Which rating is most difficult to get, and why?

[Cat Driver]

The back and forth arguments about learning to fly sea planes got me to wondering which rating is the most difficult to get.

For fixed wing airplanes only of course because helicopters are a different breed altogether and have very little in common with airplanes. In fact I am beginning to wonder why I even bother with communicating with fixed wing pilots because I am beginning to think I have little in common with them

I get the impression that lack of experience in a sea plane instructors background is not all that big a deal because the rating is only a rating to learn.

Does that hold true for every rating, all you need is someone to teach you the minimum you need to know to get the rating?

[Go Juice]

I think the hardest rating to get is the Multi Rating.

Not necessarily because it's soooo hard but most guys do their PPL, CPL on a C-150, C-172, PA-28 wich all have fixed pitch props. ( I know not ALL of them but you know!)

Then you get to a multi, that goes a lot faster and you need to understand/manage the MP settings, Constant speed prop gears ect ect.

It's not hard, but there is a lot of difference between the trainers and the seneca/navajo/c310.

[wetair]

No way, Multi is 3rd easiest after VFR-OTT and Night. By FAR the most difficult rating to get is the Instructor Rating, hands down. You take a CPL and break them down back to the PPL level and then expect perfection at the CPL level. If you don't think the Instructor Rating the the most difficult then your Class 1 ripped you and your students off.

[Les Habitants]

I say it's your first turbine type rating.

Followed by instructor rating.

[Big Pistons Forever]

No way, Multi is 3rd easiest after VFR-OTT and Night. By FAR the most difficult rating to get is the Instructor Rating, hands down. You take a CPL and break them down back to the PPL level and then expect perfection at the CPL level. If you don't think the Instructor Rating the the most difficult then your Class 1 ripped you and your students off.

+1 Done right an Instructor rating is a hell of a lot of work. Before I will recommend I my flight instructor students for the flight test they will be able to consistently fly any maneuver to a "4" standard, give a well organized error free PGI, are completely familiar with CAR's and the aircraft POH, and can either explain or know where the explanation is, for any aircraft theory or concept and most important always understand what good airmanship is and practice it. The CPL course is trivial in comparison to a properly taught flight instructor course.

[Cat Driver]

I am glad I asked the question because the answers are sure different from pilot to pilot.

[Cat Driver]

Well so far I agree the instructor rating is by far the most difficult...and defying logic pays the least.

You gotta love the way aviation works.

[ajet32]

Hands down the first medium to large Jet with FMS Autoflight autothrottles or FADEC and the associated systems. Throw in EFIS, MFDS or EICAM alerting systems and the advanced navigation and vertical navigation and I think you are getting there.

[Nark]

I can see the merits for the medium jet, with geez-whiz gizmo's. It was a huge learning curve for me. However, with my fancy type rating, I'm not PIC. No one in their right mind would put me in the left seat of this nearly 100,000 lb bird.

With that said: After a few late night sessions, and a crash course pilot-mill school CFI rating, I was legally able to teach someone to fly. And I did just that. (Just one person).
The mere fact that my head isn't completely inserted into my own ass, and pass on a bit of knowledge to allow another; giving him the ability to fly astounds me.

The rote knowledge I had of the Brazilian bird allowed me to pass a type rating, however my rote knowledge didn't help my student to pass his PPL ride. I had to make sure he the application, understanding, and correlation.

[Cat Driver]

Remember generally speaking most pilot have flown a fair number of hours commercially and a fair number of different types before they train for a type rating on a medium to heavy jet.

Thus the learning curve should be smooth as you progress up the ladder of airplanes from simple to complex.

By the time you get to glass and fly by wire different law systems it is basically just learning how to operate a new system.

[iflyforpie]

Toughest for hands and feet: Float rating.

Toughest for knowledge and procedures: Group 1 IFR.

Most mentally challenging: Instructor rating.

I've never had any type ratings, but certainly learning systems for big jets and turboprops as a mechanic gives me a great appreciation for what the drivers of such need to know...

