T.C shuts part of Skyward down

[Localizer]

Disco ..

You need to develop better social skills/communication skills (this isn't an attack .. more of an observation) .. you don't need to defend yourself when someone attacks you out of frustration .. understand, its not directed the way you might be taking it .. Just stop, think, and understand .. everyone else will understand aswell .. the debate is over now, theres nothing left to debate about ..

[i smell burnt toast]

I would like to take this time to thank everyone for their kind hearted posts over the last hard months. I was, and always will be proud to say that i worked for sgk, and most of all would like to thank those that faught to the bitter end to try to save the airline.

There are many reasons why non of the sgk employees posted on here until the end. Out of respect for eachother, understanding, lack of knowledge on the subject...but most of all....we had other more pressing problems than to post on here non stop. Speculation does more harm than good, and little birdies belong on cartoons...not on here.

It truely amazes me that some of you out there believe that you are better because of the paint scheme on the tail. Are you a better pilot because you work for a company that turns over millions of dollars, flies high and fast, and makes good money doing it. Sounds to me like better managers, not better pilots. Some of our pilots have now moved on to stonger companies financially, with newer equipment. I ask you this....are they now better pilots?

There is not a pilot out there that hasn't flown a plane on mel, or with deferred snags, no matter how incredibly flawless the maintenance department is, or how deep the pockets are on the investors.

Some of you have missed the point, sure skyward had faults....but they were not unsafe. Flying in the environment that they did...the track record speaks for itself. Having a Manual that says "SHOULD" instead of "SHALL" doesn't keep anything safe. Sure, they found paper trail stuff, and snags on the aircraft....thats what they are paid to do. Don't think for a second that good profitable companies have not had aircraft grounded too. My point is that no one is perfect, and those without fault should be the only ones to harp on this company. I can proudly say, without hesitation, that noone at skyward took a plane flying that they did not feel safe to fly in. Do you honestly believe that any of us had a death wish, and took broken planes into the air?

I wish there are more posts on this site as a whole (not just this topic) that were more about pilots helping pilots than every man for himself, and cutting down others. Maybe i'm an idealist....but i think that if someone is asking a question on here...they want a straight forward answer...not someone trying to prove how much they know about nothing.

But hey, this is just one man's opinion, and i fully expect something smart to pop on here soon from the ass of "captain Single& J#ck-off".

For the record....this is my first post ever, as i seem to have a lot of time on my hands now....and i am not hiding behind a new name.

[Check Pilot]

The fact is that pilots went ahead and flew the aeroplanes with known problems and then compensated for those mechanical defects by whatever means.

As much as the guys flew with those defects, they knew nothing of the real nature of those maintenance defects.

Like all pilots want to do, even if they don't like it, when the engineer signed it out as "O.K." the average pilot goes ahead and takes the trip.

None of the aircraft you flew have been proven certifiably safe to this day.

It will likely take a long time to prove that certified parts are actually riding along on those airframes.

[twinheli]

I'm with "i smell burnt toast" My hat is off to you!

All pilots need to stick together, its a tough world out there navigating managements decisions whilst staying safe. I feel for Skyward guys and girls; as well as, the Jetsgo pilots. I don’t wish the outcomes on anyone.

[pirocco]

I am with "I smell burn toast" too.
I probably know the guy since I worked with him at Sgk. If you think you are better because your tail was green, darker blue or whatever, I think you missed the point. No one would have take a plane knowing that wasn't airworthy. We had many planes to work with and that wasn't an issue. Very sad what happen there and it was a very good company to work for.

Enjoyed working with you guys!!!
Pirocco

[ONEFORTHETEAM]

"GROUND CHECK SERVICABLE"

REGARDS

[highlander]

to Capt S and J:

Out of curiousity for "us newbies" and "amateurs" to this site, why pick on burnt toast???????

You must like me or something because you haven't ripped me apart yet? I guess you will now?

No offence, but any respect anyone would have had for you and your comments was just washed down the lav. Thanks for showing some compassion for 300 people and their families without work, and people, who till the bitter end spent countless hours trying really hard to get things right when they had no solid idea as to what the future would bring. I really thought there would be more understanding from the green machine folk since we often helped each other out day after day. Sure we had our comepetitive days but many of us got along great with you guys. I know that if roles were reversed the skyward family would have shown ten times more respect towards you.

[highlander]

By The Way "Burnt Toast"


Well Said!!!!!!!!!!!!

Those of us with some sense of worth, respect and basically those of us with a soul understand exactly what you meant. Hang in there!

[Disco Stu]

I really thought there would be more understanding from the green machine folk since we often helped each other out day after day. Sure we had our comepetitive days but many of us got along great with you guys. I know that if roles were reversed the skyward family would have shown ten times more respect towards you.

Please don't paint us all with the same brush.............

[salsa dancer]

Hats off to all who tried to hold everything together in the final days at Skyward Aviation.

