Crash at Brenda Mines on BC Highway 97

[arrow203]

Anyone have more? So far all I have is this unconfirmed:

https://twitter.com/#!/ScanBC/status/201866187217436674

[cncpc]

Anyone have more? So far all I have is this unconfirmed:

https://twitter.com/#!/ScanBC/status/201866187217436674

this in the Sun now...

http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Float+ ... story.html

[C-FABH]

Latest information I have indicates one confirmed fatality with the TSB and coroner enr-oute.

[cgartly]

Unfortunately doesn't look like there are any survivors.

http://www.castanet.net/edition/news-st ... .htm#75163

[twotter]

Good buddy and customer of mine.. Not a good day..

[golden hawk]

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2012 ... newscanada

Aviation community 'devastated' by crash
By Michael Mui, QMI Agency



Colin Moyes died along with two passengers when his float plane, based at an airport at Pitt Meadows, B.C. crashed near Kelowna on Sunday, May 13 2012. The cause of the crash is unknown. (Facebook)



Three dead in B.C. plane crash

VANCOUVER - The aviation community is mourning the loss of well-known pilot Colin Moyes, who died along with two passengers when his float plane crashed in the Okanagan.

Transportation Safety Board investigator Bill Yearwood said the single-engine de Havilland Beaver took off from Kelowna, B.C., about 15 minutes prior to crashing at 6:45 p.m. Sunday into a forested, higher-terrain area.

It’s too soon to determine what happened, but there was no information to suggest any distress with Pitt Meadows, B.C.-based aircraft, he added.

. . said everyone at the small airstrip is “devastated” by the tragedy.

“I wouldn’t even begin to speculate (what happened),” . said.

There were initially five people scheduled to be on board; One never got on, while the fourth disembarked in Kelowna before the fatal flight, which was headed back to Pitt Meadows.

It’s believed Moyes was the widowed father of a young son.

Pitt Meadows Mayor Deb Walters also offered condolences.

“It’s devastating to a small community when things like this happen. Our hearts are with the families and our prayers go out to them,” she said.

The crash comes a day after five people were killed when two planes collided in mid-air in Saskatchewan.

The B.C. Coroners Service is also investigating.

“Of course we think about it, but there’s no rhyme or reason to life,” . said of what goes through a pilot’s mind after an air tragedy. “(But) flying an airplane is not that much different from operating a boat or a car.

“Something went terribly wrong.”

[flyinthebug]

Good interview and comments .. Was this a commercial flight or private? Ill bet those 2 pax that decided to sit this one out, did some serious thanking to their higher power! What a shame. Another DHC2 fell outta the sky. Why does this keep happening?? My most sincere condolences to the family and friends of those affected by this tragic accident.

Please fly safe all! FTB

[cncpc]

Good interview and comments .. Was this a commercial flight or private? Ill bet those 2 pax that decided to sit this one out, did some serious thanking to their higher power! What a shame. Another DHC2 fell outta the sky. Why does this keep happening?? My most sincere condolences to the family and friends of those affected by this tragic accident.

Please fly safe all! FTB

With the nature of that terrain and the witness observations, it is possible that this is a case of flight into rising terrain, last second turn, stall spin. Possibly complicated by flying right into a low sun.

Engine failure? Highway is right there.

All very sad.

[iflyforpie]

My condolences to all affected.

According to news reports, an emergency beacon (ELT, SPOT?) was activated just before the crash...

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/3-confirmed-de ... 44740.html

[flyinthebug]

With the nature of that terrain and the witness observations, it is possible that this is a case of flight into rising terrain, last second turn, stall spin. Possibly complicated by flying right into a low sun.

Engine failure? Highway is right there.

All very sad.

Its too early to speculate but it was SKC that day, so even with a low sun, why would he have put himself in that position to face rising terrain? He had been in the air 15 mins, so had plenty of time to climb to the required altitude and adjust his course accordingly. CFIT doesnt seem to fit this accident. Engine failure is a realistic observation but again, far too soon to suggest that was the reason.
Fly safe all.

[cncpc]

With the nature of that terrain and the witness observations, it is possible that this is a case of flight into rising terrain, last second turn, stall spin. Possibly complicated by flying right into a low sun.

Engine failure? Highway is right there.

All very sad.

