Astar Helicopter Missing Langley to Kelowna

[cgartly]

http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Rescue ... story.html

[Redneck_pilot86]

Not to downplay this, but its an Astar missing, not a STARS Heli. Hope they find it ok.

[DHC5]

So, whats the story? Did they locate the missing chopper?

[SAR_YQQ]

Search has gone Major - deployment to Kelowna in process. Apparently the experienced pilot did not leave a detailed flight plan.

[iflyforpie]

Search has gone Major - deployment to Kelowna in process. Apparently the experienced pilot did not leave a detailed flight plan.

Which is pretty much impossible to do flying in the rocks in what I imagine was less than perfect weather. VNCs don't give the names of minor drainages and most people in FSS wouldn't know the names anyways.

That is why fail-safe GPS tracking devices like SPOT are much more valuable IMHO than the fail-deadly 406 ELT. There is little excuse not to have these anymore given their relative cheapness.

[kevinsky18]

Search has gone Major - deployment to Kelowna in process. Apparently the experienced pilot did not leave a detailed flight plan.

Which is pretty much impossible to do flying in the rocks in what I imagine was less than perfect weather. VNCs don't give the names of minor drainages and most people in FSS wouldn't know the names anyways.

That is why fail-safe GPS tracking devices like SPOT are much more valuable IMHO than the fail-deadly 406 ELT. There is little excuse not to have these anymore given their relative cheapness.

Although the Spot is a good device it is not without its flaws as well. The original version was not very user friendly and it is easy to accidently turn off the tracking when sending an OK message and not realize you had turned off the tracking (I’m not sure if this issue has been addressed in the newer version).

In addition Spot often fails to connect with the satellite thus several way points do not get recorded. The new version masks this flaw by sending the last several waypoints each time it updates. So sooner or later all your way points do get registered however, if you go missing and the Spot hasn’t been successful in updating the last three to five times (which is common) then you could be 30-50 minutes in any given direction from your last recorded location.

There are better satellite tracking systems other than Spot that are much more reliable although they are more expensive.

Having and using a Spot is better than not having any satellite tracking at all but don’t fool yourself into thinking that the Spot is a 100% reliable tracking system.

[DHC5]

Wow, surprised to hear they are deploying to YLW... not much real estate there to op search and rescue operations (ramp space limited) espcially if they are utilizing C130's or even the C17 (doubtful).. I imagine using the Buffalo and Cormorants only at this time?

Would have assumed YYF/YKA as a more viable OPS base?

[The Mole]

Im surprised to hear of a heli without a sat tracker. There required for many clients. ie forestry

1830 seems really late to leave for Kelwona. Sunsets around 1920. Night VFR in a heli is not common, in the mountains its almost unheard of..

[SAR_YQQ]

Wow, surprised to hear they are deploying to YLW... not much real estate there to op search and rescue operations (ramp space limited) espcially if they are utilizing C130's or even the C17 (doubtful).. I imagine using the Buffalo and Cormorants only at this time?

The flying club would offer more than enough space for the search aircraft. C-17's don't search - ever. No CC-130's in this region, they don't search effectively in the rocks. Only the Buff and Cormorant from the RCAF this time. CASARA kicks in quite a few aircraft - their contribution is invaluable.

If the search last long enough, the local aviation bubbas might spot some green helos and maybe a blue Dash-8. Twotter from Yellowknife is not too far flung either. These are the assets that are routinely used in mountain searches.

Ref. detailed flight plans - the one time that you need to leave a detailed plan is flying in the rocks. Every river has a name and you can always use Lat/Long to identify a valley route. Putting Hope direct Kelowna is not good enough (not saying that is what happened here, just a made up example). Every time I flew in the rocks I would ensure a detailed routing was on paper - if I had to deviate due to weather I was on the radio to Pacific Radio with the changes. I also ensured that I made position reports on 126.7MHz - just to get my LKP updated.

Good luck to the search effort in BC.

[The Mole]

126.7 doesn't work. Anyone who flies low level will tell you this. Between Hope and Kelwona if the weather is crap good luck. Most heli's fly 200' to 500agl on that route. Even in good weather..... Good luck updating your position....

[iflyforpie]

Every drainage has a name, but you don't know which one you are going to take. There are three main routes to take into the Interior (Fraser Canyon, Coquihalla, Allison Pass) plus a zillion other minor ones (like Chilliwack Lake) and variations thereof (following the KVR through Brookmere to Tulameen) plus cutting corners. Localized weather, high terrain, and detailed locations make it almost impossible to have that on a flightplan. I've done all three major routes in one flight trying to break into the Fraser Valley.

GPS based tracking, while not fool proof, will concentrate a search far better even if only a fraction of the reports make it through--as illustrated by the fixed wing crash in Yoho earli
er this year. It is obvious in this case the ELT has been no help at all.

[J31]

126.7 doesn't work. Anyone who flies low level will tell you this. Between Hope and Kelwona if the weather is crap good luck. Most heli's fly 200' to 500agl on that route. Even in good weather..... Good luck updating your position....

At night! More than half of this flight would have been after sun set. I doubt he would have been that low in the dark.

[The Mole]

Guess you didn't read my other comment about flying at night.....

[Its What I do]

Spot are ok . Cheap yes .
Check out the spidertracks system . www.spidertracks.com if you want a good sat system (forestry certified)
It is less than a 406 ELT and worth every penny. Real time ,iridium system sudden stop sensor.
If he had this unit they would know right where to look.
Hope they find him , lots of country out there.

Its what I do

[iflyforpie]

We use Guardian Maptracs for BCFS. Expensive, but simply plug it in and it works. I throw it on any time I am going cross county.

[J31]

Guess you didn't read my other comment about flying at night.....

Many fly VFR at night using terrain obstacle clearance altitudes with good radio coverage. However like you say night VFR is rare in a Heli but still possible. I just can't see this guy being down low in the dark unless he had a well lit route. However lots of the route from Hope to Kelowna would be very dark during the time he was to be in the area. I sure hope this has a good outcome.

[sticks37]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-c ... earch.html

[SAR_YQQ]

RIP to the pilot - good job on the search teams for wrapping this search up quickly and efficiently. Much easier on the family this way.

[DHC5]

Wow, surprised to hear they are deploying to YLW... not much real estate there to op search and rescue operations (ramp space limited) espcially if they are utilizing C130's or even the C17 (doubtful).. I imagine using the Buffalo and Cormorants only at this time?

C-17's don't search - ever. No CC-130's in this region, they don't search effectively in the rocks. Only the Buff and Cormorant from the RCAF this time.


I know the C17's dont search, but rather for logistical support.
I know the CT-142 Dash8, CC-130, CH-149 Cormorant, CH-115 Buffalo, CH-138 Twotters and CH-146's were used extensively during a search for a missing helio courier a few years back out of CYKA. They actually took over the BCMOF Airtanker base as their ops were done for the year.

[cgartly]

They actually sent a CC-130 from Winnipeg for a couple of days to assist with this search. Unfortunately one of the buffalo's became u/s as did one of the cormerants. The military had both up and running again within a day.

It was one of Wildcat Helicopters machines that was doing some low level work in the area at 300' agl that found the wreckage and called it in to the CASARA high bird. I was in the high bird at the time.

Glad the helicopter was found, the family can now begin their grief process.

Too bad the outcome wasn't better. It was a real pleasure working with our military and the various CASARA teams throughout the search.

We live in an amazing country. I can't believe the resources deployed to look for one guy.

[BGH]

For those that knew Rod & missed this in the province/sun obituaries today:

http://www.legacy.com/obituaries/thepro ... =153995821