The biggest question I have is "how did a company go nine weeks and still not have a plane ready to present to TC?

Maybe, just maybe--there is some thought by the owners to try and set up something out of YWG--under new colors and a new name-with a few of their former employees-big mistake others will be watching to see if this happens

Heard this morning employees will receive their final payroll checks, but no time in lieu, no vacation and no severance--some of the people that fought hard and strong to help the Skyward family come out of this are the same people who will not see any of their extra monies--so in the end they are the ones who got kicked anyway--so in the end the people who tried to help Skyward the most ended up the worst off for trying. Well again to the true Skyward Family-good luck and god bless and when all is said and done Frank& Cheryl, Gord & Helen, Kurt & Inge are the ones who at this point seem to have lost the most--but lets just wait and see.

[mooseport]

Yup everyone lost a lot- including the owners
But don't forget it was a business, it made money, and some of that money was put away for a rainy day. Recently its been raining hard!

So don't tell me that 11 planes owned by the "directors" and leased to the now lifeless Skyward is loosing everything, the directors just got 11 planes back to play with, some worked on for the last 8 weeks on Skyward dollar, an updated/ new manual(s) ready to ink a new name on, on Skywards dollar, a bunch of parts ordered in for the directors planes, on Skyward dollar......

And now Skyward is dead- so they can write it all off and start again. Pretty smart actually!

Proprtionally its a whole lot more others. (Particually if it is true that holiday pay etc will not be paid out) EG All of the pilots who are on the hook for the thousands of dollars in bonds they had to pay for themselves.

The best thing Skyward had was to provide the "opportunity" for its employees. It was the employees that made the place and made the "family". This had nothing to do with the company.

[jabber]

FINAL SCORE:

Transport Canada 1 Skyward 0

Actually, now that they are in receivership, the owners are at more risk than you obviously know. If they don't pay off the secured creditors look whos left on the hook. Its unfortunate that after 57 days of pouring more and more money into trying to get the OC back the money ran out. The owners did more work at this then any of you will ever know and my hat is off to them. And very well put I smell burnt toast. Skywards safety record does speak for itself and I'm surprised it makes 0 difference to any of you that they were a very safe company until TC decided to flex its muscles and show everyone whos in charge. Am I mad you bet, you'd have a very hard time convincing me that Skyward was so unsafe it had to be run out of business.

[A Beautiful Mind]

I am curious about the claim the aircrafts were unsafe by cpt sweetnjuicy ...how do you know? When did you find out about this? Was this common knowledge or did you have inside information? Did you check the Maintenance logs? Did you verify the information you "heard about" or did you give credence to innuendo and rumour in a blatant attempt to glorify your own company? Seeing as you've known about this great injustice being done to the Avaition Industry for so long, I'm guessing someone with your moral standards complained to the authorities (I would be interested in finding out exactly what your complaint was). If you didn't make a complaint but believed the airline to be unsafe, do you believe that you have the right to question anyone else's integrity?
At what point in time did you become an expert on the Operations of the Skyward Management and Maintenance Program? Did you receive a good paycheck from the company or did you volunteer your time over the past few years? AND, seeing as you are apparently psychic and capable of knowing precisely what the pilots of Skyward Aviation thought every time they flew an aircraft, maybe you can figure out what I’m thinking right now (I wouldn’t want to offend anyone else, so we’ll keep it between us Captain Psychic).
You claim to base your opinion on fact and place your opinion in high regard due to the incredible amount of knowledge that you have regarding the Company, it’s procedures and it’s policies You even profess to “know” in absolute terms that the pilot’s of Skyward were either lacking integrity or just didn’t care. I have yet to read more than a few words from you that are fact. So as not to confuse you, Fact = Knowledge or information based on real occurrences (NOT OPINION!!)
The only absolute fact its that Skyward Aviation was shut down…you don’t know why, I don’t know why and any words you type are those of an arrogant man who professes his opinion as factual information.

[A Beautiful Mind]

The fact that you want to be looked at is that you have a contact at TC who is apparently as ignorant to the concept of Professional etiquette as you are. The only difference is that it isn't your job to keep your findings confidential so as not to impede any further progresses the affected Company may achieve in future business ventures, that job would belong to the contact at TC. I can only question why you would believe in a statement made by someone who has no Business ethics; perhaps you are of the same cloth. If your contact deems it appropriate to disclose confidential information to a competitor, do you trust his judgment? From my point of view your contact at TC is in violation of his responsibilities and should not be in any position of authority. S/He is obviously too unprofessional to handle a position of authority and responsibility (ironic that such a person should have any influence on deciding whether or not others are acting responsibly).

Your floundering regarding Hitler and OJ....no comment

Problem Solver or not, if you feel it appropriate to question the integrity of others, it would be best to maintain a higher level of it yourself. Not only your words but also the basic fact of your consorting with your "contact" shows a lack of integrity.

