Waterloo PC12, FO

[Sky_Conqueror]

I work at Cebu Pacific. Company has expanded and is expanding. Enjoying every moment of it. I know people all over South East Asia. So when I layover in HK, SIN, BKK I never end up alone ''checkremarks''. It beats flying in -50 degrees in the winter.

A respected low-timer as I call it is a qualified pilot who actually is hired to fly the damn thing. And does not have to endorse salve work, clean and wash the bosse's car, lick the toilet bowl to MAYBE have a chance to fly on company aircraft. I find this degrading! 75% of the worlds' pilots don't follow what we do in Canada.

[Positiveclimb]

A little off topic, but the initial airbus training is flying the machine with no auto pilot, no auto thrust , no flight directors , even during the type there are plenty of times when you are put in direct law and hand fly ,Dual RA and FCU failures can be tricky and I've seen many low timers get through the course, some even do quite well.

Yes piston and multi turbine experience is very important as it sets you up for jet training, but I've seen newbies do well during their line training.

Not saying I agree with 250 hour wonders at the controls of a transport category aircraft but it's happening more and more due to pay to fly , MPL , Asian demand for pilots.

[Chuck Ellsworth]

The fact is that Canada has high aviation standards,

Compared to where?

[Boreas]

I work at Cebu Pacific. Company has expanded and is expanding. Enjoying every moment of it. I know people all over South East Asia. So when I layover in HK, SIN, BKK I never end up alone ''checkremarks''. It beats flying in -50 degrees in the winter.

I happen to work in SE Asia as well, so I know all about shooting fish in a
barrel. I also know that the only guys who brag about this sort of thing are the
ones that couldn't get laid back home if their life depended on it.

But anyway, you never answered my question. How much did you pay for your
type rating?

[esp803]

It beats flying in -50 degrees in the winter.

A respected low-timer as I call it is a qualified pilot who actually is hired to fly the damn thing. And does not have to endorse salve work, clean and wash the bosse's car, lick the toilet bowl to MAYBE have a chance to fly on company aircraft. I find this degrading! 75% of the worlds' pilots don't follow what we do in Canada.

It's funny, I was born, grew up and now work north of 60 and love the winters and I have rarely seen a genuine -50, only southerners count windchill in temperatures. I've also never had to do slave work, clean or wash the bosses car or even lick a toilet bowl. I have always been hired to fly an airplane, even when I had 200hrs. I never ran into insurance issues, even on floats, started commercially with 7hrs. When I get asked to help out in the office, I have no problem with it as long as I'm compensated fairly. It's pretty simple, if I'm working I'm making money. You go have fun with your Airbus, personally I love figuring out how to load a drill into the 'Van', picking up moose meat, getting to know the paddlers I fly into the Peel, Short lakes at high altitude, Short one way strips, and sharing fine Scotch with my boss after a long (or short) days work. But then again, I don't get my hands dirty...

A little off topic, but the initial airbus training is flying the machine with no auto pilot, no auto thrust , no flight directors , even during the type there are plenty of times when you are put in direct law and hand fly ,Dual RA and FCU failures can be tricky and I've seen many low timers get through the course, some even do quite well.

That's good to hear, it still seems like a tiny amount of time developing good hands and feet to me.

E

[Captain X]

Doesn't Cebu and all other philippine airlines have a EU ban?

[checkremarks]

Doesn't Cebu and all other philippine airlines have a EU ban?

Actually yes they are. All Philippino airlines are banned except for Philippine airlines.

Why are they banned in the EU?

Take a wild guess....


Still thinking?

Safety deficiencies and recent accidents and or incidents.

[pelmet]

It's funny, I was born, grew up and now work north of 60 and love the winters and I have rarely seen a genuine -50, only southerners count windchill in temperatures.

Coldest I ever saw was a temperature of -48°C. Was minus 50 when we departed for this place but it warmed up two degrees, much to my disappointment.

But then I realized that -48°C equals -54.4°F so I can say that I have seen almost -55 degrees. . Glad there was no real wind.

[pelmet]

I know people all over South East Asia. So when I layover in HK, SIN, BKK I never end up alone ''checkremarks''. It beats flying in -50 degrees in the winter.

BKK....I did a layover there once, but I just enjoyed the nearby park and our fantastic hotel with the vertigo restaurant.

http://www.google.ca/search?q=vertigo+r ... 37&bih=483

While you are enjoying your company in BKK, you might want to google "ladyboy" on your ipad mini. Rankin at -50 might have better options for you.

[MagicMilkshake]

back to the wage war, i have to believe that maybe one day, this will change. Everything has its cycles. i feel that all this low pay nonsense will have to have a negative effect on the amount of new pilots in the next 10 years or so, right?

[Boreas]

back to the wage war, i have to believe that maybe one day, this will change. Everything has its cycles. i feel that all this low pay nonsense will have to have a negative effect on the amount of new pilots in the next 10 years or so, right?

It will be less than that dude. The pilot shortage is just around the corner.

[wan2fly99]

oh Shit I thought it 28/hr they were offering

[checkremarks]

back to the wage war, i have to believe that maybe one day, this will change. Everything has its cycles. i feel that all this low pay nonsense will have to have a negative effect on the amount of new pilots in the next 10 years or so, right?

It will be less than that dude. The pilot shortage is just around the corner.

There's no pilot shortage. They have been talking about a pilot shortage since a decade ago and not once did I ever think being in this industry there is a shortage coming.

You are however partially correct. There is/will be a shortage of QUALIFIED pilots.

