US Airways Express boots blind pax and dog

[Jack In The Box]

CBS/AP/ November 14, 2013, 12:01 PM
Blind N.Y. man allegedly kicked off plane over guide dog; passengers exit in solidarity

NEW YORK Passengers aboard a U.S. Airways Express flight staged an apparent revolt Wednesday night in support of a fellow traveler who is legally blind, CBS New York reports.

The flight was about to take off from Philadelphia heading to Long Island's MacArthur Airport when Albert Rizzi said he was confronted by a flight attendant because his guide dog wouldn't stay under his seat.

"We were on the ground for over an hour and 45 minutes waiting to take off and the dog became a little disgruntled, agitated because of the vibrations of the plane and inched out from under the seat and was under my legs," Rizzi told 1010 WINS. "The woman came back again and said 'the dog has to be under the seat, we're not going to take off until you get that dog under the seat.'"

Rizzi said the flight attendant later returned and kicked him and his dog off the flight. That's when Rizzi said other passengers on board rallied behind him.

"Security comes on and they go to take this gentleman off the plane with his dog," fellow passenger Frank Ohlhorst said. "So when we, the passengers, realize what was going on, we were like 'why is this happening? He's not a problem.'"

Rizzi said he was "humbled" by the actions of his fellow passengers.

"All the passengers got off the plane and I was so emotionally moved by that," Rizzi said. "I was just humbled to believe that people, 35 people, got off the plane angry and upset and yelling at management saying 'she needs to be fired today.'"

All of the passengers ended up taking a bus back to Long Island.

U.S. Airways says it is investigating the incident.



Kinda torn on this one. On one hand it sounds like the FA was a total jerk. However, from other sources I've heard the FA had legitimate beef (AKA the dog was in the aisle and the owner wasn't listening). Not sure what to make of it. Que the never ending public hatred for airlines! I wonder how many will be smart enough to realize they weren't even flying with US Airways?

[bmc]

I guess he didn't see that coming.

[PositiveRate27]

Sorry, I can't side with the PAX on this one. The passenger and their dog were in contravention of an FAA reg. Weather or not you, or 50 other PAX on the plane think it's an unreasonable reg is irrelevant. It's the flight crew's job to uphold safety regulations, and had there been an issue which arose from the dog being in the aisle, the flight crew would bear the responsibility.

I'm not gonna put my career on the line for a dog that won't stay in the required location. Granted you must still treat the passengers with respect, but flying is a privilege not a right. Play by the airline's rules, or find a different mode of transportation.

PR

[Doc]

Kudos for the PAX! FA was a jerk, and should have her narcissistic ass booted! Keep a dog UNDER a seat for an hour and forty-five minutes.....on what planet.
Posrate27... You should try getting through society blind......just for a weekend...and get back to us about your "blind" adherence to every stupid FAA REG!

[PositiveRate27]

Doc, if I were the FA I would absolutely give some leeway on the basis of the delay and the fact that the person in question is handicapped, but I'm not the FA. What happens when the aircraft finally powers up and goes airborne. Will the dog stay in the aisle next to its owner, or will it try and run uncontrolled through the cabin? Whether or not the reg in question is ridiculous, you can't fault an employee of the airline for doing what her company has instructed her to do. You don't know her back story. Perhaps she was recently reprimanded for not crossing T's and dotting I's in the cabin and decided she was going to follow protocol to avoid getting in to trouble again. Perhaps there was an employee on the flight who is in the FA training department who was deadheading and she didn't want to break regs in front of them. We don't know the complete story.

I have empathy for both the dog and the passenger. It is extremely difficult traveling with disabilities, but the airline's priority is first to passenger safety, and second to accommodating everyone's individual needs. We have the same regulation at the airline I fly for. Once in cruise the dog is more than welcome to lay out in the aisle for more comfort, but for critical phases such as taxi, takeoff and landing, it's gotta be under the seat. Lets not forget as well that the dog in question is not the family pooch, its a work dog that has been trained to do what its commanded to do. Obviously it had reached a point where it was no longer responding to commands, and that alone means it's liability in the cabin has increased. An hour and forty five minutes is indeed a very long time for a dog to be in a cramped, noisy and unfamiliar environment. Once airborne, these agitators would only increase. It seems completely reasonable to book the PAX and their dog on the next flight and give the poor dog a chance to decompress, relax a little bit, and try it again.