Your statement "I am anti bullshit"...ironic

I agree, a company is made of people, not buildings, not money, not airplanes...people. Many of the people at Skyward are the finest I have ever had the privilege to meet. I wish every single one of you luck in your future and fond memories of your past.

I am not pissed off at you. You have no idea what I do or do not know (there you go again with your psycic thing).
As for your last comment, I don't wish you to shut up, I only wish you'd make more sense when your talking.

[CD]

The fact that you want to be looked at is that you have a contact at TC who is apparently as ignorant to the concept of Professional etiquette as you are. The only difference is that it isn't your job to keep your findings confidential so as not to impede any further progresses the affected Company may achieve in future business ventures, that job would belong to the contact at TC. I can only question why you would believe in a statement made by someone who has no Business ethics; perhaps you are of the same cloth. If your contact deems it appropriate to disclose confidential information to a competitor, do you trust his judgment? From my point of view your contact at TC is in violation of his responsibilities and should not be in any position of authority. S/He is obviously too unprofessional to handle a position of authority and responsibility (ironic that such a person should have any influence on deciding whether or not others are acting responsibly).

I would have to agree with A Beautiful Mind in this instance... Presuming S&J isn't simply trying to make himself sound important and he really has been provided with confidential information, then neither he nor his contact has any apparent ethics or morals. The contact for leaking the information and S&J for repeating the rumours...

[Cat Driver]

CD :

Please, you are a better person than lower yourself to arguing with S&J.

You and I both know that the chances of any TC inspector sharing confidential information as delicate as the shutdown of Skyward with someone outside TC is remote.

For any TC inspector to share confidential information with someone like S&J would hopefully not be remote but impossible...

However if I am wrong God help this industry.

Cat.

[i smell burnt toast]

Transport obviously found something or many things wrong with skyward. There's no hiding that....and i'm not even going to pretend to know anything about if politics had anything to do with it.

My point to my first post...was that the pilots didn't know of the defects. How could they. Is there a pilot out there that can tell me the part no. for the prop governor, the fuel nozzle, fire detection....or better yet....the cannon plug behind your radio stack. I highly doubt that...and even if they new the no. -how do they know its the right one.

It comes down to trust. Trust that the AME did the work properly, trust that the fuel from the truck isn't contaminated, trust that ALL bags are weighed, and trust that non of the pax snuck a bottle of bear spray on the aircraft. Most accidents are a string of small mistakes the lead to something unbearable, and I wish this on not a single person. I know noone on here does either. The fact is that we can only control so much...and to point fingers here is pointless. One can only hope that the other operators learn something about this whole mess...so it never has to happen again.

Now, that being said...there will always be defects. They are machines, and things break down...parts wear, and bad things happen. Isn't that why we all get check rides, and flight tests. Last PPC i had sure wasn't just straight and level flight with a normal landing and takeoff. There is a reason we train for the worst. So that when the unthinkable happens...we are prepared. We pilots as a whole, are paid to hopefully never have to use ALL of our skills. We are a different breed, ALL OF US.

Lets move on, and work on making this career a little more hospitable...and help eachother out in a time of need, because you never know in this industry if your turn is around the corner.

[pilot piglett]

The amount of class displayed by certain individuals whom feel it necessary to impart worlds of wisdom to the already informed is truly hilarious.

C S&J... I lOVE watching you make yourself look like more and more of an a$$ every day...keep it up...you're the best

[sure as shit]

Guys don't get all bent out of shape.
Sweat and Jerkoff's only inside contact is when he's being handed a ticket from enforcement. And the only thing they tell him is he has the right to whine at a tribunal or write the check.
One thing I give him credit for is that his cheque's haven't bounced yet.
Isn't that right S&J?

Sincerely,
your shadow

[sure as shit]

STUPID AND JUICEBAG WROTE:

i can puchase you...your family and your soul and have enough left over to take your dad on a date and give him the lovin your mom never did.



Well ya got me there juicer....

We just finished planting my last parent a couple of months ago so would you like the address of the graveyard? I would love to see what kind of smartass comeback you come up with.
Or do you like doing cold ones?


Keep those cheques on your Labatt's Blue coffee table Juicey. Oh yeah, when you decide to hide again maybe you should run away and hide in a new province....

Sincerely,
Your Shadow

[...]

A FIGHT!!!

[Canus Chinookus]

"Aviation....it's about the friends you make...."

anyone else see the irony here!

[A330]

Don't worry.........S&J is some poor hack that knows the best in aviation he has is a pedestrian airline of out Winnipeg. Look at the way he writes;it's bush all the way. You'd like to take some guy's Dad on a date? Don't you mean his Mom? Man, you're profile is scary.......god help the poor person that has to deal with that CRM.

[Cat Driver]

A330 :

".......god help the poor person that has to deal with that CRM. "

How about S&J and Check Pilot in the same airplane....I'd love to listen to the CVR in that one...

[Canus Chinookus]