I can't seem to find a rule one way or the other regarding a company positioning you prior to a flight. There is just a general statement that your duty day starts when you "report for a flight".
Can the company airline you for 6 hours and then fly you for 14?
100.01
"flight duty time" - means the period that starts when a flight crew member reports for a flight, or reports as a flight crew member on standby, and finishes at "engines off" or "rotors stopped" at the end of the final flight, except in the case of a flight conducted under Subpart 4 or 5 of Part VII, in which case the period finishes 15 minutes after "engines off" or "rotors stopped" at the end of the final flight, and includes the time required to complete any duties assigned by the air operator or private operator or delegated by the Minister prior to the reporting time and includes the time required to complete aircraft maintenance engineer duties prior to or following a flight;
Reporting for a flight
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tired of the ground
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Re: Reporting for a flight
Reporting time is the same whether you are reporting for a flight you are operating or a deadhead. When you report for work, you report for work. Where it gets complicated is for deadheads after operating.
Re: Reporting for a flight
Refer to CAR 700.16:
Flight Duty Time Limitations and Rest Periods
700.16 (1) Subject to subsections (5) and (7), no air operator shall assign a flight crew member for flight duty time, and no flight crew member shall accept such an assignment, if the flight crew member's flight duty time will, as a result, exceed 14 consecutive hours in any 24 consecutive hours. Where the flight is conducted under Subpart 4 or 5 using an aircraft other than a helicopter, flight duty time shall include 15 minutes for post-flight duties.
There is more to the reg and you can look the rest up yourself as well as the Standard that applies, under 725...
Flight Duty Time Limitations and Rest Periods
700.16 (1) Subject to subsections (5) and (7), no air operator shall assign a flight crew member for flight duty time, and no flight crew member shall accept such an assignment, if the flight crew member's flight duty time will, as a result, exceed 14 consecutive hours in any 24 consecutive hours. Where the flight is conducted under Subpart 4 or 5 using an aircraft other than a helicopter, flight duty time shall include 15 minutes for post-flight duties.
There is more to the reg and you can look the rest up yourself as well as the Standard that applies, under 725...
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tired of the ground
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Re: Reporting for a flight
I've seen all that but there isn't anything that defines when you begin your duty day. It just says it begins when you report for a flight. Is that the flight you're crewing? Is that your deadheading flight? Is that when you drop your girlfriend off for a flight?
I'm really wondering if someone had seen guidance material, a CBAAC or knew of an obscure CAR that stated when a duty day begins eg. When you are required to report for company purposes.
I can figure it out for myself what the intent of the rule is. I just wanted to see something that would make sense if you were to end up in a courtroom explaining yourself.
I'm really wondering if someone had seen guidance material, a CBAAC or knew of an obscure CAR that stated when a duty day begins eg. When you are required to report for company purposes.
I can figure it out for myself what the intent of the rule is. I just wanted to see something that would make sense if you were to end up in a courtroom explaining yourself.
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The Old Fogducker
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Re: Reporting for a flight
The dividing line comes when the boss has you do something vs you making the decsion ... for example:
The company asks you to hop on Air Canada and fly to Vancouver to pick up an airplane that's fresh out of the paint shop, and fly it home to put it back on the line, and have bought your ticket for you.
Your flight to VR is 3 hours from the time you show up at the ticket counter til you get out of the taxi at the paint shop.
You fly the machine back to the Joe Schmoe Airport and that takes 6 hours from the time you've walked across the threshold of the paint shop until you have put the airplane to bed and are about to walk out the door of Eager Beaver Air. Now you are at 9 hours into a "typical" 14 hour duty day.
Just as you're about to head for the parking lot with plans to corner your girlfriend the moment you walk in the door of home, company founder, Mr Beaver comes to you and says he'd like you to do some float flying to do diamond drill camp moves in the Single Otter because his son has called in sick yet again. He figures there is roughly 7 hours left to sunset, and he expects you to fly until official dark .... "to help him out."