[Doc]

She way overstepped her authority, created a public relations nightmare, and probably cost her airline customers. Sometimes, common sense has to kick in. Anybody with ANY knowledge of service dogs, would have let this one slide. She didn't. She demonstrated a total lack of empathy, common sense and intelligence here, and if I were her boss, she'd be very much unemployed.
I'm very much afraid, the whenever there is a rule, common sense, and the ability to think on one's feet goes right out the window. Cheers. WOOF!

[PositiveRate27]

You make very valid points Doc, but again, neither of us were there, and the only perspective we have is the perspective of a media outlet trying to create a juicy story. The media loves to run scandalous stories about the airlines, and the flying public loves to read them. Makes them lots and lots of money. To come on here and label her as a narcissistic jerk and imply her employment should be terminated because she didn't let the potential for starting a media story influence her decision to enforce a safety regulation? That speaks volumes. There is always two sides to every story, with human beings on both sides of the coin. I hope which ever of the 8 airlines that serve US Airways Express employs her doesn't pull the trigger with such little evidence as you.

PR

[Rookie50]

http://www.zdnet.com/us-airways-respond ... 000023275/

Us airways responds. Appears to blame all the Pax. Note, the other Pax didn't walk off the flight. Some of the other Pax complained about kicking the guy off, so the captain decided to cancel the whole flight.

Great PR move, whoever's side you believe.

[burhead1]

I guess he didn't see that coming.

LOL

[KK7]

Personally, I'm all for strapping down and securing everything in the cabin - this is probably not done enough. Would you want a 70 LB or more body flying around the cabin if there was a high speed reject or worse? Does this blind man really need his dog while sitting in the cabin? Could the dog not have been checked airside in a crate as the passenger was boarding, and retrieve his dog as he disembarks at destination?

[xsbank]

Do we, as a society, make accommodations for handicapped people or not? If the airline had planned ahead and put this passenger in a proper seat, perhaps at the front of the plane, this would not have happened?

If you travel with a pet you need a crate. If you travel with Air Canada, you need to go to the air cargo depot and drop your dog off well before the flight. How likely is it that a blind person can do all of that without even more inconvenience than regular clients endure?

Air Canada is very good with the handicapped - I regularly travel with a blind person and they always (well, maybe not so much in Montreal) treat us with understanding, patience and respect.

The FA behaved badly. All it takes is some patience, understanding and maybe a people-skill or two. She is in the wrong job.

Kudos to the passengers, they seemed to be aware. Most of you have no idea of the challenges faced daily by the handicapped and I would urge those of you reading this to try and imagine how your life contracts with vision loss.

So there.

"A woman goes into Cabela's to buy a rod and reel for her grandson's birthday. She doesn't know which one to get, so she just grabs one and goes over to the counter. The clerk was standing behind the counter wearing dark
glasses. She says to him, "Excuse me, sir. Can you tell me anything about this Rod and reel?" He says, "Ma'am, I'm completely blind; but if you'll drop it on the counter, I can tell you everything from the sound it makes."

She doesn't believe him but drops it on the counter anyway...... He says, "That's a six-foot Shakespeare graphite rod with a Zebco 404 reel and 10-LB. test line. It's a good all-around combination, and it's on sale this week for only $20.00."

She says, "It's amazing that you can tell all that just by the sound of it dropping on the counter. I'll take it!"

As she opens her purse, her credit card drops on the floor. "Oh, that sounds like a Master Card," he says.

She bends down to pick it up and accidentally farts. At first she is really embarrassed, but then realizes......there is no way the blind clerk
could tell it was her who tooted. Being blind, he wouldn't know that she was the only person around?

The man rings up the sale and says, "That'll be $34.50 please." The woman is totally confused by this and asks, "Didn't you tell me the rod and reel were on sale for $20.00? How did you get $34.50?"

He replies, "Yes, ma'am. The rod and reel is $20.00, but the Duck Call is $11.00, and the Catfish Bait is $3.50."

She paid it and left without saying a word."

[bizjets101]

CBS News video

Mirror UK story

FlightAware shows the aircraft, a Piedmont Dash 8 still made the flight.

[shimmydampner]

This story doesn't add up for me. If the picture in the news story is correct, the dog is a Yellow Lab (like many service dogs) which are well known to be highly intelligent, obedient and docile. Service dogs represent the carefully selected top few percent in those characteristics. I find it very unlikely that such a highly trained animal would be "out of control" which leads me to wonder if it was indeed an actual service dog, or just the guy's pet. Yet, even if it is a service dog, who in their right mind expects that a 60-100 pound dog is going to fit under an airline seat!? Seems to me the airline dropped the ball on suitably accomodating this guy AND his dog.

