Air Canada halts overnight stays in downtown Winnipeg

[Go Guns]

Ahh, I stand corrected. Sorry.

[bcflyer]

No worries. Your post was mostly correct just wanted to clarify the details thats all!!

[The Old Fogducker]

From the Winnipeg Free Press

WINNIPEG — Air Canada has apologized for what the Assembly of Manitoba Chiefs called a racist internal memo that suggests First Nations residents displaced by floods are making downtown Winnipeg dangerous.


In a widely circulating memo, Air Canada said it's pulling flight crews on Winnipeg layovers from downtown's Radisson hotel to the Sandman hotel near the airport because "several downtown locations" are "susceptible to crimes of violence and opportunity."


The memo connects the safety situation to the presence of "approximately 1,000 displaced people from rural Manitoba" in hotels near the Radisson.


The memo has already been criticized by Winnipeg Mayor Sam Katz, the downtown Winnipeg Business Improvement Zone and Air Canada's pilots association. The mayor has requested Air Canada reverse its decision.


On Monday, the Assembly of Manitoba Chiefs blasted the memo as racist, requested clarification and an apology. Grand Chief Derek Nepinak said the victims of flooding at Lake St. Martin First Nation and other Interlake communities have suffered enough without being blamed for downtown Winnipeg's woes.


"It's entirely inappropriate for one of Canada's largest corporations to link the presence of our people in the downtown core with any security risk," Nepinak told reporters, calling the memo racist.


Approximately 700 displaced First Nations residents remain in hotels and another 1,000 are being billeted in homes or apartments, the AMC estimates. Nepinak said many displaced families currently living in hotels would like to leave downtown Winnipeg because it's not safe for young children.


He said he is aware of a handful of individual displaced people causing problems, but they are no longer in hotels.


Nepinak said an apology from Air Canada would go a long way. He said the AMC is exploring legal options but is not calling for a boycott or any other action until Air Canada clarifies its position.


Two hours after Nepinak met with reporters, Air Canada offered an apology.


"It appears that certain inferences are being drawn from the contents of a recent internal bulletin relating to accommodation for flight crews on overnight layover in Winnipeg," spokesman Peter Fitzpatrick said via email.


"Air Canada wishes to state categorically it had no intent to cause offence to any individual or group and apologizes if it inadvertently did so."

© Copyright (c) Winnipeg Free Press

[winds_in_flight_wtf]

Okay, so let's say that Air Canada's motives were simply due to the native population / trend of crime, ok..... so what's the point? Are they afraid they will have nobody else to rob? Are they truly concerned about human rights? (referring to Chiefs) . Did they make these claims in person or via satellite from their 4000 sq ft complex getaways?

I could care less if they are offended (especially since AC divulged nothing which would point to a racist assumption) . Let them be offended. They have a right to be offended like all Canadians. Do not try and restrict my free will to do as I please because of your thin skin. I wonder if they will try and sue Air Canada and demand apologies for the next 150 years?

May AC flight crews have fantastic layovers in the near future!

[HavaJava]

I just heard on CBC radio that Air Canada has admitted that the reason for moving out of the downtown core was not due to security but instead a financial decision. Seems like they wanted to deliberately break the ACPA and CUPE contracts under the guise of safety. These egotistical corporate snakes must be stopped!

[CD]

[Johnny#5]

[Donald]

I say blame the Jets.

Radisson probably wanted their $99 rooms back from Air Canada, so they could charge Jets fans double or triple.

Security was the easy way out for AC, but it's not stretching the truth in Winnipeg!

[RFN]

YWG is a great town, it just suffers from poor publicity.

[Les Habitants]

I'm extremely upset. This has a very negative casting on my favorite group, the Orange Oompa Loompas, of which I am apart of. Nowhere do I see it mentioning how great we are in this article about Air Canada.


Seriously, it's funny how Winnipeg doesn't demand an apology for AC stereotyping their city. Natives are the only ones who demand apologies when they are offended.

Keep in mind, this isn't to stereotype all Natives-I have a LOT of Native friends that I've encountered in my work. One of them even lives in ZTM!!! They're people I would give the shirt off my back to, and they would do the same for me. It seems to be the Chiefs and the higher up powers who are this way.

[CID]

Hava java, that's completely incorrect. Air Canada has officially stated that it was certainly not based on financial issues. it's the Air Canada pilot's union and the mayor of Winnipeg that are trying to sell the idea that the decision is financially motivated.