Can you accept and do the float flying that he expects? Can he dispatch you for the flying?
No .... not without exceeding the 14 hour time limit which under certain circumstances can extend to 15. That would be a 16 hour day and would be a dual offence.....one against the pilot for accepting, one against the company for dispatching.
Now we'll change that up a little .... you decided to stay in the sack with your new girlfriend for an extra night before going to VR to pick up the airplane that Eager Beaver Air wanted picked up and flown home in the mid-morning, or whenever the airplane was ready. The shop would give you a call at the hotel and give you a couple of hours warning that things were pretty well set to go. Mr Beaver had suggested that you overnight in a hotel near the airport on their dime and fly out the afternoon before. You decline because you've surrendered to the charms and interesting oscillating rhythms of your new girl. You hop on the three hour flight to YVR after a night of .... well, .... "expending yourself."
Can you do the 7 hours of float flying on The Single Swine and have your brain vibrated off its mounts? Yes ... because your boss Mr Beaver didn't have you reporting to pick up the painted aircraft with the transit to YVR as part of your Duty Day..... which would now be a 13 hour day. You made the decision to arrange your day in such a manner as to have you end up "working" a 16 hour day to reap the benefits of being able to sleep in your own bed, and "depleting yourself" of reserve energy.
Sometimes commuters can end up in the same position, and I have oft times wondered about just how long some of the long haul guys were awake when they domicile in YVR, hold YYZ as a base, and fly to Outer Mongolia on a max duty day in the bad old days before approved rest on the flight deck. No wonder some of them looked 80 by the time they retired at 60 and died within 2 or 3 years of hanging up their headsets.
Is there specific guidance material similar to what I've just laid out? Not that I'm aware of, but one of the regular readers of this type of thread ... "A Regulator" may chime in with some helpful info.
All the best,
The Old Fogducker
The company asks you to hop on Air Canada and fly to Vancouver to pick up an airplane that's fresh out of the paint shop, and fly it home to put it back on the line, and have bought your ticket for you.
Your flight to VR is 3 hours from the time you show up at the ticket counter til you get out of the taxi at the paint shop.
You fly the machine back to the Joe Schmoe Airport and that takes 6 hours from the time you've walked across the threshold of the paint shop until you have put the airplane to bed and are about to walk out the door of Eager Beaver Air. Now you are at 9 hours into a "typical" 14 hour duty day.
Just as you're about to head for the parking lot with plans to corner your girlfriend the moment you walk in the door of home, company founder, Mr Beaver comes to you and says he'd like you to do some float flying to do diamond drill camp moves in the Single Otter because his son has called in sick yet again. He figures there is roughly 7 hours left to sunset, and he expects you to fly until official dark .... "to help him out."
Can you accept and do the float flying that he expects? Can he dispatch you for the flying?
No .... not without exceeding the 14 hour time limit which under certain circumstances can extend to 15. That would be a 16 hour day and would be a dual offence.....one against the pilot for accepting, one against the company for dispatching.
Now we'll change that up a little .... you decided to stay in the sack with your new girlfriend for an extra night before going to VR to pick up the airplane that Eager Beaver Air wanted picked up and flown home in the mid-morning, or whenever the airplane was ready. The shop would give you a call at the hotel and give you a couple of hours warning that things were pretty well set to go. Mr Beaver had suggested that you overnight in a hotel near the airport on their dime and fly out the afternoon before. You decline because you've surrendered to the charms and interesting oscillating rhythms of your new girl. You hop on the three hour flight to YVR after a night of .... well, .... "expending yourself."
Can you do the 7 hours of float flying on The Single Swine and have your brain vibrated off its mounts? Yes ... because your boss Mr Beaver didn't have you reporting to pick up the painted aircraft with the transit to YVR as part of your Duty Day..... which would now be a 13 hour day. You made the decision to arrange your day in such a manner as to have you end up "working" a 16 hour day to reap the benefits of being able to sleep in your own bed, and "depleting yourself" of reserve energy.
