Hit and run.

[Cat Driver]

This forum would be a lot more user friendly if we did not have so many hit and run posters like this one.

From another thread::::by North of you.

I wrote the following:

I had a very tense trip many years ago in a DC3 with one feathered and was forced to do the approach in zero, zero in ice fog.....thankfully I had been trained well in my past and was able to safely land it. And it did have an autopilot but we did not have it engaged.

Here was the reply:

Sounds like you busted minimums on that approach, or is there a Cat 3 certified DC3 out there I haven’t heard about? Or is there a let in your SOPs that allow you to descend below minimums in the event of an emergency? Or could it be that your sickening self righteous arrogant hypocrisy on this board in regards to safety has finally been exposed?

Now go ahead and spew your usual drivel about it was at night and there weren’t any min vis requirements for the approach and you had the lights at minimums. Or better yet, just have this post deleted.

*************************************************************************

I answered the questions with a fairly detailed explanation of what had transpired on that night and it should have been obvious that in that case I really had no other viable choice but to land in the conditions we faced.

I am still waiting for this poster to come back and defend his/her comments.

I hope a mod does not nuke this thread because I truly believe we need to examine how people post here and at least find out why they take such hard nosed positions and label others with degrading descriptions based only on their opinions.

I especially resent this comment as my record on safety is something the industry should envy.

Or could it be that your sickening self righteous arrogant hypocrisy on this board in regards to safety has finally been exposed?

[Dagwood]

One of the things with an anonymous internet forum is that the users don't know each other. I don't know anything about North of You, but I can see how a newcomer to the forums would find someone saying that they "busted minimums on a dark and scary night single engine" like they were advocating busting minimums regularly. Some time ago, after Cat posted some non-conventional wisdom here, a noob poster (and probably a noob pilot too) asked Cat if he had ever worked in the industry

Cat, I'm glad you explained the particulars of your event for the benefit of the rest of us. Maybe it'll make a noob pilot in a similar situation think twice about blindly following regulations without a second regard to common sense. Don't let the rest of us get to you Cat, I'd fly with you anyday

[Cat Driver]

Thanks Dagwood, however North of you is not a newcomer as he/she has been on Avcanada since 2004.

My message was more focused on the reason I was able to safely complete a landing under such conditions. not a story about un-forcast weather and an engine failure on the same flight.

Once again here is the message that I wanted to get across.

Early in my training I flew with a teacher who had me land without being able to see the runway when doing ILS training...he indoctrinated the train for the unusual deep in my psyche...I continued to practice such an approach over the years that night it made the approach and landing more doable as I knew it was doable.

Every float plane pilot who gets their rating must be able to do a glassy water landing.....a landing off an ILS with no reference to the runway is basically a glassy water landing at the end of the approach.

So looking at it from that perspective if a private pilot can land without being able to see the landing surface why can't a working Commercial/ATPL pilot grasp the concept.

Some day you may have to be able to do it.

Or to be more specific for all you young'uns out there.....if you are going to wreck an airplane because the weather is zero zero the best place to do it is on a runway after having declared an emergency....get it??

[Expat]

+1

[winds_in_flight_wtf]

There are a lot of unnecessary responses . Ultimately, I find there is an excess amount of broad bars floating around. When someone brings up a debatable topic in a very friendly and neutral way for example; and is grilled for it (ever after a clarified response has been presented) that automatically makes me wonder about the credibility of many on here. Yet Mr. Captain perfect and his clan of sinless idiots refuse to utilize this tool to its full potential and instead use it as a forum to be the captain outside of the cockpit. I find it nauseating and pathetic.

Great points though.

[trey kule]

Is this your idea of friendly and neutral?

Yet Mr. Captain perfect and his clan of sinless idiots refuse to utilize this tool to its full potential and instead use it as a forum to be the captain outside of the cockpit. I find it nauseating and pathetic.

I can certainly see that as debatable.

good example though

[RVgrin]

Cat,

I didn't read the original thread, but as I understand the law, in an emergency the PIC can break just about any aviation regulation (and, to save lives, a good capt. would do so regardless of the legality).

The way I figure it, the person who offended you either:

1) knows this, and is trolling; or
2) doesn't know this, and thus is not a pilot or at least isn't one worth listening to

or, (most likely)

3) read your post quickly and missed the fact that you had lost an engine.

Either way, the most valuable question to ask yourself may be "why are you stressing over it?"

[winds_in_flight_wtf]

Is this your idea of friendly and neutral?

Yet Mr. Captain perfect and his clan of sinless idiots refuse to utilize this tool to its full potential and instead use it as a forum to be the captain outside of the cockpit. I find it nauseating and pathetic.

I can certainly see that as debatable.

good example though

Point proven

[Cat Driver]

Either way, the most valuable question to ask yourself may be "why are you stressing over it?"

