doesn`t apply in this topic. Lots of pilots are waiting to be re-hired after laid off. But maybe some of them decided to change career or so. Anything can happen..Another economical crise,etc. Maybe the big wave is now. We can`t underestimate this industry so quikly. Lots operator up north, up west, up east, up south. Personality makes a big difference. The right approach maight be the key. Sure, I undrstand that if there are not jobs, even the right attitude wont help much, but might create the base for a future hiring.

anyhow....we are surfing the right wave.

good luck to all of you

[Switchfoot]

Right now the only "major" hiring is WJ and they only hire from other airlines.

That's not quite true. YES, WestJet is hiring...but not JUST from other airlines. I happen to know someone who just got hired at WJ from flying a King Air.

Switchfoot.

[skyoffice]

Hi Switchfoot

What type of King Air flying did they have? BE20, 1900?
Just curious as the latest tid bit I heard was they were set on jet time.......although I don't believe everything I hear.
Any info would be great!!!
Thanks

[co-joe]

I guess reading Rocco's link kind of put me in a negative head space. Lots of sad but true info there. Not trying to get all chicken little on you here or anything.

Hey, that's a good omen switch. At least I'm telling myself that. As long as they (your king air friend) don't take one extra hour of sim time over the hundreds of Jazz hires then maybe there's hope for the rest of the good pilots with great experience who don't have large aircraft, sched, or jet time to get a shot at WJ. I personally don't know a single King Air pilot who's been successful with the interview with only King Air time, not even a non CMA 1900 pilot for that matter.

The fact that Transat hired a large class is great news, I think Porter has done a bunch as well too. There are positive signs, you just won't see 10 new job ads a day here until mainline and Jazz have ramped up their hiring machines for a good period of time.

[lionheart27]

At the risk of sounding to positive but it's mentioned on here that about 50 or so positions opened up between Air Transat, WestJet, Jazz and Porter plus all the other Medevac's that took people on.
Still not enough for everybody but a slight improvement and an upswing into the future.

Good hunting

[rocco1]

Guys, was not my intention to dicourage anyone. I was Just thinking how all of us without job, and most of us, with lots of experience wil be absorbd in this ``looks like`` small industry. As far as the king air pilot jumping on the 737 there is nothing wrong or strange. Please keep in mind how things works in europe. We look like thousands of pilots line up awaiting for our turn. Please help me to understand where is the reality. You see, if the market, the world market for pilots was open, we could explore other opportunities. Burocracy, however, doesnt allow that.conversion, type rating, passport etc. Otherwise most of us would not be too focus what is happening in Canada, but having an eye open to all the others opportunities in the world.

Hope to be clear

please correct me if I am wrong
ciao

[skyoffice]

Hey, that's a good omen switch. At least I'm telling myself that. As long as they (your king air friend) don't take one extra hour of sim time over the hundreds of Jazz hires then maybe there's hope for the rest of the good pilots with great experience who don't have large aircraft, sched, or jet time to get a shot at WJ. I personally don't know a single King Air pilot who's been successful with the interview with only King Air time, not even a non CMA 1900 pilot for that matter.

It is discouraging to think a King Air pilot with 5000/6000+ hours would not be considered by WestJet.
In all reality most flying is sched - whether you are flying exec charters, medivacs, etc. Is there that much of a difference between flying out of the main terminal at YYC to picking up executives at the Esso in YYC that you wouldn't be considered for an interview.....and for those of you who fly or have flown medivacs, well you all know that a portion of medivacs are pre-books with a scheduled departure time. As for the jet time that I understand but some of us didn't jump from job to job chasing jet time or larger aircraft, instead we were loyal employees who became captains, chief pilots, training captains, etc. As for larger aircraft time it would be nice to hear if anyone with King Air time has been hired with WestJet - as co-joe said "that's a good omen". When you think about it even some of the smaller King Airs like a BE20 are 12,500 with beautiful avionics that would one up a Dash 8.
I think it shows character that our resume doesn't show half a dozen jobs in as many years.
So when we do apply to WestJet it shows that we want to be there - not because they are the "only ones" hiring.....
One only hopes that WestJet doesn't just look at the above points (jet, etc) but also looks at the character of the pilot, her/his past employment, internal recommends, etc.
Any King Air pilots out there who have had success with the WestJet interview processes - let us know..........

[co-joe]

...insert sound of crickets here...


No you pretty much have to go to Jazz, CMA/ Georgian, Empress, or fly a jet/ large a/c to have a real chance with WS. I've read a few discussions about it, and it sounds pretty much like a dollars and cents issue. King Air pilots cost more to train than do jet, dash, or CMA pilots. Every extra dollar the training department spends means a lower share price for the owners.

Here's to better times. They'll be here soon enough.