[beaverguy]

Float rating. Five hour "course" when I got it from Dave H. up in Fort Langley. Took 3 tries before I actually landed on the river all alone. (was really scared) It was just enough time to kill myself. Fortunatly I got in with a company in Vancouver Harbour and got to fly around the coast with a whole lot of high time float guys. I learned alot. Have been at WestJet for 11 years now, doing line-indoc, and love flying with the float guys. The 737-200 and 737 ng endorsments seemed hard at the time, but were nothing like learning to fly floats on the west coast. This is just my opinion, of course..

[DHCdriver]

Myself personally it was the Group 1 Instrument rating. I found float flying came naturally to me, whereas the IFR I really had to work hard at it. DHCdriver.

[Cat Driver]

Having sat and thought about all the ratings I got over the decades they were about the same as to difficulty including the flight instructors rating, because I never really thought of them as being difficult and just learned each skill as it was taught to me.

The only one that ever defeated me was trying to renew my flight instructors rating which I found to be just plain frustrating and I recall the day I said fu.k it and threw the study material in the garbage, I was in Niamey Niger at the time.

The most interesting and enjoyable for me was in Toulouse at the Airbus factory getting a free intro into their new fangled magic machines.

I liked the colors.

[nimbostratus]

The most interesting and enjoyable for me was in Toulouse at the Airbus factory getting a free intro into their new fangled magic machines.

I liked the colors.

"See a light, Push a light, Get a banana!".

Nimbo

[sidestick stirrer]

One's first Airbus course, especially if they are used to US-built heavy metal, like Boeing, McDonnell-Douglas, Lockheed.
Started groundschool with 2015 vision and finished the course with reading glasses and my first grey hairs...

[North Shore]

"See a light, Push a light, Get a banana!".

Ha ha! Gotta remember that one!

[Panama Jack]

One's first Airbus course, especially if they are used to US-built heavy metal, like Boeing, McDonnell-Douglas, Lockheed.
Started groundschool with 2015 vision and finished the course with reading glasses and my first grey hairs...

+1. Airbus manuals suck. Felt like I was reading a computer operating system manual.

[crooked timber]

i don't think the float rating is particularly "hard to get" but it's probably the toughest flying to master. a group 1 rating is only as hard as it is to memorize all the procedures and then once you've flown them a couple of times you have a good handle on them. transitioning up in types is just a mix of digesting new procedures as well as the about 10 hours it takes to learn the specific muscle memory involved with making the numbers on the instruments start at 0 in the morning and end up there at the end of the day in whatever new type/class you're transitioning to.

teaching float flying is different because you're essentially trying to impart a certain mindset/decision making process in the student to use all the tools available to them, always have an out, and respect their own limits at a point in their career when they have very little experience to draw from. there's no way you can cover every different scenario they're going to encounter in 7 hours of training. the set of floats underneath them is essentially an all access pass to get themselves into trouble a million different ways (meanwhile the 777 captain has a binder of sop's telling him/her precisely how to do everything as well as what not to do).

[Beefitarian]

I think you were jack. You don't fly those, you ask the computer to fly it in a way close to how you want to fly it. That's why I like most of the boeing planes.

[Panama Jack]

I wish I had the option, Beefitarian, to be able to say "if it ain't Boeing I ain't going." Unfortunately, not much of an option in my airline's fleet. Maybe later on this decade when the 787's arrive (if they do), but it remains to be seen how much of an X-box that aircraft will be.

I did have a chance a couple of years ago to ink "B732" onto my licence. Just a nice, souped-up Cessna 172 with two rockets under the wings. I love low-tech.

[Nark]

You don't fly those, you ask the computer to fly it in a way close to how you want to fly it. That's why I like most of the boeing planes.

That sums up my ground school on the Brazilian bird.
Only the alt gear extension and the RAT are attached to anything. Absolutely everything is connected via computers. In which case you ask the computer, and you better ask nicely.

[nutbutter]

Agreed, float rating was easy to get. Multi-IFR was hard, but I imagine an instructor rating to be more challenging.
That said however, any type rating is the hardest hands down. I can't even fathom the kinds of classes, sim training, and flying associated when making a jump to a narrow body without previous jet and FMS experience to draw from. Must be fucking mind numbing learning one of those birds for the first time.

[Hawkerflyer]

Space shuttle is by far the hardest. That Space Camp movie from the 80's was full of shit!

[Dhc6to8]

The hardest rating to get for me was the new "fangdangled" cappucino machine in the crew lounge..... still haven't figured that thing out!!
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