Sometimes commuters can end up in the same position, and I have oft times wondered about just how long some of the long haul guys were awake when they domicile in YVR, hold YYZ as a base, and fly to Outer Mongolia on a max duty day in the bad old days before approved rest on the flight deck. No wonder some of them looked 80 by the time they retired at 60 and died within 2 or 3 years of hanging up their headsets.
Is there specific guidance material similar to what I've just laid out? Not that I'm aware of, but one of the regular readers of this type of thread ... "A Regulator" may chime in with some helpful info.
All the best,
The Old Fogducker
Re: Reporting for a flight
That's a good explanation Foggy, but for the last bit; you do not have the discretion to choose to work longer than 14 hours (the unforeseen circumstances would NOT be an unexpected trip) so despite the nice night in bed, you will still be violating the rules.
Here's one for you - you are the copilot on a long-range jet and you are awoken in the morning to answer the phone, to be asked by the captain to do the flight plan for the afternoon's flight and the customs crap. You spend a couple of hours starting at 09:00 messing with Homeland Security on your computer. The flight is delayed because the owners are late and leaves at 16:00. Your duty day is now 7 hours long. You fly to your first destination in the US (Miami) and the customs/fueling is not too bad, 2 hours. You tell your captain that your duty day will end in 2 hours but you have a crossing to do yet, you will be going to LSZH (for example) which takes, oh, 6 hours plus an hour to park and clean the jet. There are 5 passengers on board.
The captain says your duty day started at 14:30 when you arrived at the airport and you will have 13.5 hours but you say it began with the customs/flightplan and your day will be 19. His day started even earlier than yours because he was dealing with the owners.
Who is right? What will you do? Refuse to fly the crossing and stay the night in Miami so that the meeting the next morning will not happen? Go anyway? Will everyone be pleased that you stuck to your guns and refused to break the law or did you just shoot yourself in the foot (no question about the last one, I just threw that in!).
Here's one for you - you are the copilot on a long-range jet and you are awoken in the morning to answer the phone, to be asked by the captain to do the flight plan for the afternoon's flight and the customs crap. You spend a couple of hours starting at 09:00 messing with Homeland Security on your computer. The flight is delayed because the owners are late and leaves at 16:00. Your duty day is now 7 hours long. You fly to your first destination in the US (Miami) and the customs/fueling is not too bad, 2 hours. You tell your captain that your duty day will end in 2 hours but you have a crossing to do yet, you will be going to LSZH (for example) which takes, oh, 6 hours plus an hour to park and clean the jet. There are 5 passengers on board.
The captain says your duty day started at 14:30 when you arrived at the airport and you will have 13.5 hours but you say it began with the customs/flightplan and your day will be 19. His day started even earlier than yours because he was dealing with the owners.
Who is right? What will you do? Refuse to fly the crossing and stay the night in Miami so that the meeting the next morning will not happen? Go anyway? Will everyone be pleased that you stuck to your guns and refused to break the law or did you just shoot yourself in the foot (no question about the last one, I just threw that in!).
"What's it doing now?"
"Fly low and slow and throttle back in the turns."
"Fly low and slow and throttle back in the turns."
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Ref Plus 10
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Re: Reporting for a flight
I'll look for the exact reference, but I seem to remember something about if required to reposition as a passenger, your duty day starts, but the time is only half towards your duty day. Example, fly from Ottawa to Iqaluit, show up for the flight at 7am...get to Iqaluit at say 12, there's 5 hours, now the company can use you for another 11.5 hours before your duty day is done. Like I said, it's from memory, but I will try to find the CARs reference.
Ref
Ref
Re: Reporting for a flight
Tired...:
Your duty day commences when you report for duty, whether that duty includes operating the aircraft or deadheading to then operate an aircraft. The Company Operations Manual for a given Air Carrier defines the reporting time. Some carriers may specify 60 minutes prior to sched, some 90 etc.
