Air Nootka Beaver missing near Tofino BC - Aug 16 2013

[Doc]

carb ice; trim problem; invisible terrain...

maintenance... what else... bird problem?

meteorite

Just one more mature, well thought out remark. Your mom must be very proud.

[GUMPS]

Doc, I can't quite tell if you're being sarcastic or not. I hope not, I hate to speculate but before people should start jumping on flying vfr in the mountains let's think for a minute here.

[patter]

Some of the early TSB comments were worrisome to me. Kill switches for the battery before the investigation has started suggests an agenda. And it is probably provoking some of the interested parties.

[Chuck Ellsworth]

Some of the early TSB comments were worrisome to me. Kill switches for the battery before the investigation has started suggests an agenda. And it is probably provoking some of the interested parties.

Don't worry, by the time the TSB massages their final report few here will remember this accident.

[fhmy]

folks, i've had the pleasure of flying with this pilot. he was extremely experienced, and always professional when flying.
although he was utterly capable in low weather scenario's, he was anything but cowboyish with respect to lousy weather.

a myriad of circumstances could have caused an accident such as this, and knowing him personally, i suspect
weather at the time was not a primary, nor secondary factor.


i am deeply saddened by this accident. my heart goes out to all accident families.

[duCapo]

Some of the early TSB comments were worrisome to me. Kill switches for the battery before the investigation has started suggests an agenda. And it is probably provoking some of the interested parties.

I doubt very much if a "kill switch" would have done much to prevent a post crash fire in a DHC-2. The fuel tanks are located in the belly, most are made of aluminum and will rupture on impact, with the resulting fuel spill on or near the hot engine and exhaust. Unfortunately there is not much that can be done about this problem, even the DHC-2 that have the bladder tanks will spill fuel forward into the engine area. Most DHC-2 have had a modification to have the battery mounted on the firewall, with the resulting arcing which may occur post crash. We are kinda fu*!ed no matter how they get bushed. The pilot flying was highly experienced on the coast, with the amount of time he has, he was not one to "push" weather, as some like that pri*k Pelmet, have been spouting on here. Let's wait and see what the TSB has to say, after the intial investigation, though as . said, the accident will be damn near forgotten except for those affected.
(Hey Pelmet, if you ever come to Prince Rupert, come and see me at Inland Air. My name is Bruce MacDonald, I don't hide behind my mother's skirt, or anonymity)

[shimmydampner]

Oh brother, no need to get your hackles up. It's easy to misinterpret and take some comments too personally when an accident hits close to home. I didn't read anywhere that pelmet disparaged the deceased so everyone should take a breath and calm down. He actually makes a valid point about pushing weather in a VFR machine.

[Doc]

Doc, I can't quite tell if you're being sarcastic or not. I hope not, I hate to speculate but before people should start jumping on flying vfr in the mountains let's think for a minute here.

Absolutely not being sarcastic in the least. You brought up a valid point to ponder.

[duCapo]

Oh brother, no need to get your hackles up. It's easy to misinterpret and take some comments too personally when an accident hits close to home. I didn't read anywhere that pelmet disparaged the deceased so everyone should take a breath and calm down. He actually makes a valid point about pushing weather in a VFR machine.

Pelmet wrote:
The stupidity once again of flying around VFR in crap weather in mountainous areas. Maybe the restrictions asked about above should be for the idiots found flying around in this crap. After 25,000 hours, you would think the PIC would have figured it out.

Nothing to misinterpret in that statement. But your point is taken. Time for a deep breath.

[Donald]

Lost even more respect for the mealy mouthed posters on this thread. They know who they are. I'll toast pilots for leaving the gear up. Every time. But I won't point fingers in cases like this, because I don't really know what happened here. The lack of respect shown here is nothing less than sickening.

Unbelievable.

Do you have the guts to re-post your first post on this topic?

The one you posted the day of the crash itself, that the mods deleted?

[pelmet]

Donald, I don't know what Doc posted originally(maybe you could tell us), BUT.....

While I stick to what I said about the stupid things done by so many pilots in VFR into mountain accidents where we do have a report that has eliminated most other likely scenarios, I admit that there may be more to this accident just like in any accident that we don't initially know about.

Unfortunately, I let what appears to be a plausible eyewitness statement from the cockpit make me jump to a conclusion. It may very well be an accurate eyewitness statement but news reports are frequently inaccurate and eyewitness statements can be too. No doubt the final report will rely heavily on this person for what happened and based on his activities after the accident, appears to have had his wits about him. But, while the eyewitness statement may be accurate, he may not have been aware of some sort of fault or other scenario leading to what he saw in the last moments. Hopefully there is an analysis done for other possible causes.

