Need help with radio reception

[. ._]

Not for an airplane. For my little radio in the shop.

My crappy little radio looks sort of like this.



It is located in the middle of a metal building with no windows. From what I remember about radio communication from Sault College, FM works as a "line of sight" thing, so I imagine if I'm in the middle of a metal box, there ain't no sight, so therefore minimal reception.

Can I just run a cheap, thin, junk wire to the outside of the building and electrical tape it to the end of my antenna to get reception? To do that, I'd need about 30 feet of wire on the inside of the shop before I could go through a wall to get outside with it. I remember something about resistance or something from my electrical classes a few years back. Would the signal degrade over an antenna that long?

I'm getting tired of listening to the one station I can pick up- barely. Then when someone operates the crane or a forklift, it goes to static.

I refuse to use an mp3 player because, well, call me a proletariat shop snob, but there's something really working-class about listening to the radio at work that comforts me.

Thanks for any of your advice.

-istp

[Beefitarian]

My only caution for the external antena would be to make sure it's well grounded so if it takes a lightning strike your radio doesn't go out with a bang. Other than that the one on your car is pretty much just a wire with chrome on it.

[Beefitarian]

Oh right, the 30 feet inside. Best would be a coaxial cable with threaded tips at the ends to attach to the special radio antena.

You don't strike me as a guy that wants to pay any money. It shouldn't be too much but it will be more than "free" for the piece of wire you found some where, unless you find a piece of coaxial cable which is possible if you're looking in the right spots.

[Snagmaster E]

... unless you find a piece of coaxial cable which is possible if you're looking in the right spots.

... Like your walls, or a friend's walls, or the back of a friend's cable box. No muss, no fuss with the last one. Well maybe a little fuss.

[. ._]

Can I strip the coaxial cable and tape it to my antenna? I have some coax lying around the house and the dollar store sells it for cheap.

Could I attach the coaxial cable to a coathanger outside? The coathanger technique really boosted my reception on the Cadillac.

And you're right, Beefitarian. It's just a crappy radio. I'd prefer spending no money.

[The Tool]

tinfoil_hat_antenna.jpg (27.73 KiB) Viewed 1513 times

[Beefitarian]

You don't want to strip the coax. You want to use it on the inside of the building to prevent your radio from playing the forklift ignition static. On the outside of the building you want something like a car antena, coat hanger will probably do. If the antena comes off the radio it's perfect.

The metal building might work, have you touched the antena on the unit to it. The typical set up is any piece of wire from the antena strung across the shop in what ever direction results in best signal. Wrap about 6 inches to a foot of bare around the unit antena.

[iflyforpie]

All I've even done with crappy hangar radios is use a stretch of 0.032 or 0.040 lockwire wrapped around the antenna (or remainent thereof) and attached to a metal fixture in the building.

It is right next to a fluorescent light fixture and will only pick up noise when the ballast spools up. It will also pick up AM aircraft transmissions, which I've noticed quite a few old radios will do on the FM band.

[Hedley]

Marconi (not macaroni) attennas are simple and cheap. Quarter wavelength.

Wavelength of your FM is around 100Mhz.

And we know that Velocity equals frequency multiplied by wavelength. Like many physics problems, this one is solved by simply lining up the units so they cancel out.

Therefore, wavelength = V / F = 3 x 10^8 / 100 x 10^6 = 3 meters. You want a quarter wavelength, so the length of the antenna is 3/4 meter or 29 inches. So, strip the last 29 inches of your coax spool, leaving a nice chunk of shielding to attach to ground. Suspend the bare piece vertically - there is a 3db attentuation for polarization if you put it horizontal - and run the coax to your radio. Yes, there will be attenuation with the skinny coax. Shorter the better. Size does matter. Remove the existing antenna and connect the coax to it.

Let me know how it works!

PS All you really need in life, is the back of an envelope.

[The Old Fogducker]

ISTP:

I'd be happy to help you receive your coded orders from the studios of Radio Moscow ... now rebranded to be "The Voice of Russia." Too bad the good old days of shortwave listening are behind us ... Radio Peking was hilarious. I'd be laughing myself silly in my bedroom listening to those clowns on my converted Marconi R-1155 receiver that at one time was used in an RCAF Lancaster. ISTP ... its from listening to hundreds of hours of drivel broadcast from behind the Iron Curtain that developed my attitude about Communism.

So, here's the issue .... your metal building stops all but the strongest radio signals because it acts as what is known as a Farraday Shield. You need to get the antenna outside of that "radio signal lock-box" that stops the radiation from the transmitter from reaching the little whip antenna on your boom box.

You'll be able to fix this up for super-cheap with scrounged stuff from your junk box collection or Dollar Store, of if you're going to go for the high priced option ... "The Source."

Here's what to do .... get a dipole antenna, connect the dipole to a length of coax cable via a 300 ohm to 75 ohm balun impedance matching transformer. Connect the centre conductor of the other end of the coax to your radio's antenna via an alligator clip ... keep the radio's antenna collapsed so minimize interference from radio noise sources inside your building like the fork lift. I doubt you'll be able to totally eliminate the fork lift noise when its very close, although you'll be able to minimize it. Connect the shield portion of the coax to the negative terminal of the battery box.....that functions as the ground that the antenna will operate against.