[CD]

The following is a portion of the regulatory requirements of 14 CFR 382 - Nondiscrimination on the Basis of Disability in Air Travel, which are applicable to U.S. air carriers and foreign air carriers operating into the U.S.:

§382.117 Must carriers permit passengers with a disability to travel with service animals?

(a) As a carrier, you must permit a service animal to accompany a passenger with a disability.

(1) You must not deny transportation to a service animal on the basis that its carriage may offend or annoy carrier personnel or persons traveling on the aircraft.

(2) On a flight segment scheduled to take 8 hours or more, you may, as a condition of permitting a service animal to travel in the cabin, require the passenger using the service animal to provide documentation that the animal will not need to relieve itself on the flight or that the animal can relieve itself in a way that does not create a health or sanitation issue on the flight.

(b) You must permit the service animal to accompany the passenger with a disability at any seat in which the passenger sits, unless the animal obstructs an aisle or other area that must remain unobstructed to facilitate an emergency evacuation.

(c) If a service animal cannot be accommodated at the seat location of the passenger with a disability who is using the animal, you must offer the passenger the opportunity to move with the animal to another seat location, if present on the aircraft, where the animal can be accommodated.

(d) As evidence that an animal is a service animal, you must accept identification cards, other written documentation, presence of harnesses, tags, or the credible verbal assurances of a qualified individual with a disability using the animal.

(e) If a passenger seeks to travel with an animal that is used as an emotional support or psychiatric service animal, you are not required to accept the animal for transportation in the cabin unless the passenger provides you current documentation (i.e., no older than one year from the date of the passenger's scheduled initial flight) on the letterhead of a licensed mental health professional (e.g., psychiatrist, psychologist, licensed clinical social worker, including a medical doctor specifically treating the passenger's mental or emotional disability) stating the following:

(1) The passenger has a mental or emotional disability recognized in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders—Fourth Edition (DSM IV);

(2) The passenger needs the emotional support or psychiatric service animal as an accommodation for air travel and/or for activity at the passenger's destination;

(3) The individual providing the assessment is a licensed mental health professional, and the passenger is under his or her professional care; and

(4) The date and type of the mental health professional's license and the state or other jurisdiction in which it was issued.

(f) You are never required to accommodate certain unusual service animals (e.g., snakes, other reptiles, ferrets, rodents, and spiders) as service animals in the cabin. With respect to all other animals, including unusual or exotic animals that are presented as service animals (e.g., miniature horses, pigs, monkeys), as a carrier you must determine whether any factors preclude their traveling in the cabin as service animals (e.g., whether the animal is too large or heavy to be accommodated in the cabin, whether the animal would pose a direct threat to the health or safety of others, whether it would cause a significant disruption of cabin service, whether it would be prohibited from entering a foreign country that is the flight's destination). If no such factors preclude the animal from traveling in the cabin, you must permit it to do so. However, as a foreign carrier, you are not required to carry service animals other than dogs.

(g) Whenever you decide not to accept an animal as a service animal, you must explain the reason for your decision to the passenger and document it in writing. A copy of the explanation must be provided to the passenger either at the airport, or within 10 calendar days of the incident.

(h) You must promptly take all steps necessary to comply with foreign regulations (e.g., animal health regulations) needed to permit the legal transportation of a passenger's service animal from the U.S. into a foreign airport.

(i) Guidance concerning the carriage of service animals generally is found in the preamble of this rule. Guidance on the steps necessary to legally transport service animals on flights from the U.S. into the United Kingdom is found in 72 FR 8268-8277, (February 26, 2007).

[Docket OST-2004-19482, 73 FR 27665, May 13, 2008, as amended at 74 FR 11471, Mar. 18, 2009]

In Canada, the CTA provides the following guidance to air carriers in complying with the Air Transportation Regulations:

Implementation Guide Regarding Space for Service Dogs Onboard Large Aircraft

[PositiveRate27]

Sounds like the service dog was in contrevention of 382.117 (b). It's stated right there in writing.

You think this woman should jeopordize her passengers safety, her airlines perogative to uphold safety regulations, and her job, just to avoid inconveniencing a person with a disability? I think there has to be a bit of give and take on both sides. Yes, the airline should do everything in it's power to be flexable and accomodate persons with a disability. At the same time the person with said dissability has to understand that the requirements to accommodate their needs are often more than just inconvenient, but are safety issues. Such requirements may require some sacrifices from both parties. It sounds to me that both parties were being stubborn, resulting in the flight being canceled.