We need to keep in mind that Air Canada officials never intended to have the directive released outside the company. It was an internal memo and a union member likely gave it to the media to create all this hoopla.

For better or for worse it has stimulated discussion and the FN leaders in the province are trying to transform it from a real-life observation of the natives in Winnipeg to a racist attack.

The reality is that the memo is pretty accurate but the violence doesn't come JUST from the influx of idle hands from flooded communities. And nothing much has changed over the last several decades with respect to downtown. Winnipeg is actually a very safe city and a good place to raise a family as long as you are aware of the specific situation. Namely that Manitoba's population includes about 10% first nations people as compared to the national average of 2%.

But as I alluded to, if you know the city, you know to avoid downtown after business hours and the north end and specific "people".

Walk down a back lane downtown in the evening and it's easy to see an aboriginal person sucking back the contents of a Lysol can or breathing in glue or gasoline from a plastic bag. Go visit a local prison and see how 10% of the population manages to populate 70% of the prison.

Sit in the emergency admitting room at the hospitals and see how that same 10% of the population seems to dominate.

Go north and watch how aboriginals come off medevac flights to larger communities just to walk off the airplane and refuse care. But don't worry, they'll show up at the airport in a few days for a free flight back to the reserve as a warrant is issued for a full fare ticket compliments of the Canadian tax payer.

Take a drive around town and check out the graffiti tags from the Manitoba Warriors, the Indian Posse and the Native Syndicate gangs. No, they aren't run by disgruntled Irish youth. Then read the daily news of murders and violent assaults by people with "gang affiliations" who turn out to be of the native persuasion.

Read the news stories of a young Chilean man who wanted to visit Winnipeg as a tourist and picked a downtown hotel. He was told Canada was safe compared to Chile but he was beaten unconscious as he emerged from the hotel for a morning walk.

And the other news item from an ex-Winnipegger who now lives in Vancouver who visited and decided to check out the downtown Portage Place mall only to be randomly violently attacked. And how about the NUMEROUS reports of hockey teams and other such visitors to Winnipeg who have all their stuff stolen from vehicles parked in downtown hotel parking lots.

Air Canada management is completely justified in being concerned about their employees in downtown Winnipeg and although they weren't completely correct with respect to the source, they were as politically correct as they needed to be.

Before anything can be improved, the FN leaders need to acknowledge who is primarily responsible for all this crime. But don't hold your breath.

[Les Habitants]

Before anything can be improved, the FN leaders need to acknowledge who is primarily responsible for all this crime. But don't hold your breath.

That would involve taking responsibility, something I haven't seen any assembly of chiefs or band councils do in my lifetime. It seems like they'd rather blame others for their troubles
You sure didn't hold back in your assessment of what things are like.

[Koopa]

Hava java, that's completely incorrect. Air Canada has officially stated that it was certainly not based on financial issues. it's the Air Canada pilot's union and the mayor of Winnipeg that are trying to sell the idea that the decision is financially motivated.

We need to keep in mind that Air Canada officials never intended to have the directive released outside the company. It was an internal memo and a union member likely gave it to the media to create all this hoopla.

For better or for worse it has stimulated discussion and the FN leaders in the province are trying to transform it from a real-life observation of the natives in Winnipeg to a racist attack.

The reality is that the memo is pretty accurate but the violence doesn't come JUST from the influx of idle hands from flooded communities. And nothing much has changed over the last several decades with respect to downtown. Winnipeg is actually a very safe city and a good place to raise a family as long as you are aware of the specific situation. Namely that Manitoba's population includes about 10% first nations people as compared to the national average of 2%.

But as I alluded to, if you know the city, you know to avoid downtown after business hours and the north end and specific "people".

Walk down a back lane downtown in the evening and it's easy to see an aboriginal person sucking back the contents of a Lysol can or breathing in glue or gasoline from a plastic bag. Go visit a local prison and see how 10% of the population manages to populate 70% of the prison.

Sit in the emergency admitting room at the hospitals and see how that same 10% of the population seems to dominate.

Go north and watch how aboriginals come off medevac flights to larger communities just to walk off the airplane and refuse care. But don't worry, they'll show up at the airport in a few days for a free flight back to the reserve as a warrant is issued for a full fare ticket compliments of the Canadian tax payer.