Mount the dipole either outside and as high as possible, or tape it in a window if that's the best you can do....that's a distant second choice, but for local FM signals with transmitter locations near your location, a "city grade broacast signal" of 3 Mv/metre or greater will be workable for you. Secondary coverage area signal strengths of .5 Mv/Metre may be problematic in a window.

You can also use an old set of TV Rabbit Ears.

I'll post some pictures and links in a few minutes, my internet connection is acting up.

OFD

EDIT .... oops ISTP ... I just picked up that you don't have windows there in the dungeon .... does "The Man" that exploits your labour for the nefarious capitalist greed-driven forces of Imperialism not ever let you see the sun?

[The Tool]

All please pay attention to OFD's response. He has been highly trained by CBC Engineers for years. Further he is also friends with NE Sound Broadcasting...another excellent resource... better than his CBC training..but not by much

[The Old Fogducker]

ISTP ... since I like this kind of stuff ... here is a look at some radios I used ...

[The Old Fogducker]

The Tool .... yikes man!

I was taking a swig of single malt when I saw that ... darned near spewed some expensive elixir onto the screen of my laptop ... LOL.

Indeed I have some excellent friends at Sound Broadcasting.

The Old (Don't call me a pirate) Fogducker

EDIT ... for clarification, "I am not now, nor have I ever been ... a member of the Communist Party .... oh, wrong response. I meant to say ... "I'm not now, nor have I ever been, ..... an employee of the CBC!"

I will admit to having had a couple of business partners that were ex-CBC, but they had a grip on reality. A lot of my Engineering OJT came from an ex RAF Radar Tech that worked on targeting systems for the V Bomber series of aircraft that carried atomic weapons. His mantra .... "Keep it clean, keep it cold, and it'll run forever."

[Beefitarian]

Are you sure that's going to bring in the maximum Max Webster OFD?

[. ._]

LOL!

I needs my MAX WEBSTER, and I needs the Moose and the Island (Manitoulin's hottest (and only) country channel).

I love hearing about the local stuff on Manitoulin Island.

One day there were some freaks that made 13 snowmen in Mindemoya. Another day there was a dog that was found that liked to ride in the car and could fetch a ball- the radio station was looking for the owner.

There are also chainsaws, fridges, Pepsi ashtray collections and broken snowblowers for sale in Elliot Lake.

@#$! I love the southern northern Ontario lifestyle.

I'll let you guys know what's going on next week.

Thanks for all the advice- especially my fair and balanced, running dog lackey for the imperialist military Coca-Cola Santa worshipping complex of cool vintage radios- OFD. And to respond to your question, the MAN technically does not allow me to see the sun until the designated hours. Kinda like my ancestors in the coal mines a hundred and fifty years ago. Unlike my ancestors, I don't give a damn and go out for smoke breaks to see the sun. You see, you can weld all day and use a plasma cutter to pollute the indoor air- that's fine. But under Ontario law if you light up a cig for five minutes, you can be fined and/or fired.

I have 6 weeks till I'm eligible for pogey. At that point I will assert myself to benefit the profitability of the company. This will piss of the new General Manager and I will be "laid-off". Until then, I wants to hear my radio!!!

Will advise. Over and out, roger, 10-4 good buddy, catch youse on the flip-flop.

-istp

[Beefitarian]

So... you are going to start with the 5 foot piece of tie wire going up and down?

[. ._]

I think I'll start with re-reading this tomorrow sober.

[Beefitarian]

Did you sober up and forget there was a radio in the shop?

[. ._]

Nope. I've just been putting it off.

I just scoped out today where I could easily drill through the wall without the General Manager finding out.

It's coming.

Stay tuned... (pun intended )

I'll let you guys know how it goes.

-istp

[The Old Fogducker]

I was wondering how you've made out with the radio reception project ISTP.

For the last few days I've been expecting you to change your AvCanada name to "Gitdown B. Funky" once you get music to your workplace.

73 es gl de OFD (that'll have 'em wondering)

[. ._]

I thought I'd update this.

Being a lazy dude, I just bought a cheapie dipole antenna at The Source and hooked it up inside the shop to the antenna and negative battery springy thing via alligator clips.

It works a little better, but I think it would still be better outside.

Will let you guys know how it goes.

-istp

[The Old Fogducker]

Thanks for letting us know ..... I can't wait for your announcement that you're changing your screen name to "Grand Master Gittdown B. Funky." Be sure your entourage includes a dozen or so high maintenance super-hot women and a minimum of 4 bodyguards packing heat.

Back on topic ..... I put up a temporary antenna at the lake about 2 weeks ago and the first station I tuned in on the 20 Meter Band was Brazil, the second was in Hungary. So, it should be wild times for me as soon as the sunspot count increases ... LOL. Just like the guys in the TV show "The Big Bang theory."

OFD