There is no half time credit considered when deadheading for the purposes of commencing flight duty. However, if at the end of your flying day, you are to then deadhead back - resulting in exceeding the 14 duty day, the time spent deadheading counts for half and must be added onto the additional rest time. (This is at least how I recall it).
Below is guidance information provided to flight training units, however the definitions and requirments hold true to commerical carriers, as stated in the link. Hope this satisfies your quest for the definition.
http://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/civilaviation/s ... t-2021.htm
Your duty day commences when you report for duty, whether that duty includes operating the aircraft or deadheading to then operate an aircraft. The Company Operations Manual for a given Air Carrier defines the reporting time. Some carriers may specify 60 minutes prior to sched, some 90 etc.
There is no half time credit considered when deadheading for the purposes of commencing flight duty. However, if at the end of your flying day, you are to then deadhead back - resulting in exceeding the 14 duty day, the time spent deadheading counts for half and must be added onto the additional rest time. (This is at least how I recall it).
Below is guidance information provided to flight training units, however the definitions and requirments hold true to commerical carriers, as stated in the link. Hope this satisfies your quest for the definition.
http://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/civilaviation/s ... t-2021.htm
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The Old Fogducker
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Re: Reporting for a flight
XS ... that's what I get for writing stuff in the middle of the night.
I failed to explain the reason why the day can be extended to 15 hours ... for unforseen circumstances.
Last fight out of the drill camp, you fall in the water, get badly chilled and have to warm up by the fire until you can fly .... or, being the lifestyle associated with herding the Single Swine ... you make a huge error in judgement and allow one of the drillers to hold onto the only rope that is attached to the airplane in a strong wind while you go to have a quick whizz. The driller drops the rope in a gust, and the airplane starts to drift away. Luckily, its a small bay, and by running along the shoreline for a quarter mile, and then wading through 2 feet of Loon Shit and cat tails, you catch the thing, spark it up and then taxi back to load the last few things and people, then head for home base.
So ends an extended duty day.
The Ops Mgr then files a report with the company POI at Transport, and life is good for another day. The next day starts one hour later than "normal" for the Single Swine herder.
The Old Fogducker
I failed to explain the reason why the day can be extended to 15 hours ... for unforseen circumstances.
Last fight out of the drill camp, you fall in the water, get badly chilled and have to warm up by the fire until you can fly .... or, being the lifestyle associated with herding the Single Swine ... you make a huge error in judgement and allow one of the drillers to hold onto the only rope that is attached to the airplane in a strong wind while you go to have a quick whizz. The driller drops the rope in a gust, and the airplane starts to drift away. Luckily, its a small bay, and by running along the shoreline for a quarter mile, and then wading through 2 feet of Loon Shit and cat tails, you catch the thing, spark it up and then taxi back to load the last few things and people, then head for home base.
So ends an extended duty day.
The Ops Mgr then files a report with the company POI at Transport, and life is good for another day. The next day starts one hour later than "normal" for the Single Swine herder.
The Old Fogducker
Re: Reporting for a flight
As the original poster indicated, duty time regulations apply to "flight duty time" for which he also provides the CAR's definition. Nothing in there addresses positioning flights before actually flying an aircraft, unlike positioning afterward where the CAR's stipulate increased rest periods. There is also nothing in the standard (CASS) or the guidance material to offer a concrete answer.
I would look to your company operations manual in this case. Every company I've ever worked for included a provision for positioning before the flight as part of the "flight duty time", and yours probably would as well especially if you fly for a 705 carrier. Failing that you could always call or better yet write to Transport Canada and get their written interpretation.
I would look to your company operations manual in this case. Every company I've ever worked for included a provision for positioning before the flight as part of the "flight duty time", and yours probably would as well especially if you fly for a 705 carrier. Failing that you could always call or better yet write to Transport Canada and get their written interpretation.