Take a drive around town and check out the graffiti tags from the Manitoba Warriors, the Indian Posse and the Native Syndicate gangs. No, they aren't run by disgruntled Irish youth. Then read the daily news of murders and violent assaults by people with "gang affiliations" who turn out to be of the native persuasion.

Read the news stories of a young Chilean man who wanted to visit Winnipeg as a tourist and picked a downtown hotel. He was told Canada was safe compared to Chile but he was beaten unconscious as he emerged from the hotel for a morning walk.

And the other news item from an ex-Winnipegger who now lives in Vancouver who visited and decided to check out the downtown Portage Place mall only to be randomly violently attacked. And how about the NUMEROUS reports of hockey teams and other such visitors to Winnipeg who have all their stuff stolen from vehicles parked in downtown hotel parking lots.

Air Canada management is completely justified in being concerned about their employees in downtown Winnipeg and although they weren't completely correct with respect to the source, they were as politically correct as they needed to be.

Before anything can be improved, the FN leaders need to acknowledge who is primarily responsible for all this crime. But don't hold your breath.

Get a fucking grip, pal. One of the most racist things I've read on here in a while...and that's saying a lot!

[ivtec]

Edit

[Les Habitants]

I think that a lot of pilots forget some things when it comes to the Native program in Canada. Most of us started out with a handful of hours on a cessna and built our experience in the IFR world because these people had no other mode of transportation. Yes, a lot of the money (most of it, in fact) for their travels comes out of OUR taxes, and yes the system IS frequently abused, but unfortunately that's what you get when you put socialistic minds in government (sorry NDPers), an opportunity for the system to be blatantly abused by people who just don't want to work. (I'm not suggesting that socialism is BAD per se, I'm just pointing out the downside to it-please don't start that discussion).

What I think Koopa is reacting to is the fact that we look at all the cultural and social issues associated with aboriginal peoples and label them because of their skin color. The reality of it is, these people grow up on reserves that are very socially challenged. A lot of corruption goes on between the leaders, the vast majority of kids are not taught morals/ethics/values of any sort, there is no pressure to stay in school and get a job because...well quite frankly, the government will cover them with free money if they feel too lazy to work. I don't believe for one second this is a product of their race or skin color; The issue lies not within the race of these people, but the culture they've grown up in. If my parents had never disciplined me as a kid, why would I hesitate to go around smashing peoples windows in? How would I even have known that is an unacceptable practice if I was never told so? If my parents had never taught me to be polite, how would I have known the importance of proper interaction with strangers? There are a LOT of Natives who don't even know how to go to a supermarket and buy a can of beans! And it's not because they are Native, it's because the culture they grow up in is horrible! I can't bring myself to feel any remorse towards them for this, in fact I pity those people. The worst part is, as long as they stay segregated from the rest of the world, nothing will ever change!

I've had big Native lady's come tumbling down the air stairs of the plane, throw the ear plugs on the ground at my feet, and tell me to "pick them up, white boy." When I see that, I feel as the rest of you do towards the people, but then I'm forced to remember that this is not a matter of race. It is just one person who needed a bit of TLC as a kid, and it's not fair for me to pin that kind of behavior on all Natives. know a large number of Native peoples who are crazy intelligent, and very good at trades-construction, carpentry, etc. I even know several Native pilots, and all of them are great people! If anyone has met a man from YIV by the initials of Steve M, you know what kind of people I am talking about! When I think of these people, and when I think of the great sense of humor most of these people have, it saddens me to see others who are on the other end of the spectrum.

I think we would do well, as pilots, to realize that Native people are a huge driving factor in aviation-giving VERY many of us the start in aviation we so desperately needed. As a tax payer, it hurts to see the system abused, but as a pilot I am grateful that I have a job that is so secure. I also can't blame them for being told as a kid "the white man took away your land, so this is what he owes you." or "it's okay to abuse the system" or "it's okay to get free money without working." What I can look at is the leadership-the chiefs and band councils and wonder why on earth the grand chief of Manitoba, who lives in a one million dollar mansion in Winnipeg, and visited the pope pointing fingers at the Canadian government, doesn't buck up and tell his people to stop destroying their own culture.

Just food for thought.

[CpnCrunch]

That was very well put, Les Habitants. I think you have summed up the situation very well.

