Why aren't more women airline pilots?

[cdnpilot77]

http://www.cnn.com/2011/TRAVEL/03/18/fe ... tml?hpt=T2

"One time, way back, I had a gentleman come up and say 'I have a fear of flying, and my psychiatrist said to me if there's anything you don't like, just don't go on that trip and take the next one.' And he said, 'Frankly, I'm insecure with a woman pilot.'

wow!

[Darkwing Duck]

Cuz if God wanted women to fly he would of made the sky pink instead of blue and they would of called it the box office instead of the cockpit.

But on a serious note I know lots of women pilots and lots are very good. In fact my main PPL instructor was a female. She was the best of the ones I had and taught me alot of little things that may never of been taught by someone else.

[ScudRunner]

THEY Attract BEARS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[teacher]

Just like there arent' tons of male nurses. It's nothing other than a career choice/activity that attracts for from one gender than another.

[North Shore]

Heh! First time I flew across the Pacific - in a 747 - the whole crew was female...

[ahramin]

There are many reasons that fewer women are interested in aviation than men, and for those that are interested, there are many deterrents to being successful that do not exist for men. The aviation industry, and most significantly the aviation training industry, has been extremely slow to capitalize on the advantages of women pilots.

Unfortunately still a reality but it's getting better every year. One thing that I have never seen addressed anywhere is pilot uniforms. If we want little girls to aspire to become 747 captains, I think it's time we gave them something to wear other than men's clothes.

[pilotbzh]

the real reason is they are not stupid, more money and better work condition in other jobs.....

[SII]

the real reason is they are not stupid, more money and better work condition in other jobs.....

does that mean you think all female pilots are stupid?

[ahramin]

the real reason is they are not stupid, more money and better work condition in other jobs.....

does that mean you think all female pilots are stupid?

It means he thinks all pilots are stupid. Not everything needs to be divided by gender.

[True North]

he aviation industry, and most significantly the aviation training industry, has been extremely slow to capitalize on the advantages of women pilots.

Just curious, what are the "advantages" of women pilots?

[ahramin]

What I was referring to was simply having access to double the number of potential talent. However now that you mention it having less testosterone floating around might provide a significant reduction in certain problematic stereotypical behaviour.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmxiZZZ-2_4

[cdnpilot77]

What I was referring to was simply having access to double the number of potential talent. However now that you mention it having less testosterone floating around might provide a significant reduction in certain problematic stereotypical behaviour.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmxiZZZ-2_4

Ahramin is correct, Sometimes too much testosterone in the cockpit causes issues!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T7CN9kv3 ... ata_player

Edit: Stupid IPad....little help?

[ahramin]

Sorry, tried to fix the link but I butchered it.

[Flying Low]

Simple answer to the original question...Male pilots.

Or put another way...what does a pilot use for birth control?

....his personality. BA DUM BUM

Thanks...I'll be here all week. Please...tip your waitress!

[True North]

What I was referring to was simply having access to double the number of potential talent. However now that you mention it having less testosterone floating around might provide a significant reduction in certain problematic stereotypical behaviour.

ahramin,

My apologies if I am reading too much into your post but "having access to double the number of potential talent" suggests there are an equal number of male and female pilots. That isn't the case and goes to original question. There certainly are a lot more women flying now than there was when I started 35 years ago but it is still a very disproportionate amount. In my experience it certainly isn't because women pilots are discriminated against, just the opposite in fact. At one point in my career when I was involved in hiring I was told that we had better hire some women or we would be in trouble with whatever the government body was at the time that oversaw equal rights for women.

There was a time when a career as a pilot for a woman was virtually impossible due to discrimination by the "old boys club". Those days are gone and I think in time things will even out, or at least come closer.

Or maybe pilotbzh is right, they are just smarter and know there are better career choices out there.

[SII]

BEARS god dam it

[Canuck223]

Probably for the same reasons the numbers of female police officers outnumber female fire fighters. Once the artificial barriers are eliminated, the remaining difference is genuine preference.

I'm a firm supporter of encouraging the best and brightest to try for the career of thier choice. I'm also aware that some people tend to cluster in certain trades, while avoiding others. Just because the group is under represented, it doesn't always mean bias.

[atpilot]

A career in aviation is not very conducive to raising a family. My wife is a licenced pilot but chose to raise a family instead. It was a personal choice the she made and has been very happy. The opportunity to have more female pilots is there. It ultimately is a matter of choice.

[ahramin]

I'll try to deal with a few of the points made here.

True North, you are correct that my math is bad. It's overly simplistic to say that you double the number of potential hires because there are already some women pilots. That number is however, very small. Less than 10% of pilots are female. When it comes to career pilots who make it to the airlines the number is even smaller (~5% last time I saw reliable statistics). If you had as many women interested in becoming professional pilots as there are men you would significantly increase the total number. Even if you increase the total by 50% instead of 100%, you still end up with a better pool of talent to pull from.

When you discourage any group from entering any profession, you do that profession a disservice, and 50% of the population is a rather large group.

