Looking for a job at WEST WIND?

[prolific_pilot]

Ramp: There's a long wait for entry-level positions (1-3years). It's best if you come with time (at least 800hrs) to get started which will put you ahead of those that have started working before you (with less time). It's kind of unfair, but the company looks at time and experience primarily when postings come up for pilot positions.

King Air: These birds aren't flying too much these days. There is a rotation up in YSF which sees more steady flying; as opposed to YXE. Might not be great for time building for copilots, but still a great experience. Rotation is 2weeks in, 2 weeks (up north only). If you're based in Saskatoon, you'll receive the daily schedule the day before at appox 6pm (but usually after 6; sometimes 8pm).

1900: They just posted for this position for captains. I'll go more in detail to shed better light. As a warning, this position is not family-oriented and thus, West Wind is not an employer of choice for this position. It's true you get 10 days off a month, but everything else around that, they give you less than 12hours notice (sometimes 10) as to what you may be doing the next day (and this even changes regularly at the company's whim). If you have kids this might present a challenge. A lot of guys with families were having trouble juggling day care and family commitments, etc. The pay is average, the benefits somewhat ok, and the perks average as well. Just don't believe everything that is in the "brochure" because they're not entirely true. This is generally the work-horse of West Wind in the sense that you work weekends, nights, the schedule changes so drastically, and you are expected to work to the maximum; as per CARS and CBA. There's been a lot of talk about an exodus of pilots to lateral positions because of the working expectations; especially "tired" and exhausted pilots.

ATR: A relatively good gig. Schedule is more stable and there is a lot of support: ground staff, flight attendant, and dispatchers that are happy to help out. The pay is good and you work within reason I'd say. This could be changing though.

The company boasts being the best and being the best managed companies. Don't believe that either--West Wind is experiencing a lot of challenges--especially with unhappy employees. West Wind views safety differently in the past than it does now and it seems like making money is more important than safety these days. As for the managers, many don't come with people skills and this has been a challenge for "continuous improvement" and positive change. It's kind of an iron-fisted atmosphere depending on who you talk to and isn't the warm, friendly, and positive environment it used to be.

West Wind is an ok place work, but if you're considering any of these positions, it might be good to know what you're getting into to first.

Good Luck!

[Quinny]

West Wind was great when we were there. Always knew what was going on schedule wise, great people, great atmosphere, support from above, time off, good equipment, epic golf tournaments and slow pitch league.
Being your first post I have to wonder if you are disgruntled. We made the most of it and had a great time. Hopefully things have not gone downhill there.

[BeaconInbound]

Quinny....prolific tells the truth. Things have gone downhill. Still great people there, but new managers are tearing it up. It's very disappointing to those who wanted to go the distance with the company. They are just a training company now with all the lack of loyalty that goes with being so

[Justanotherflyboy]

Prolific is indeed correct. It is unfortunate but if I knew that it would turn in to the company that it has, I would never have come. They seem to be hiding behind the illusion that because they are a "50 best managed" company, that is a good place to work. I would never recommend that a friend come work here. If you want to build as an FO on a 1900 or grab some 705 time, it is a reasonable place to work but don't come planning to stay for a long time and don't plan on being treated "well."

Cheers

[pilotdriver]

Management has come out and told the pilot group "You are going to be worked to the maximum extent allowed by CARS, and that West Wind is no longer a destination company it is a time building company where you come, get your time and leave for a better operation." The pilots are always the first to be blamed for any mistakes or delays. Never dispatch, the ground staff, fuelers, or management.

[HO Driver]

If it sucks sooooo much at WWA why don't you leave? Just.........leave. We all have choices.

[Colonel Sanders]

Maybe he's got a bond, and if he can arrange to
be fired, he doesn't have to pay it off.

What better way to get canned, than to post the
(ugly) truth about your company on the internet?

[Rowdy]

The quick demise of the industry, spurred on by whats been happening south of the 49th. It seems even the 'best managed' companies don't seem to care. Re-read that.. BEST MANAGED. That doesn't at all mean they are the best place to be employed.

Next thing you know, we'll see employers screaming for applications from qualified applicants, when none apply, they will then be pursuing the avenues of foreign workers to fill those positions as no one in their right mind would put their life and job on the line for the pay and conditions, other than someone from say a third world country.

Sorry for the slight hijack. Sad to see west wind has moved in this direction now too. Who is next to fall victim to this mentality?

