"New" TC sticker (IFR validity changes)

[TeePeeCreeper]

Hello everyone,

Just received one of those dreaded brown Transport Canada envelopes...
My first thoughts were "Shit did I loose my medical?, What reg did I unknowingly break?, Or is this just the $55 fee that I have never received?"

It ended up being one of those nice stickers to be placed in my license booklet. I've already got one of these in my booklet, what's changed?

The old sticker showed that I had a ATPL with a group 1 valid until March 2016. The new sticker simply states that I have an ATPL and a group 1 without any dates...

I am aware of the change to an no expiry instrument rating but just to be 100% clear...

If my last IFR group 1 renewal was due on or prior to March 2016, when does it now expire?

I don't fly any IFR flights with the company I am employed by, but wish to keep a current group 1 rating... How often do I need to sit in a redbird at my expense to do so?

Lastly, how many months/years can I forgo doing a proficiency check before having to re-write the INRAT?

Thank you in advance to anyone whom might be able to provide a bit more clarification!

All the best,
TPC

[photofly]

If my last IFR group 1 renewal was due on or prior to March 2016, when does it now expire?

It never expires.

I don't fly any IFR flights with the company I am employed by, but wish to keep a current group 1 rating... How often do I need to sit in a redbird at my expense to do so?

You keep the rating forever. If you want to exercise the privileges it confers, however, you need an IPC or PPC within the previous 24 months, and if more than 12 months ago the 6-6-6 rule applies.

Note the period of currency is now 24 months to the day, not the first day of the 25th month. You also lose the three month advance window previously available to extend your rating without losing months. 24 months' currency from the date of your last IPC is what you get.

Lastly, how many months/years can I forgo doing a proficiency check before having to re-write the INRAT?

You will never ever have to sit the INRAT again.

[DanWEC]

Just got the same thing today. I had a cold sweat for a moment while I checked for downgrades in classes... Took a breath and expected that the difference was just the ommision of the group 1 "valid to" date and yup, that was it.

The only effective difference, as PF says, is really just that it won't "expire", and that requirement to sit the inrat after lapsing for 2 years is gone.

Everything else is the same. Ride every 2 years, ride valid as currency for 12 months, after that, 6-6-6. Rinse, lather, drink, repeat.

[aviate_77]

ok... I have my group 1 ifr, yet it expired a little while ago. Ohhh the joys of working on the ground. I'm planning to just do my PPC when the time comes, which will renew my ifr. If i wasn't getting a PPC from my company, would I have to go out to a flight school and renew my rating in the sim still?

[photofly]

You don't ever need to renew your rating again. (Please, people, stop asking about renewing your instrument ratings, ok?)

You need an instrument proficiency check.

[C-GKNT]

You don't ever need to renew your rating again. (Please, people, stop asking about renewing your instrument ratings, ok?)

You need an instrument proficiency check.

Except to apply for an ATPL...and then you need to do it in an airplane. Don't know what they are going to do about that rule but it is still currently in place.

Glenn

[photofly]

I thought the ATPL rule was simply to pass a group 1 instrument rating flight test in an airplane within the preceding 12 months, which of course you can do whether or not you hold an IR already, or do or don't meet any recency requirements. It says nothing about having, actually applying for, or renewing any instrument rating.

[C-GKNT]

I thought the ATPL rule was simply to pass a group 1 instrument rating flight test in an airplane within the preceding 12 months, which of course you can do whether or not you hold an IR already, or do or don't meet any recency requirements. It says nothing about having, actually applying for, or renewing any instrument rating.

Photofly,

You are suggesting that you only need to pass a Group 1 instrument flight test in an airplane but do not actually need the IR to apply for an ATPL(A). That's a very interesting interpretation.

However, passing the INRAT is also a requirement for an ATPL, so at that point you should have completed all the requirements for an instrument rating (even if you didn't apply for it).