Its too early to speculate but it was SKC that day, so even with a low sun, why would he have put himself in that position to face rising terrain? He had been in the air 15 mins, so had plenty of time to climb to the required altitude and adjust his course accordingly. CFIT doesnt seem to fit this accident. Engine failure is a realistic observation but again, far too soon to suggest that was the reason.
Fly safe all.

Kelowna paper has some comment from TSB guy. It didn't go straight down and wreckage over 50 meters, so yes, stall spin probably inaccurate speculation. The wreckage trail is north, so he wouldn't have been into sun. Maybe trying to make the highway.

I agree with all your comments.

[cncpc]

Not quite sure where it went down, but there is a section of road right in front of where it seems to be that is aligned pretty near to north.

[howard40]

witness seemed to indicate "gliding trying to make highway"

[adhc2]

A tragic loss and condolences to all concerned. TSB now must do their due dilligence and determine the reason. Although this crash and location has all the ingredients found in rising terrain accidents we must await the TSB findings. However it is an opportunity to revisit this often too frequent scenario we see out here in this area. I live about 20 miles south of this location and have flown over and around this area commercially and privately for 30 years and know this location well. I also have flown Beavers on floats for more than 10 years and understand their limitations. That day like many other days in this neighborhood was quite warm and at that time of day we see significant subsidence especially with west winds. West bound flite at that time is is more challenging flying into a lower setting sun and ridgelines become difficult to distinguish. Certainly factors that day which increased the pilots workload. The valley they flew up has a gentle climb gradient until you arrive in the vicinity of the crash sight which is essentially a bowl. The valley floor is at 3000 ft whereas the the ridge line is at about 5000 ft. and this transition occurs in about a mile. In the last 20 years we have had 18 accidents attributed to A/C unable to outclimb terrain with many deaths resulting. Again I am not presuming this to be the cause I just want to remind other pilots to get their altitude in the valley before proceeding enroute it is fundamental mountain flying.

Fly safe

[Cat Driver]

Although this crash and location has all the ingredients found in rising terrain accidents we must await the TSB findings.

By the time the TSB publish their findings this accident will be so long ago few will remember it.

So general discussions on possible causes are good, because it gives us cause to examine possible risks that some pilots do not think about enough.

[adhc2]

Yes Cat driver you are right it takes far to long to publish findings and although this accident does suggest the possibility of flight into rising terrain we cannot and must not draw a conclusion based on partial information. However I felt compelled to remind all pilots of the this incideous scenario that has occured in my neighborhood so many times. In 2010 within two months two different A/C turned left out of Penticton west bound two guys servived in one crash 4 died in the other. In 03 I was refuelling at Penticton after flying a fire suppression sortie and was asked for advise from an amphib Dhc2 driver about best route to YYC. I advised him not to turn right after departure for direct but to fly up the west side of lake okanagan north toward Kelowna Vernon area and get altitude then turn enroute and saw off the doglegs along Hwy 1. He jumped in his plane and did the right turn crashed just 30 feet below the Greyback dam at the 4000 ft level 20 miles to the northwest in rising terrain.There was a fire and all souls on board perished. This one still haunts me as I was the last person he saw and spoke to.
I like you think we all need to be reminded of the perils we face in aviation with the risks we deal with complacency can kill.

[flyinthebug]

A tragic loss and condolences to all concerned. TSB now must do their due dilligence and determine the reason. Although this crash and location has all the ingredients found in rising terrain accidents we must await the TSB findings. However it is an opportunity to revisit this often too frequent scenario we see out here in this area. I live about 20 miles south of this location and have flown over and around this area commercially and privately for 30 years and know this location well. I also have flown Beavers on floats for more than 10 years and understand their limitations. That day like many other days in this neighborhood was quite warm and at that time of day we see significant subsidence especially with west winds. West bound flite at that time is is more challenging flying into a lower setting sun and ridgelines become difficult to distinguish. Certainly factors that day which increased the pilots workload. The valley they flew up has a gentle climb gradient until you arrive in the vicinity of the crash sight which is essentially a bowl. The valley floor is at 3000 ft whereas the the ridge line is at about 5000 ft. and this transition occurs in about a mile. In the last 20 years we have had 18 accidents attributed to A/C unable to outclimb terrain with many deaths resulting. Again I am not presuming this to be the cause I just want to remind other pilots to get their altitude in the valley before proceeding enroute it is fundamental mountain flying.

