North Wright Air Norman Wells

[DanWEC]

The deal breaker for me was the 4 year commitment. I couldn't imagine spending that long there, in a town of 600 oil workers. The part that I don't get is that generally, when you go to less desirable locales, the pay increases proportionally, or there are other advantages. (Like the oil workers that are making six figures just for being there), yet here it's still horrible pay, and up to a year in the freakin ground! But I have been accused as being too picky.

Rant aside, I sincerely wish you good luck, it will be an experience for you and will eventually get you flying and on your way. The guys I talked to on the phone seemed very nice.

[con24]

Thanks Danwec yup I am worried about the 4 year contract too and more worried to find out the living condition in the camp and how things are there for females... I don't want to be the only female working there or living in the camp... And you are soo right about the population too : (

[shimmydampner]

. The part that I don't get is that generally, when you go to less desirable locales, the pay increases proportionally, or there are other advantages.

I think that generally only holds true if you are bringing a certain amount of experience and skills to the table. No offence, but a 200 hour wonder does not. I think the advantage for low timers is the chance to build a lot of hours quickly. Couple that with a fleet like North Wright has and the opportunity exists for rapid advancement compared to other places.

[DanWEC]

. The part that I don't get is that generally, when you go to less desirable locales, the pay increases proportionally, or there are other advantages.

No offence, but a 200 hour wonder does not.

You're completely right, and none taken, but think about how shitty that sounds compared with graduates from a full degree in any other degree or trade. Any other! But that's a whoooole other thread (ssssssss).

Personally, I wish I could be flying up there, but other circumstances make that impossible. They do have a great fleet and the landscape looks amazing. I might even be a bit envious of the original poster.

[Johnny#5]

I worked there for a while...

Basically "it was the best of times, it was the worst of times."

[OhHenry]

A summary of what to expect:

Pros:

1. By the end of the 4 years you spend there (because everyone leaves the day their bond expires) you will have enough quality hours in your log book to pick whatever job you want
2. Some of the pilots at the company are genuinely nice guys
3. Lots of opportunity for fun in the summer if you're the "outdoorsy" type
4. Once you get moved into one of the crew houses (usually after about a year in the crew camp) the living conditions are fairly good

Cons:

1. You will not enjoy working for the company. There is a reason why advancement is so quick; no one wants to stay longer than they have to
2. You will not get along with management. They will not get along with you
3. You will be treated as expendable from day 1. You will work very long hours, minimum 6 days per week, often 7 with no overtime or statutory holiday pay
4. You will be expected to perform tasks far outside your job description. Pilots are also responsible for every manual labour task at the company, as well as covering any office jobs when required
5. When you eventually get upgraded to the flight line you are expected to be at work Monday through Saturday whether you are flying or not. "Duty Times" are only counted on days when your name is in the log book
6. The living conditions in the crew camp are atrocious. The camp is a couple Atco trailers pushed together. The interior is genuinely not fit for humans to live in. Cold and drafty in the winter, stifling hot in the summer. In the summer you will not have a screen on your window so you will have to choose whether to keep it closed and suffocate in the heat or open it and deal with mosquitoes buzzing around your head all night
7. Considering the price of goods and services in Norman Wells the salary is very low

I'm sure there are more pros and cons I could list for you but those are the main ones that I can think of right now

edit: I just re-read your post and picked up on the fact that you are female. You will be treated slightly better by management, not have to perform certain tasks, and possibly put into a house quicker than the other guys. Please don't take that as me being sexist, I am just trying to impart my experiences so you can make as informed of a decision as possible. You won't be the only female pilot at the company. Last I knew there were 2 female pilots there although that might have changed since last I knew.

[con24]

Thank you soo much ohHenry.... : )

[OhHenry]

No worries. I wish you all the best whatever you choose

[BTyyj]

"The minimum standard for recruitment of pilots is graduation from a two-year aviation program from a recognized school complete with both an instrument and a multi-engine rating."

So no pilots are hired unless they did a two year diploma program?

[OhHenry]

So no pilots are hired unless they did a two year diploma program?

That's certainly how it was when I was there, no idea if the policy is still the same. It's a different CP now than when I was there but most of the policy was dictated from higher up in the company than the CP anyways

[BTyyj]

Thanks for the help OhHenry. Interesting that that's the case.

[DanWEC]

Thanks for the help OhHenry. Interesting that that's the case.

I know of people that were offered without. Apply!

[goleafsgo]

You'd be wayyy better off going somewhere like perimeter to work the ramp. Sure it's not a 6 month wait on the ramp but such a great company to be at. Decent pay, no bond, log lots of hours once you do start fly, don't have to live in norman wells. Probably the best place to start in aviation.