SO.......even if this turns out to be just another CFIT accident, I apologize for doing what seems to happen so frequently here and elsewhere after each accident whether a gear up landing, or a botched visual approach or accident like this. And that is...jumping to a conclusion when not all the facts are known.

[Doc]

Lost even more respect for the mealy mouthed posters on this thread. They know who they are. I'll toast pilots for leaving the gear up. Every time. But I won't point fingers in cases like this, because I don't really know what happened here. The lack of respect shown here is nothing less than sickening.

Unbelievable.

Do you have the guts to re-post your first post on this topic?

The one you posted the day of the crash itself, that the mods deleted?

Yup
I asked why do these happen? That's pretty much a close quote......are we here to discuss me? I'm not. The End

[Donald]

Unbelievable.

Do you have the guts to re-post your first post on this topic?

The one you posted the day of the crash itself, that the mods deleted?

Yup
I asked why do these happen? That's pretty much a close quote......are we here to discuss me? I'm not. The End

If it was that innocent, why did it get deleted?

You jump into these discussions with a high-and-mighty attitude, and proceed to cut up many other posters for their assumptions and conclusions.

The least a person as vocal as you could do, is stand behind your (written) words.

It's really too bad it was deleted so quickly, because it was more than that, and it exposes the true you.

[Chuck Ellsworth]

While I stick to what I said about the stupid things done by so many pilots in VFR into mountain accidents where we do have a report that has eliminated most other likely scenarios,

This was not a VFR into a mountain accident.

It happened at a lake at sea level, a few miles from the ocean.

[Chuck Ellsworth]

How are things going these days Bruce?

As to this.

Pelmet wrote:
The stupidity once again of flying around VFR in crap weather in mountainous areas. Maybe the restrictions asked about above should be for the idiots found flying around in this crap. After 25,000 hours, you would think the PIC would have figured it out.

Nothing to misinterpret in that statement. But your point is taken. Time for a deep breath.

Judging by his posts here I don't think he has a clue about flying floats on the west coast.

[jeta1]

Some of the early TSB comments were worrisome to me. Kill switches for the battery before the investigation has started suggests an agenda. And it is probably provoking some of the interested parties.

Indeed. Post-crash fires have been on Bill Yearwood's agenda for years now, and that is the first thing he inappropriately said to the ignorant press who chewed on it and spat it back. For impact he brings back some previous cases where pilots were killed by fire in survivable accidents, playing the sympathy card , getting statements from the grieving pilot's mother, and oh the asses at TC cant get it right can they, they let our kids burn because they wont mandate kill switches in all aircraft. Nonsense.... . Kill switches have been discussed and to me they fit in the same utopic category as mandatory helmet wearing, mandatory lifejacket wearing in all phases of flight for floatplanes, mandatory CRM for all pilots including single pilots, and the TSB mandatory wish-list goes on and on and on. Most wish items bring a myriad of other risks, let alone near-impossible implementation. Its easy for the TSB to whine about TC does not do this or TC has not actioned our stupid recs from 10-15 years ago. The TSB does a very good job at investigating, but they arent so good at public speaking, and their recs have a terrible track record. They need to advise Bill Y to stick to investigating, and use their comm people to talk to the press.

[duCapo]

How are things going these days Bruce?

Pretty hectic ., I should have remembered the old adage "be careful what you wish for" I miss the slower pace I had a year ago:-( but forward is progress.
As to this.

Pelmet wrote:
The stupidity once again of flying around VFR in crap weather in mountainous areas. Maybe the restrictions asked about above should be for the idiots found flying around in this crap. After 25,000 hours, you would think the PIC would have figured it out.

Nothing to misinterpret in that statement. But your point is taken. Time for a deep breath.

Judging by his posts here I don't think he has a clue about flying floats on the west coast.

"Illegitimi non carborundum est"

[Chuck Ellsworth]

I would be a little bit more interested in Yearwoods interviews if the TSB were more forthcoming with factual information when they get it like the accident investigators do in the USA.

But we wait for years and then get long winded reports that have been so sanatized by lawyer think that people fall asleep reading them.

[shimmydampner]

Judging by his posts here I don't think he has a clue about flying floats on the west coast.

Surely having flown floats on the west coast is not a prerequisite to having an opinion on the follies of flying a VFR machine in garbage weather.

[Chuck Ellsworth]

My point was where this accident happened is not a mountainous area accident.

[bandaid]

This thread once again has turned toxic. In respect for those who parished I am going to lock this up.