[CID]

Koopa, my post would definitely be "racist" if any of it were untrue or baseless. Perhaps you can enlighten me as to which facts I presented are incorrect.

The issue of the marginalization and isolation of indigenous peoples in this country will never be resolved if we are afraid to talk about it under the fear of being labelled "racist".

INAC, (now the department of Aboriginal Affairs) should be dissolved and the entire reserve scheme overhauled. Why can't we all have equal access to government social programs and respect the treaties without forcing aboriginals to fester in squalor under corrupt leadership?

Like you Koopa, the FN leaders cry "racism" whenever they detect any logical argument that threatens the end of the gravy train. As a long time Canadian tax payer, I'm sick of it.

[Go Guns]

From Macleans
They got the Jets—then lost the pilots

Air Canada stops sending its pilots into downtown Winnipeg “due to safety concerns”
by Jaime Weinman on Friday, October 7, 2011 10:30am - 0 Comments

You’ve heard of people moving out of downtown areas and into suburban neighbourhoods. Now the airline personnel are doing it themselves—in Winnipeg, at least. Air Canada has announced that “due to safety concerns,” it will stop using the Radisson Hotel in the city’s downtown core to house its pilots and crew. Instead, during layovers, Air Canada employees will be bussed to an airport hotel. A spokesman for the airline told the Winnipeg Free Press this came in reaction to an assessment by “local law enforcement officials, and our own security people,” and didn’t say when—if ever—it will be safe for flight attendants to venture back downtown.

’Peggers bristled at the suggestion their downtown is dangerous. Winnipeg Mayor Sam Katz fumed that Air Canada should “say exactly what it is they’re saying” about the perceived threats, implying that safety issues might be an excuse for cutting costs: “There’s more to this than meets the eye,” he said. “The reasons don’t appear to be valid.” The decision comes as a blow at a time when, finally, Winnipeg’s reputation seemed on the mend. This summer, the NHL returned to Winnipeg, but now that the Jets are back, the jet pilots are fleeing.

The airline hasn’t yet given a full public justification for the decision, but an internal memo fingered the “1,000 displaced people from rural Manitoba” who were forced to flee their homes during summer flooding. Air Canada has since apologized for what the Assembly of Manitoba Chiefs called a racist claim that Aboriginal flood victims were making the city dangerous. Airlines expect their pilots to be brave enough to withstand bad weather and the threat of terrorist attacks but, it seems, they must be protected at all costs from homeless people.

[flyinhigh]

. Airlines expect their pilots to be brave enough to withstand bad weather and the threat of terrorist attacks but, it seems, they must be protected at all costs from homeless people.[/i]

So now we must worry about the outside factors when not doing our job. WOW. Bite Me. On my time down I don't want to be bugged, I want to relax so that the next day I can do my job safely to protect this reports Sorry ass.

[Rockie]

Nobody is being completely honest in this fiasco. Winnipeg is not admitting they have a problem downtown that may cause concerns to some people staying there, and the airline is not being honest either when they claim safety is the issue...because it's not.

The previous hotel's proximity to a certain bar plays a large part in what makes it somewhat undesirable from a safety point of view, but there are plenty in the downtown area that are completely safe and Air Canada knows it. For them it's about cost and they deserve the bad press they're getting for trying to disguise their real motives like this.

[fish4life]

wouldn't it work better for crews in regards to crew rest if they stayed at a hotel near the airport anyway? IE reducing the drive time by 40 minutes round trip depending on traffic?

[mbav8r]

Sure, what's for dinner, Wendy's, Costco hotdogs or the 50 dollar steak at the chophouse. Oh sorry forgot the Airport food court. As long as their rest period starts 20 mins sooner.

[Rockie]

wouldn't it work better for crews in regards to crew rest if they stayed at a hotel near the airport anyway? IE reducing the drive time by 40 minutes round trip depending on traffic?

It's a very short drive to downtown from the airport.

[CID]

There are actually a lot of dining choices near the airport. Especially if you can make your way two blocks down around the Polo Park area. There you have a ton of shopping and dining options. Downtown isn't all that far but it's not like it's walking distance.

[2R]

No mention of the wahabi sect school downtown. Funded by the same country what funded the 9-11 attacks ?
Blame the injuns again as they will not issue a fatwah calling for your beheading.No mention of the real security threats.
Makes me wonder if the CBC even has an office in Winnipeg