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A Regulator
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Re: Reporting for a flight
"flight crew member on reserve" - means a flight crew member who has been designated by an air operator to be available to report for flight duty on notice of more than one hour;
"flight crew member on call" - means a flight crew member who has been designated by an air operator to be available to report for flight duty on notice of one hour or less;
"flight crew member on standby" - means a flight crew member who has been designated by an air operator or private operator to remain at a specified location in order to be available to report for flight duty on notice of one hour or less;
"crew member" - means a person assigned to duty in an aircraft during flight time;
"flight crew member" - means a crew member assigned to act as pilot or flight engineer of an aircraft during flight time;
"flight deck duty time" - means the period spent by a flight crew member at a flight crew member position in an aeroplane during flight time;
"flight duty time" - means the period that starts when a flight crew member reports for a flight, or reports as a flight crew member on standby, and finishes at "engines off" or "rotors stopped" at the end of the final flight, except in the case of a flight conducted under Subpart 4 or 5 of Part VII, in which case the period finishes 15 minutes after "engines off" or "rotors stopped" at the end of the final flight, and includes the time required to complete any duties assigned by the air operator or private operator or delegated by the Minister prior to the reporting time and includes the time required to complete aircraft maintenance engineer duties prior to or following a flight;
"flight time" - means the time from the moment an aircraft first moves under its own power for the purpose of taking off until the moment it comes to rest at the end of the flight;
700.21 (1) An air operator shall provide flight crew members on reserve, within each 24-hour period, with a rest period that meets the requirements of the Commercial Air Service Standards.
720.21 Flight Crew Members on Reserve
The standards for compliance with this section are:
(1) An air operator shall provide each flight crew member with an opportunity to obtain at least 8 consecutive hours sleep in any 24 consecutive hours while on reserve by one of the following methods:
(a) the air operator shall provide the flight crew member with 24 hours notice of the time of commencement and duration of the rest period. The designated rest period cannot shift more than 3 hours earlier or later than the preceding rest period, nor more than a total of 8 hours in any 7 consecutive days;
(b) the flight crew member shall be given a minimum of 10 hours notice of the assignment and shall not be assigned any duty for these 10 hours; or
(c) the air operator shall not assign the flight crew member to flight duty time and shall not interrupt the flight crew member's rest period between 22:00 and 06:00 local time.
(2) Where an air operator is unable to provide a flight crew member with a rest period required by subsection (1) and the flight crew member is notified to report for flight duty or the reporting time occurs between 22:00 and 06:00 local time:
(a) the maximum flight duty time shall be 10 consecutive hours; and
(b) the subsequent minimum rest period shall be increased by at least one-half the length of the preceding flight duty time.
700.15 Flight Time Limitations
700.15 (1) Subject to subsection (2), no air operator shall assign a flight crew member for flight time, and no flight crew member shall accept such an assignment, if the flight crew member's total flight time in all flights conducted by the flight crew member will, as a result, exceed
(a) 1,200 hours in any 365 consecutive days;
(b) 300 hours in any 90 consecutive days;
(c) 120 hours in any 30 consecutive days or, in the case of a flight crew member on call, 100 hours in any 30 consecutive days;
(d) where the flight is conducted under Subpart 4 or 5 using an aircraft other than a helicopter, 40 hours in any 7 consecutive days;
(e) where the flight is conducted under Subpart 2 or 3, or is conducted using a helicopter, 60 hours in any 7 consecutive days; or
(f) where the flight crew member conducts single-pilot IFR flights, 8 hours in any 24 consecutive hours.
700.19 Requirements for Time Free from Duty
700.19 (1) Subject to subsection (2), an air operator shall provide each flight crew member with the following time free from duty:
(a) where the operation is conducted under Subpart 4 or 5 using an aircraft other than a helicopter, one period of at least 36 consecutive hours within each 7 consecutive days or one period of at least 3 consecutive calendar days within each 17 consecutive days;
(b) where the operation is conducted under Subpart 2 or 3 or is conducted using a helicopter, one period of at least 24 consecutive hours 13 times within each 90 consecutive days and 3 times within each 30 consecutive days; and
(c) where the flight crew member is a flight crew member on call, one period of at least 36 consecutive hours within each 7 consecutive days or one period of at least 3 consecutive calendar days within each 17 consecutive days.