RVgrin I post here to relieve stress.

One never knows how many pilots just might have another look at the thread I am referring to and after reading what I have said and the comments made about my post re think the issue.

You never know it might actually get a few reconsidering how one makes decisions and what factors they use to make a decision, SOP's are not meant to be followed blindly.

[RVgrin]

Cat:

Don't get me wrong. I am very grateful for your postings and the opportunity to learn from them. Keep 'em coming.

In fact, I was hoping you wouldn't get frustrated and disappear like some others recently have. But I was also wondering if you had some unresolved issues regarding that incident (or more generally) that perhaps you wanted to consider privately, or discuss openly, to get off your chest. It seemed your frustration at being unable to continue the conversation may have been out of proportion to the attention that the offending poster's words perhaps merited.

RV

P.S. Don't take this postscript as referring to anyone in particular nor trying to defend anyone's actions, but it is easy to think of some reasons why an active user might suddenly go quiet for an extended period of time, during which the thread is forgotten. This is a Canadian aviation site, after all, and a pilot could be posted somewhere off the grid.

[Cat Driver]

In fact, I was hoping you wouldn't get frustrated and disappear like some others recently have. But I was also wondering if you had some unresolved issues regarding that incident (or more generally) that perhaps you wanted to consider privately, or discuss openly, to get off your chest.

No I have no unresolved issues what so ever regarding that flight or any other flight during my career.

I share them so others may learn that we never know what the next flight may bring and the best way to give yourself an edge is always think ahead and before you make a decision be sure you want to follow through with you are about to do.

I survived somehow but believe me sometimes it was more fate than skill.

[The Old Fogducker]

Cat:

Sometimes this place is not unlike a flock of chickens ... do something the tiniest bit out of the ordinary compared with the rest of the flock, and they start to eye you up as a candidate to be pecked to death.

Don't let the peckers get to your skin.

Tough to do sometimes, I agree.

Foggy

[Siddley Hawker]

What the man said.

[Cat Driver]

Trust me gang, I can give back what ever is needed when it comes to defending my position, and if I am proven wrong that is not going to destroy my self worth for a heart beat.

Flying international delivery flights in non turbine unpressurized airplanes for over thirty years had many, many difficult times......I was thinking about the fear factor a while ago and was trying to think what area of the world produced the highest fear factor and I would probably have to choose the dust storms in the Sahara desert...on top of sudden loss of visibility there was the worry about sand grains destroying the engines.

Second would be the ITCZ, I often wonder what those poor souls in Air France 447went though in those last moments before the airplane broke up. There are a couple of rocks sticking up in the South Atlantic very near where they went down, we found them using the GPS on our way from Dakar to Fernando de. Norohna very weird place to see rocks sticking up out of the ocean

Fear is normal and recognizing fear and being able to deal with it and make proper decisions will give one a far better chance of survival.

In about two weeks we start our cross Canada vacation in the Husky.

Then we will start looking for a Jet Ranger....the ultimate play toy...

I have decided I will fly for at least another ten years before I retire again.

[crazy_aviator]

One year, when flying out of Ft. Francis with rusty myers, I had set up a gps approach onto the lake and practiced it a couple of times to ascertain it was okay. IF, in the very rare instance that i had to break cloud etc, I COULD approach, glassy water land and TAXI to the dock in practically 0-0 conditions, other pilots laughed at me , I agree with Cat, its good to have an ace up the sleeve !!!

[Cat Driver]

To distract our passengers from wondering how in hell someone as old as me can fly them from A to B in the Jet Ranger I am going to hire a real young stunning looking female with big ti... to fly with me, that ought to keep their minds occupied.

[Cat Driver]

One year, when flying out of Ft. Francis with rusty myers, I had set up a gps approach onto the lake and practiced it a couple of times to ascertain it was okay. IF, in the very rare instance that i had to break cloud etc, I COULD approach, glassy water land and TAXI to the dock in practically 0-0 conditions, other pilots laughed at me , I agree with Cat, its good to have an ace up the sleeve !!!

Good for you, now you can change your name to " Intelligent- Aviator ".

[bandaid]

All I can say on this issue is that there is a RED explanation mark on the bottom right hand corner of this forum. If you feel comments cross the line or for that matter any concerns that you may have beit wrong section of the forum, racist remarks, language....ect.(Look at the rules) please feel free to contact any one of the moderators.

[Cat Driver]

Bandaid,my only problem with with a remark by another poster was this one.

Or could it be that your sickening self righteous arrogant hypocrisy on this board in regards to safety has finally been exposed?

The best way to reply to such a comment is to argue my position, which this thread has done.

[mcrit]

The best way to reply to such a comment is to argue my position, which this thread has done.

Or, you could recognize that the only reason the comment was made was to get under your skin, and that responding to it (especially in anger) is exactly what the poster wants you to do.