[acidgambit]

Westwind compared to a lot of companies out there is one of the better ones. I do agree that as the company is getting bigger and with new management, it has kind of lost its way.

All i got to say is....if you're on the ATR ops and complaining....please quit.

[throttlejockey]

Since then pilots have a union, why are they not being protected from such horrible conditions at the hand of their employer? Is this not why unions exist and take up residence in the first place? They exist to protect the employee, yet the employees are still bitching. Sounds like one big multifaceted dysfunctional problem at best, you're paying a union to represent you and keep you unhappy. Is management the problem, or is it the union representation? If the company operates within CARS and your CBA, they are doing no wrong as approved by your representatives in the union. It was agreed by both sides, and now its no good. Ramp up the union dues and fight it, then you can complain about how much you spend on the people that protect you. Hate to say it, but a unionized group that is still unhappy has bigger problems than their employer.

[BE82]

You guys are a bunch of whiners and complainers, have no idea of how good you have it! Boo F*ing Hoo you gotta fly on res? ops asks yo do the full day instead of 1/2? i got news for you that's life! if you really think you are getting screwed i invite you to apply across the ramp and see how long does it take you to beg on your knees to be back at WWA.

have some common sense before bashing a company as good as WWA, ill be interested to know how many of you poor martyrs have actually worked for a real bad operator or in fact an other operator.

[schnitzel2k3]

FYI BE82 - most of the guys worked for TW at some point in their careers if that is what you are referencing. So your point is mute.

This posting has turned particularly nasty despite it starting rather plain with a general advisory to guys expecting a Westwind from previous generations.

One might go as far as to say despite good intentions there is a disconnect between the 703/4/5 section of the company - pilot wise - and since the Union was strongly represented by 705 pilots - it's tough to see eye-to-eye. But alas maybe its time for guys to stop crying and start acting for the better.

[BE82]

[quote="schnitzel2k3"]FYI BE82 - most of the guys worked for TW at some point in their careers if that is what you are referencing. So your point is mute.

are you serious?? at least 50% of the WWA pilots have no outside experience, the rest have little outside exposure and the guys with the most outside experience are either management or very very few line pilots. if you really think i am way out on this one i would be happy to swallow my words but if you work for WWA and ask around, lets say next time you go to work, arrive 10 min early and ask around who has flown for another operator or how many of the guys came with 3000 hrs and you'll see what i am taking abut.

i am not a WWA advocate but c'mon give me a break! i realized that life in WWA can be better and times are changing but if you are not happy in a place like WWA i doubt you'll really find a place that meets your expectations.

i dont wanna get onto a pissing match with anyone but short of rainbow and teddy bears airlines WWA is a good place to make a living.

[pilotdriver]

In response to BE82, there are MAYBE 3-8 pilots who have never worked outside of WWA, don't know where you got that information from...

[Tubthumper]

+1

[BE82]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hM9uFaGGVwk

[dirk82]

FYI BE82 - most of the guys worked for TW at some point in their careers if that is what you are referencing. So your point is mute.

are you serious?? at least 50% of the WWA pilots have no outside experience, the rest have little outside exposure and the guys with the most outside experience are either management or very very few line pilots. if you really think i am way out on this one i would be happy to swallow my words but if you work for WWA and ask around, lets say next time you go to work, arrive 10 min early and ask around who has flown for another operator or how many of the guys came with 3000 hrs and you'll see what i am taking abut.

i am not a WWA advocate but c'mon give me a break! i realized that life in WWA can be better and times are changing but if you are not happy in a place like WWA i doubt you'll really find a place that meets your expectations.

i dont wanna get onto a pissing match with anyone but short of rainbow and teddy bears airlines WWA is a good place to make a living.

+1

I worked at WWA for a bit, I cant say much bad about them. They are changing from a pilot owned company to a management owned company and this obviously is going to bring change. They are pretty much on par with any 703 704 705 operator out there. When I was there the boys upstairs seemed to like pulling instructors to the line, while having experience from instructing they don't know much outside of WWA. Not sure if this is still the way but the buddies I have over there seem as happy as a pilot can be. They have it pretty good over there compared to a lot of places.