Fly safe

This is exactly why I tend to shy away from too much speculation immediately after a crash. I understand that some discussion is necessary and should even be encouraged.

Now that I have read your local knowledge of that area, it changes my initial thought dramatically.

Discussion is good I suppose on these sad topics. If we can learn something (like I just did) then at least we have that. I didnt even consider some of the issues you mentioned he may have faced, and I have a few hours in a -2 as well (on the coast).

Thanks for the insight into the local terrain. Would this pilot not have been familiar with that route as well though?

Fly safe all. FTB

[adhc2]

So fly in the bug it was mentioned in the news that the Pilot was familiar with the neighborhood. As it has been said typically accidents occur through a chain of events, this certainly may be such a case That said you mentioned you also have -2 time and would know there is a significant difference in performance between a lightly and heavily loaded beaver. Given the conditions any malfunction blowing a tank etc or engine trouble the loss of altitude can be enough of a consequence to put them in harms way. What ever the outcome of the investigation I would hope there is something we all can learn from this. We have lost many over the years and so my condolences to all affected by this tragedy

[flyinthebug]

So fly in the bug it was mentioned in the news that the Pilot was familiar with the neighborhood. As it has been said typically accidents occur through a chain of events, this certainly may be such a case That said you mentioned you also have -2 time and would know there is a significant difference in performance between a lightly and heavily loaded beaver. Given the conditions any malfunction blowing a tank etc or engine trouble the loss of altitude can be enough of a consequence to put them in harms way. What ever the outcome of the investigation I would hope there is something we all can learn from this. We have lost many over the years and so my condolences to all affected by this tragedy

I dont disagree with anything you say here. My thought was that with 2 of his original passengers not reboarding, he should not have been anywhere near gross? Unless they decided to give up their seats for freight? I certainly understand the characteristics of the -2 when at gross or 1000 lbs under gross...vast difference in performance. I understand the "chain of events" better then most having survived a DHC2 crash in 08. It was a chain of events that led to me breaking 22 bones and losing my medical forever. I just didnt think he would be at gross with only 3 of his original 5 passengers was my point.
Thoughts?

Fly safe all.

[iflyforpie]

The plane was probably climbing sluggishly though. That combined with perhaps a race against fading daylight precluded climbing to a higher altitude first before going West. The (relatively) low rolling hills of the Okanagan valley are seducing to pilots looking to cut corners, but I don't think in this case they were the direct cause of the crash. They certainly added risk though.

At less than 5500 feet at the mines, you don't have very many options but deeply wooded forest in a steep valley. 6500-8500 feet, you would be able to make the highway going down the 7% or whatever slope it is going down or perhaps one of the smaller lakes above the mine. Above 8500 feet over the mines (you need 8500 feet to comfortably go through the coast ranges anyways), you are within reach of the straight and level parts of the highway on the plateau, you have Pennask Lake not much further on, and you might even be able to make Okanagan Lake with a tail wind.

[c170b53]

This was an amphib; with full fuel and passengers he must have been fairly heavy on the outbound.

[trey kule]

By the time the TSB publish their findings this accident will be so long ago few will remember it.

We dont need to remember the accident to learn the lessons from the TSB findings. They take time.

A tragic loss.

[azimuthaviation]

Someone drew me a square once with an arrow coming from the top pointing forward and an arrow from the bottom pointing back an arrow on the front pointing up and an arrow on the back pointing down. Then the mirror image of that. The two supposed to represent the four forces on an ac and an ac on floats. The forces were the same but the torques were different I guess due to weight n drag of the floats. Is it even possible to glide a float plane with an engine failure? Has a forced landing in a float or amphib ever been successful on land or water? Or is it pretty rare?

[I_Heart_Seaplanes]

Is it even possible to glide a float plane with an engine failure? Has a forced landing in a float or amphib ever been successful on land or water? Or is it pretty rare?

Simply...Yes. I try to make every landing power-off, and I practice forced approaches a few times a day on a 180 on straight floats.

[AJV]

Is it even possible to glide a float plane with an engine failure? Has a forced landing in a float or amphib ever been successful on land or water? Or is it pretty rare?

this guy did it not so long ago....

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