[BTyyj]

Yes, it sounds like that might be the case.

Just to elaborate, my question was out of curiosity rather than any intention of applying. Thanks for the info though.

[shimmydampner]

You'd be wayyy better off going somewhere like perimeter to work the ramp....don't have to live in norman wells.

Ha! Even the worst place in the NWT is better than the best place in northern Manitoba!

[con24]

Is Manitoba not a great place to live either ?? So it's not only the NWT : (

[goleafsgo]

You'd be wayyy better off going somewhere like perimeter to work the ramp....don't have to live in norman wells.

Ha! Even the worst place in the NWT is better than the best place in northern Manitoba!

Thompsons really not all that bad of a place

[Strolling]

Long time lurker, first time poster.

To supplement what OhHenry said:

Pros:

1. True-ish*. I understand it is no longer the hayday it was pre-economic crash.
2. True.
3. "Lots of opportunity for fun in the summer if you're the "outdoorsy" type" - true, opportunity to watch as rich tourists go off for hunting and canoeing trips of their lifetimes, unfortunately you'll be working 7 days a week 12+hours a day, so don't expect to do too much, at least not in the heat of summer.
4. "Good" is relative, but True.

Cons:

1. True.
2. True.
3. True. Except always seven days a week in the summer, 10-12 if not more hours a day, and even during the slowest times of the winter anyone caravan captain and below is expected to be in six days a week for business hours plus some.
4. Far, far outside your job description, and probably with little oversight or direction.
5. True. And it's not just the 206 drivers and twin co-pilots either, even caravan captains were often expected to be in six days a week, even if not flying.
6. In the winter, your lucky if its just cold and drafty; that's when the furnaces haven't gone out and the power is still on. Also sharing three bathrooms between 12-14 guys? not fun. 2 stoves, 3 refrigerators between 12-14 guys? meal times can be somewhere between a wrestling match and an episode of hell's kitchen.
7. True.

My additional points:
Cons:
1. Pretty much not allowed to leave the 'wells unless on one of your two week vacations, got a needed 5 day reset? sounds like your washing planes for 5 days because you wont get passes for a shopping trip to Yellowknife.
2. Passes are kept like cards at poker, held tight to table and shown only at the last moment.
3. Wanna go on that 5 day reset shopping spree anyways without a pass? That will be $600ish each way to Yellowknife. Also applies if you happen to have your first vacation fall just before your 6 months with the company.
4. Only 2 days of no operation or limited operation a year, Christmas day and New Years. Guys get flown down from the communities for the Christmas party, so that's not too bad.
5. The winter is long, dark and miserable.
6. See point above, also note: flying in the winter is slow, winter lasts a majority of the year up there.

Hope that helps!

On a personal note: It seems there is currently a push in the industry to clean up our image and move more towards a feeling of professional tradesmen or even professionals like engineers, see recent threads regarding the proposed College of Pilots. Regardless of the outcome of this push; you are not helping with your phrasing, grammar, and text-message speak. Would you write that on a letter and mail it? Then perhaps that shouldn't be the way you ask other pilots for their assistance (in the form of input and advice). I don't mean to come down hard on you, but we're seeing more and more of this quasi-language, even to the point of starting to see internet acronyms pop up in official documentation and company correspondence. It makes us all look unprofessional.

[shimmydampner]

Is Manitoba not a great place to live either ?? So it's not only the NWT : (

Either place will be what you make of it. I enjoyed my time in both, but personally found NWT more bearable.

[con24]

Is Manitoba not a great place to live either ?? So it's not only the NWT : (

Either place will be what you make of it. I enjoyed my time in both, but personally found NWT more bearable.

Bearable as in ??

[con24]

Long time lurker, first time poster.

To supplement what OhHenry said:

Pros:

1. True-ish*. I understand it is no longer the hayday it was pre-economic crash.
2. True.
3. "Lots of opportunity for fun in the summer if you're the "outdoorsy" type" - true, opportunity to watch as rich tourists go off for hunting and canoeing trips of their lifetimes, unfortunately you'll be working 7 days a week 12+hours a day, so don't expect to do too much, at least not in the heat of summer.
4. "Good" is relative, but True.