[69chickenwing]

Born and raised in Saskatchewan, started on the docks farther north than La Ronge, flew almost everywhere in this country/world BUT Saskatchewan and have well over 3000 hours. I came to westwind for a lifestyle change, to stay home with my new family instead of rotations, but within months of hiring me and dangling the carrot that i wanted in front of my face they quickly pulled it away and slapped me with reality. 10-14 hour days make up the bulk of the week, schedule is chaos at best and there is almost zero predictability in the monthly schedule they publish. Sure this me whining, I want shorter days to be home with my family at dinner time, I want to know if next Tuesday I can make my appointment that has been booked in advance. WAH WAH WAH. But these are things I soon realized aren't available at WWA. I sat down with our DFO and wanted a clear representation of the future of WWA, will I ever be able to achieve these within the company? His answer was a definite NO. If anything he wants us to work more and longer.

I understand this, anyone knows in aviation that when flight crews and aircraft are sitting on the ground they aren't making any money. What seems to be the problem from my perspective is that WWA used to be the carrot I wanted, family life and a stable schedule, but they are in transition to a different way of operating. Lots of flying, longer days and we will take whatever work is out there. WWA is going to be another stepping stone company to the airlines or whatever your desire might be. It will no longer be a cushy job to settle into. This transition is what is pissing everyone who works there off. The company wants more out of the pilots than before and is not willing to give anything in return. Is there a smoother way to make that happen??? I don't know. But its ruffling feathers over here and in 2 years time what we have been so upset about will seem the norm.

All in all, it is an ok company to work for. What I have to say about WWA is the same I would say for any other company out there. The company is trying to make as much money as they can and give you the least amount you deserve, (name a company that doesn't), my advice to people who are thinking about working here is, come with the attitude that your here for a short time get your hours/rating and stay positive. Steer clear of management as much as possible, smile at the functions and be nice, but if you decide to cross any of them be sure you have your resumes out they will find reasons to make your life hell. (i wish the last part wasn't true but it is.) Watch your ass, as with any company, if you make a mistake here the company will hang you out to dry before your props stop turning.

I hope this is informative to people applying for jobs here rather than people bickering on which shitty company to choose in Saskatchewan.

[Saucy_Instructor]

To be blunt... not much more should be expected from a company now run by truckers and bus jockeys.

[Krimson]

if you decide to cross any of them be sure you have your resumes out they will find reasons to make your life hell. Watch your ass, as with any company, if you make a mistake here the company will hang you out to dry before your props stop turning.

Like the two who brought in the union

[Fiddlestix]

Relax BE82, no one is taking away your right to whine about working for the worst operator in the province. Although it begs the question.. Why are you still there if it's so bad?

TW is a bottom feeder, and always has been, like a few other operators out there. But the difference is that they know it, and they don't try to sugar coat it. Everyone knows what the deal is there. But West Wind will throw all kinds of propaganda at you telling you how they're an "employer of choice" and one of the "50 Best Managed" (which someone already pointed out is completely irrelevant to working conditions. There is a separate "50 best employers" list made. McDonald's has it on their drive thru windows. As far as I know, West Wind has never made that list). They try to tell you that their people matter and are one of their best assets, and it's all a lie. That's the big difference here.

The original poster didn't say anything that wasn't true. He summed up the situation pretty well actually. The big focus is money now. Everything has a dollar sign attached to it, and if you do something that costs the company money or makes them look bad in front of the almighty Cameco, expect to be chewed out by the aforementioned DFO. If you get on his shit list, you will probably never recover. If, on the other hand, you fly with him on the ATR and he likes you, you might just get 1900 captain and 300 multi PIC that wasn't there before. I don't think there's anything wrong with telling people what they're getting themselves into if they accept a job at West Wind. No one was saying it's worse than TW, just that what they'll tell you during the recruiting process and the reality at the company are very different. It has definitely not changed for the better.

[BE82]

Relax BE82, no one is taking away your right to whine about working for the worst operator in the province. Although it begs the question.. Why are you still there if it's so bad?

learn how to read i am not whining about the company if anything i am doing the opposite, i guess how to read was taught in grade 3 and thats 2 grades higher than your education cap.

[Krimson]

[prolific_pilot]

BE82:

Could we keep the thread positive? Let's attack the issues and work together-- not attack our own people (which I assume includes you).

[GARRETT]

Hey WWA guys, I know you are frustrated, this new style of management is ruffling a LOT of feathers. WWA isn't alone, name a company that doesn't have at least some issues, bet you can't. Putting the company's dirty laundry on AVCANADA probably isn't the best avenue to vent though.