[GyvAir]

Do I interpret 382.117 (f) correctly, that if one’s miniature service horse is not too big, does not pose a direct heath or safety threat, will not interfere with peanut distribution and is not a frowned upon species at your destination, you must allow that horse in the passenger cabin for the flight?

[Wacko]

Que the never ending public hatred for airlines! I wonder how many will be smart enough to realize they weren't even flying with US Airways?

What do you mean it wasn't a US Airways flight? Of course it was. When I buy a ticket on Air Canada and end up on a Jazz or Georgian flight, you bet your ass I will blame AC for any conduct, delays, lost luggage or the likes.

The big companies want to save money by outsourcing, this is their prerogative but they are also the ones that should be held accountable.

[jeta1]

CD, always so factual - good on ya - but I want to know your opinion on the incident, not just quoted CARs.

[Jack In The Box]

Que the never ending public hatred for airlines! I wonder how many will be smart enough to realize they weren't even flying with US Airways?

What do you mean it wasn't a US Airways flight? Of course it was. When I buy a ticket on Air Canada and end up on a Jazz or Georgian flight, you bet your ass I will blame AC for any conduct, delays, lost luggage or the likes.

The big companies want to save money by outsourcing, this is their prerogative but they are also the ones that should be held accountable.

100% agree with you. I was just stating matter of fact. I get in arguments with people all the time. "Of course the pilots make a lot of money, they're united pilots!"
"No they work for a small regional company called Skywest"
"Ya right, look at the plane it says united"

Personally, I'm all for strapping down and securing everything in the cabin - this is probably not done enough. Would you want a 70 LB or more body flying around the cabin if there was a high speed reject or worse? Does this blind man really need his dog while sitting in the cabin? Could the dog not have been checked airside in a crate as the passenger was boarding, and retrieve his dog as he disembarks at destination?

Strap down everything humanly possible as tight as you can....100% guarantee you it will make no difference in the event of an accident.

Not advocating that its not important, just sayin...

[Wacko]

Does this blind man really need his dog while sitting in the cabin? Could the dog not have been checked airside in a crate as the passenger was boarding, and retrieve his dog as he disembarks at destination?

I'm not blind, and knock on wood I never will be... but if I was, I would want my eyes to be with me... not in a kennel somewhere under the deck. That dog isn't there for companionship, he's there to work. (That's why you should never pet one of those dogs) If there was an emergency, the same people who were outraged that the guy got kicked off would have been the first ones out the door.

There seem to be a lot of factors involved here... why was the plane boarded and sitting on the ground for almost 2 hours?

At the end of the day, this should have been dealt with better, period.

[RatherBeFlying]

The booking end needs to get the dog and human into an appropriate seat row (as the FAA instructions mandate). That would include a heads up to the cabin crew. Getting stuck on the ramp for two hours calls for some proactive management -- even better prevention.

It sounds like a lot of fuses got shortened going nowhere.

Yes, you can't have a dog in the aisle during takeoff and approach. Sitting on the ramp going nowhere, you may as well let the dog on the aisle until taxi clearance is issued.

[Castorero]

This is just another example of what it takes to keep an airline flying or not.

Blind adherence to rules and regulations is cold comfort when the pooch gets screwed. It just points to a lack of operational and social intelligence on the parts of the sticky operatives.

The FA ignored the potential disruption to her flight for almost two hours and perhaps was deaf to the dog's latter pleas for some relief...

I wonder how this FA would manage in other more pressing situations requiring a modicum of reason and intelligence.
Not the sort of employee I would like to see in the line of fire in ANY industry.

Unfortunately we never hear about similar cases or worse that are resolved with empathy, intelligence and humanity by FA's and others that work hard every day to keep their company and their jobs in the air.

But , who knows really, maybe she was having a bad day for other compelling reasons.

[slowstream]

This is just another example of what it takes to keep an airline flying or not.

Blind adherence to rules and regulations is cold comfort when the pooch gets screwed. It just points to a lack of operational and social intelligence on the parts of the sticky operatives.

The FA ignored the potential disruption to her flight for almost two hours and perhaps was deaf to the dog's latter pleas for some relief...

I wonder how this FA would manage in other more pressing situations requiring a modicum of reason and intelligence.
Not the sort of employee I would like to see in the line of fire in ANY industry.

Unfortunately we never hear about similar cases or worse that are resolved with empathy, intelligence and humanity by FA's and others that work hard every day to keep their company and their jobs in the air.

But , who knows really, maybe she was having a bad day for other compelling reasons.

Castorero,

An excellent and well thought out reply, I agree with your perspective and thank you for sharing it