Cons:

1. True.
2. True.
3. True. Except always seven days a week in the summer, 10-12 if not more hours a day, and even during the slowest times of the winter anyone caravan captain and below is expected to be in six days a week for business hours plus some.
4. Far, far outside your job description, and probably with little oversight or direction.
5. True. And it's not just the 206 drivers and twin co-pilots either, even caravan captains were often expected to be in six days a week, even if not flying.
6. In the winter, your lucky if its just cold and drafty; that's when the furnaces haven't gone out and the power is still on. Also sharing three bathrooms between 12-14 guys? not fun. 2 stoves, 3 refrigerators between 12-14 guys? meal times can be somewhere between a wrestling match and an episode of hell's kitchen.
7. True.

My additional points:
Cons:
1. Pretty much not allowed to leave the 'wells unless on one of your two week vacations, got a needed 5 day reset? sounds like your washing planes for 5 days because you wont get passes for a shopping trip to Yellowknife.
2. Passes are kept like cards at poker, held tight to table and shown only at the last moment.
3. Wanna go on that 5 day reset shopping spree anyways without a pass? That will be $600ish each way to Yellowknife. Also applies if you happen to have your first vacation fall just before your 6 months with the company.
4. Only 2 days of no operation or limited operation a year, Christmas day and New Years. Guys get flown down from the communities for the Christmas party, so that's not too bad.
5. The winter is long, dark and miserable.
6. See point above, also note: flying in the winter is slow, winter lasts a majority of the year up there.

Hope that helps!

On a personal note: It seems there is currently a push in the industry to clean up our image and move more towards a feeling of professional tradesmen or even professionals like engineers, see recent threads regarding the proposed College of Pilots. Regardless of the outcome of this push; you are not helping with your phrasing, grammar, and text-message speak. Would you write that on a letter and mail it? Then perhaps that shouldn't be the way you ask other pilots for their assistance (in the form of input and advice). I don't mean to come down hard on you, but we're seeing more and more of this quasi-language, even to the point of starting to see internet acronyms pop up in official documentation and company correspondence. It makes us all look unprofessional.

Thank you soo much for all the information and I am really sorry for being so unprofessional with my posts.

[djpresss]

Yes there is a four year contract but it's not a bond.

Every month $250 is deducted from your pay and if you stay your full contract you get it all back, if you don't stay you forfeit what you put in. Someone here just finished their contract last month. He started low time and has got to fly pretty much every aircraft in the fleet. He has been a B1900 captain for the last 6 months. After 4 years he has cash in the bank, a tonne of experience flying all sorts of different machines and multi-turbine PIC for the airlines - if that's what you want. You can't tell me that's a raw deal.

You will start in the office then get checked out on the 172, 206 and 207 or go co-pilot on the Beech 99, Twin Otter or B1900. Eventually you will be on the pistons and on one of the turbines. That way you get PIC and Turbine experience. Within about 2-3 years you'll go Caravan captain then captain on the 99 or Twin Otter eventually getting onto the B1900. That's not even mentioning if you want to go the float route.

Norman Wells is definitely what you make of it. If you come in with the attitude that you're going to hate it, you will. There are people who have made their life here and love it.

Hope this helps.

[Diadem]

Yes there is a four year contract but it's not a bond.

Every month $250 is deducted from your pay and if you stay your full contract you get it all back, if you don't stay you forfeit what you put in.

Call it whatever the @#$! you want, it's still bullshit; saying it's a "contract" instead of a "bond" doesn't make it any better. Automatically deducting $250/month, which is about 15-17% of the pilot's pay, and withholding it if s/he leaves before the end of the 4 year term is as good as theft. You can't live on less than $2000 per month, and to have have $250 of that withheld is borderline criminal. To have the company keep that money and profit off the backs of its employees is beyond unethical. Maybe you're right though; it shouldn't be called a bond. That would be insulting to bonds.

[Changes in Latitudes]

Does Norman Wells still have decent Chinese food?

[tbaylx]

Yes there is a four year contract but it's not a bond.

Every month $250 is deducted from your pay and if you stay your full contract you get it all back, if you don't stay you forfeit what you put in.

Call it whatever the @#$! you want, it's still bullshit; saying it's a "contract" instead of a "bond" doesn't make it any better. Automatically deducting $250/month, which is about 15-17% of the pilot's pay, and withholding it if s/he leaves before the end of the 4 year term is as good as theft. You can't live on less than $2000 per month, and to have have $250 of that withheld is borderline criminal. To have the company keep that money and profit off the backs of its employees is beyond unethical. Maybe you're right though; it shouldn't be called a bond. That would be insulting to bonds.

I'd just consider the pay without the $250 deduction, and then getting a retention bonus at the end of 4 years. If I was Northwright management that's the way i'd present it. Then everyone is "happy" that they are offering a bonus

For a low timer they do have a nice diversified fleet to grow with. As far as YVQ goes, its at leastt one of the prettier places in the north to live.