(2) An air operator may provide a flight crew member with time free from duty other than as required by paragraphs (1)(a) and (b) if
(a) the time free from duty is authorized in the air operator certificate; and
(b) the air operator and the flight crew member comply with the Commercial Air Service Standards.
(3) An air operator shall notify a flight crew member on call of the commencement and duration of the flight crew member's time free from duty.
"flight crew member on call" - means a flight crew member who has been designated by an air operator to be available to report for flight duty on notice of one hour or less;
"flight crew member on standby" - means a flight crew member who has been designated by an air operator or private operator to remain at a specified location in order to be available to report for flight duty on notice of one hour or less;
"crew member" - means a person assigned to duty in an aircraft during flight time;
"flight crew member" - means a crew member assigned to act as pilot or flight engineer of an aircraft during flight time;
"flight deck duty time" - means the period spent by a flight crew member at a flight crew member position in an aeroplane during flight time;
"flight duty time" - means the period that starts when a flight crew member reports for a flight, or reports as a flight crew member on standby, and finishes at "engines off" or "rotors stopped" at the end of the final flight, except in the case of a flight conducted under Subpart 4 or 5 of Part VII, in which case the period finishes 15 minutes after "engines off" or "rotors stopped" at the end of the final flight, and includes the time required to complete any duties assigned by the air operator or private operator or delegated by the Minister prior to the reporting time and includes the time required to complete aircraft maintenance engineer duties prior to or following a flight;
"flight time" - means the time from the moment an aircraft first moves under its own power for the purpose of taking off until the moment it comes to rest at the end of the flight;
700.21 (1) An air operator shall provide flight crew members on reserve, within each 24-hour period, with a rest period that meets the requirements of the Commercial Air Service Standards.
720.21 Flight Crew Members on Reserve
The standards for compliance with this section are:
(1) An air operator shall provide each flight crew member with an opportunity to obtain at least 8 consecutive hours sleep in any 24 consecutive hours while on reserve by one of the following methods:
(a) the air operator shall provide the flight crew member with 24 hours notice of the time of commencement and duration of the rest period. The designated rest period cannot shift more than 3 hours earlier or later than the preceding rest period, nor more than a total of 8 hours in any 7 consecutive days;
(b) the flight crew member shall be given a minimum of 10 hours notice of the assignment and shall not be assigned any duty for these 10 hours; or
(c) the air operator shall not assign the flight crew member to flight duty time and shall not interrupt the flight crew member's rest period between 22:00 and 06:00 local time.
(2) Where an air operator is unable to provide a flight crew member with a rest period required by subsection (1) and the flight crew member is notified to report for flight duty or the reporting time occurs between 22:00 and 06:00 local time:
(a) the maximum flight duty time shall be 10 consecutive hours; and
(b) the subsequent minimum rest period shall be increased by at least one-half the length of the preceding flight duty time.
700.15 Flight Time Limitations
700.15 (1) Subject to subsection (2), no air operator shall assign a flight crew member for flight time, and no flight crew member shall accept such an assignment, if the flight crew member's total flight time in all flights conducted by the flight crew member will, as a result, exceed
(a) 1,200 hours in any 365 consecutive days;
(b) 300 hours in any 90 consecutive days;
(c) 120 hours in any 30 consecutive days or, in the case of a flight crew member on call, 100 hours in any 30 consecutive days;
(d) where the flight is conducted under Subpart 4 or 5 using an aircraft other than a helicopter, 40 hours in any 7 consecutive days;
(e) where the flight is conducted under Subpart 2 or 3, or is conducted using a helicopter, 60 hours in any 7 consecutive days; or
(f) where the flight crew member conducts single-pilot IFR flights, 8 hours in any 24 consecutive hours.