The "better hire some women or we'll be in trouble" affirmative action solution can be extremely counter productive. Unless there happen to be some qualified and competent women applying for that particular job just when you decide to hire you may end up hiring someone sub standard that would not have been hired without short circuiting the hiring process. When that sub standard pilot doesn't work out and has to be let go, it creates the idea that women pilots aren't good enough. The next time a female resume shows up it's hard for the person doing the hiring to shake the idea that this woman isn't going to work out any better than the last one.

There was a time when a career as a pilot for a woman was virtually impossible due to discrimination by the "old boys club". Those days are gone and I think in time things will even out, or at least come closer.

Certainly there has been a huge improvement and these days it's almost unheard of to see women outright blocked from a profession. Unfortunately the societal norms don't change with the same magic wand that creates anti-discrimination laws. Most of the barriers to women are not from evil intentioned men actively conspiring to keep them oppressed, but from unconscious behaviours and assumptions. Most people simply aren't self aware of how they make their decisions, even if they think they are. There are many studies showing this but try this little experiment: The next time you are in a mixed sex meeting at work and someone is going to make coffee or get water or some similar domestic task, see who ends up doing it. You'll find it's only 1 time in 10 that it's a male.

So yes, it is true that a smart, motivated, and competent woman can succeed today where it would have been impossible 50 years ago. There are many shining examples of women captains at any large airline. I doubt that a single one of them got through their entire career without some obstacle or tribulation placed in front of them that was simply and only due to their gender, but that's really not the problem.

The other day I was on a hotel shuttle heading to the airport and in the shuttle was a family of 4. Parents and 2 kids, a little girl about 8 and a little boy about 5. The father seems to be a bit of an aviation buff, he was explaining the PAPIs to his kids "the lights are green when they are high enough, red when they're too low" so I quietly explained to him that they are white and red and how they worked. With the realization that I was a pilot he told me all about what model airplanes he and his kids are building right now and what type of airplane they were flying on that day and then had to make sure both of his kids understood that they were sitting next to a real, live pilot. I must say the kids didn't seem as impressed as the father but the little boy did show mild enthusiasm when his father asked him if he would like to be an airline pilot. When I suggested that perhaps the little girl would like to be an airline pilot her father agreed "oh sure, or Carly" but she finally spoke up with some interest in the conversation and said "NO. I want to be a HELICOPTER pilot."

Would anyone care to guess why she scorned the glamorous and easy life of an airline pilot in favour of the long hours, low pay and dirty work of a helicopter pilot?

[Rotten Apple #1]

Pehaps this?

[Darkwing Duck]

I'll try to deal with a few of the points made here.

The other day I was on a hotel shuttle heading to the airport and in the shuttle was a family of 4. Parents and 2 kids, a little girl about 8 and a little boy about 5. The father seems to be a bit of an aviation buff, he was explaining the PAPIs to his kids "the lights are green when they are high enough, red when they're too low" so I quietly explained to him that they are white and red and how they worked. With the realization that I was a pilot he told me all about what model airplanes he and his kids are building right now and what type of airplane they were flying on that day and then had to make sure both of his kids understood that they were sitting next to a real, live pilot. I must say the kids didn't seem as impressed as the father but the little boy did show mild enthusiasm when his father asked him if he would like to be an airline pilot. When I suggested that perhaps the little girl would like to be an airline pilot her father agreed "oh sure, or Carly" but she finally spoke up with some interest in the conversation and said "NO. I want to be a HELICOPTER pilot."

Would anyone care to guess why she scorned the glamorous and easy life of an airline pilot in favour of the long hours, low pay and dirty work of a helicopter pilot?

Cuz she is about 8 and doesn't know any better.

[ahramin]

The easy life vs dirty work part was tongue in cheek.

No one has a guess as to what would motivate an 8 year old girl to choose one type of flying over another?

[Darkwing Duck]

I know it was tongue in cheek. So was my comment. Sorry I guess my sarcazim did not ring the bell this time.

[ahramin]

Check.

Oh the advantages of the internet . Now we can miscommunicate with people all over the world!

[Intentional Left Bank]

Over the years I have flown with three female pilots who "made it to the big leagues" who have since left the industry--and have so far stayed out--when they started having kids. I don't know of any male pilots who stopped flying when they had kids. I certainly didn't.

I know at least five pilots whose wives were working as pilots and left the industry when they started having kids.

Considering how few female (airline) pilots there are to begin with, when a significant percentage leave the industry once they start having kids, you end up with a really low number of female pilots.

I work with several female pilots who have young kids. They appear to manage the challenge really well. But it is a challenge.

What can be done to change the ratio? Excellent question with no realistic answers. Being a pilot often means choosing to spend more than 12 hrs at a time away from your family. That doesn't work for many women who choose to have families. Family does not figure into the career aspirations of an 18-year-old, but it eventually becomes an undeniable fact of life. Your high-school guidance counselor won't tell you that.