Of course insurance companies want the qualified pilots and I think most people who visit this website looking for a job are astounded at the ridiculous requirements to find a pilot job. For example, 1000 TT and 500 multi pic to fly a Navajo right seat.

If you put an add up for Navajo FO's with min requiremts of 250 hours there won't be a shortage of resumes I bet ya on that. There will be a shortage on pilots with 1000 hours and the multi pic the insurance company wants.

[cdnpilot77]

back to the wage war, i have to believe that maybe one day, this will change. Everything has its cycles. i feel that all this low pay nonsense will have to have a negative effect on the amount of new pilots in the next 10 years or so, right?

It will be less than that dude. The pilot shortage is just around the corner.

There's no pilot shortage. They have been talking about a pilot shortage since a decade ago and not once did I ever think being in this industry there is a shortage coming.

You are however partially correct. There is/will be a shortage of QUALIFIED pilots.

Of course insurance companies want the qualified pilots and I think most people who visit this website looking for a job are astounded at the ridiculous requirements to find a pilot job. For example, 1000 TT and 500 multi pic to fly a Navajo right seat.

If you put an add up for Navajo FO's with min requiremts of 250 hours there won't be a shortage of resumes I bet ya on that. There will be a shortage on pilots with 1000 hours and the multi pic the insurance company wants.

Judging by the googlie eyes, I would say Boreas was joking in a sarcastic manner

[checkremarks]

^ sorry about that, I wrote that post on my iPad and for some reason I can't see emoticons on my iPad or iPhone.

[daedalusx]

I work up North and make approx 48K/yr, 1st year FO on a twin. Couldn't be happier. Decent schedule and good equipment. Doing the same thing in YHU, YUL or YQB would be approx 20-24K/yr.

First job was 350$/week, seasonal summer C182 in the middle of butt @#$! nowhere. Didn't make that mistake twice. Then the owner had to audacity to ask for 3500$ for a 'Ho checkout/upgrade. My only regret was that I didn't go straight up North after my M-CPL.

There are good jobs around... Of course you need to be a man have have the balls to stand up for yourself, a quality that I find lacking in most low-timers that I see around.

[Ki-ll]

Which company requires a Navajo FO to have 500 MPIC?

[MagicMilkshake]

Which company requires a Navajo FO to have 500 MPIC?

all of them hahaha

[Sky_Conqueror]

Its a combination of both company policies and insurance companies. The operator wants to save capital so opting to have a 1000 Hour FO insurance policy will be considerably less than the 250 Hour FO option package. And the numbers are wide apart. The system works pretty much the same way as car insurance for the ''less than 25 year old'' drivers. As you may see, the vicious circle....And I am afraid that going against these two contributing factors, the battle is declared lost even before the first arrow has been fired.

Of course, there are companies out there that will eventually hire the 250 hour guys, but these operators are extremely sparse. Hence every low-timer flocks to those carriers. I find it also ridiculous that it is easier to find a job as an instructor being ''non-experienced'' than becoming an FO, where one is constantly monitored and supervised. As anyone thought about how contradictive this sounds? To me it should be the other way around.

The only way I see the system change is if the government steps in; underlying the use of low-timers to generate a more fluid economy in aviation; and down the road, to avoid that infamous ''QUALIFIED PILOT SHORTAGE''. And I believe that the problem discussed in the previous paragraphs affects also the issue in regards to the use of foreign pilots in Canada. The

[esp803]

there are companies out there that will eventually hire the 250 hour guys, but these operators are extremely sparse

... Off the top of my head:

Alkan, Nomad, Air North, Alpine Aviation, CMA, Northern Thunderbird, Orca, Carson, Jazz, Simpson Air, Wolverine, Summit, Buffalo, Tindi, Can-West, Nor-Alta, Northwestern Air lease, Adlair, North-Wright, Perimeter, Sky North, West wind, Transwest, Air Sprint, SLSS, Al Air, Superior, Wasaya, Alta-Links, NAC, and that's just off the top of my head... there are many many many more.

The operator wants to save capital so opting to have a 1000 Hour FO insurance policy will be considerably less than the 250 Hour FO option package.

I have never heard of a 1000 Hour F/O insurance policy. I started flying with 200hrs no insurance problems, started flying floats with 7hrs, no insurance problems. It's a myth. What may be true is the operators are looking for someone who is upgrade-able in the not too distant future. If I owned a company, you can bet I wouldn't be putting up ads looking for 200hr wonders when I could get more experienced crews.

About the only that you have contributed to this that I actually concur with and wasn't pulled out of thin air is :

I find it also ridiculous that it is easier to find a job as an instructor being ''non-experienced'' than becoming an FO

Have fun with Cebu, LOTS of us have made a very good living in Canada as pilots and we all started with 200hrs. Some people can't hack the north, I get it, but if you are strong enough, it's the best flying you will ever do.

E

[JohnnyHotRocks]

I might have missed it, skimming through the responses, but did we find out what he paid for the airbus type rating?
Just wondering...

[Sky_Conqueror]

Didn't pay anything. Just time commitment.

[Boreas]

Doesn't add up.

Perhaps if I rephrased my question...
How much did your parents pay for your type rating?

[JohnnyHotRocks]

Didn't pay anything. Just time commitment.

Does that mean that you signed a contract guaranteeing that you will stay at the job for a specific length of time? What happens if you quit? Do you owe them money?

John

[checkremarks]

What happens if something like this happens again? Do you owe them money after you ride off an Airbus?