700.19 Requirements for Time Free from Duty
700.19 (1) Subject to subsection (2), an air operator shall provide each flight crew member with the following time free from duty:
(a) where the operation is conducted under Subpart 4 or 5 using an aircraft other than a helicopter, one period of at least 36 consecutive hours within each 7 consecutive days or one period of at least 3 consecutive calendar days within each 17 consecutive days;
(b) where the operation is conducted under Subpart 2 or 3 or is conducted using a helicopter, one period of at least 24 consecutive hours 13 times within each 90 consecutive days and 3 times within each 30 consecutive days; and
(c) where the flight crew member is a flight crew member on call, one period of at least 36 consecutive hours within each 7 consecutive days or one period of at least 3 consecutive calendar days within each 17 consecutive days.
(2) An air operator may provide a flight crew member with time free from duty other than as required by paragraphs (1)(a) and (b) if
(a) the time free from duty is authorized in the air operator certificate; and
(b) the air operator and the flight crew member comply with the Commercial Air Service Standards.
(3) An air operator shall notify a flight crew member on call of the commencement and duration of the flight crew member's time free from duty.
Re: Reporting for a flight
This doesn't specifically address the issue here, and different interpretations could easily be made; is "reporting for a flight" leaving home to get to one airport to deadhead to another... or is it when you set foot on the aircraft that you are operating, or any other time in between?A Regulator wrote:"flight duty time" - means the period that starts when a flight crew member reports for a flight, or reports as a flight crew member on standby, and finishes at "engines off" or "rotors stopped" at the end of the final flight, except in the case of a flight conducted under Subpart 4 or 5 of Part VII, in which case the period finishes 15 minutes after "engines off" or "rotors stopped" at the end of the final flight, and includes the time required to complete any duties assigned by the air operator or private operator or delegated by the Minister prior to the reporting time and includes the time required to complete aircraft maintenance engineer duties prior to or following a flight
I know that my company considers deadheading to be duty time, but I don't see this explicitly stated anywhere. I also know that my company considers duty time to start when the phone rings for crews on call or on reserve, but this is definitely not universal in the industry (but I am happy with the way that we do it!). Some COMs will address these details, and those that do probably agree with my interpretation, so does that mean that those that don't clarify in the COM disagree with me?
Re: Reporting for a flight
Typical CARS, loose enough you could drive a truck through the holes. With all due respect to the poster here, I never got a straight answer from Transport to any of my questions on CARS, just a CARS quote. One company years ago it was left up to the union to decide. Go figure.
There are a lot more duties that I have to perform besides just driving the plane. Not considered duty?
There are a lot more duties that I have to perform besides just driving the plane. Not considered duty?
"What's it doing now?"
"Fly low and slow and throttle back in the turns."
"Fly low and slow and throttle back in the turns."
Re: Reporting for a flight
if you get called at 9am, to operate a flight at 11am your duty day starts at 9am when they called you.
Re: Reporting for a flight
" includes the time required to complete any duties assigned by the air operator or private operator or delegated by the Minister prior to the reporting time and includes the time required to complete aircraft maintenance engineer duties prior to or following a flight;"
Deadheading is company assigned duties. Every 705 carrier I've worked for accounts for DH time ahead of flight report as duty for this reason. There is guidance for this. I'll dig through my things and find it for you. Regardless, the accepted industry norm (and common sense for that matter) is that DH before a flight counts.
Cheers,
PP
Deadheading is company assigned duties. Every 705 carrier I've worked for accounts for DH time ahead of flight report as duty for this reason. There is guidance for this. I'll dig through my things and find it for you. Regardless, the accepted industry norm (and common sense for that matter) is that DH before a flight counts.
Cheers,
PP
Some people are like slinkies: Not much good for anything, but they still bring a smile to your face when you push them down a flight of stairs.