(5) Skill

(a) Within the 12 months preceding the date of application for the licence, an applicant shall demonstrate in a multi-engined aeroplane with no central thrust configuration and fitted with instruments and equipment suitable for IFR flight in controlled airspace, familiarity with and the ability:
...
(b) For issue of the Airline Transport Pilot Licence - Aeroplane, the Minister shall only endorse a Group 1 Instrument Rating on the licence.
(amended 2005/06/01; previous version)

So unless you can think of a situation where the Minister would endorse a Group 1 IR without you having one, I'll disagree with you and say to apply for an ATPL (A) you need either a renewal (or initial) of a Group 1 IR done in an airplane within the last 12 months.

Glenn

[photofly]

I'm just saying the new rule about instrument ratings not expiring isn't at odds with the ATPL requirement to pass a group 1 IR flight test in the last 12 months, which doesn't need to be changed.

If you don't have the rating, you get one. If you already have the rating, your recency is renewed for a further 24 months. It doesn't "renew" your IR, because that never expires.

[cdnpilot77]

So, does a PCC now renew your recency? Before, wth an expiration date, it was a graded flight test required. However, it doesn't expire, what's the requirement for an IPC? Still need an ACP to do a ride?

[photofly]

So, does a PCC now renew your recency?

No.

IPC needs to be with a Pilot Examiner or an approved Instrument Check Pilot. Of which I don't believe there are any.

[CAL]

wow thanks guys just got one of these also and was looking the expiry date....
thats great news....
another question...if you do all of your training outside of Canada but still are well within the 6-6-6 does transport need copies of your training records?...ie your PPC check ride report etc?

Thanks

[garfield]

I thought the ATPL rule was simply to pass a group 1 instrument rating flight test in an airplane within the preceding 12 months, which of course you can do whether or not you hold an IR already, or do or don't meet any recency requirements. It says nothing about having, actually applying for, or renewing any instrument rating.

Is the IPC will count for a flight test for getting the ATPL? Or I will have to ask to pass an initial flight test again to get it?

[C-GKNT]

I thought the ATPL rule was simply to pass a group 1 instrument rating flight test in an airplane within the preceding 12 months, which of course you can do whether or not you hold an IR already, or do or don't meet any recency requirements. It says nothing about having, actually applying for, or renewing any instrument rating.

Is the IPC will count for a flight test for getting the ATPL? Or I will have to ask to pass an initial flight test again to get it?

Garfield,

IMHO, an IFR ride can actually be done in less time than a proper IPC but I would rather do this stuff in a sim rather than my airplane.

I just submitted my ATPL application last month. I did a Group 1 Instrument ride in an aeroplane (multi-engined with no central thrust configuration) as required by the regulations which as far as I can tell have not changed (?yet?).

Glenn

[photofly]

Is the IPC will count for a flight test for getting the ATPL? Or I will have to ask to pass an initial flight test again to get it?

The ATPL application requires a full flight test.

[garfield]

Is the IPC considered as a full flight test?

If not, can I require to pass an initial IFR flight test to renew?

[photofly]

Is the IPC considered as a full flight test?

No, the IPC is not a flight test. It's an IPC. It has different content, and if you don't fly well enough your instrument rating isn't removed as it would be by failing a flight test; you merely don't renew your recency at that time.

If not, can I require to pass an initial IFR flight test to renew?

You can take a IR flight test any time you like. If you pass, you have 24 months before you need to pass another flight test or an IPC.

[Pannderz]

Will everyone that had an IR get the new sticker for their document booklet?
I have a lapsed IR but have yet to receive a new sticker.

Perhaps a call to my area TC office is in order.

[TailwheelPilot]

I was just wondering the same thing. My IR lapsed five years ago and I was wondering if an envelope would be awaiting me after my last rotation, but so far nothing has appeared.

[Big Pistons Forever]

For IFR ratings that have lapsed more than 5 years, you have to request a new sticker. There is no charge.

[esp803]

Another word on the new stickers....

If you have held a group 1, and have a current group 3, and then do your ride in a redbird to renew your group 1, you need to send your paperwork in to transport to get a new group 1 sticker. This should help you other float pilots transitioning over to IFR.

E

[TailwheelPilot]

Thanks BPF.

[Pannderz]

For IFR ratings that have lapsed more than 5 years, you have to request a new sticker. There is no charge.

Thank you -

[garfield]

If I hold a group 1 and hadn't done an IPC or flight test within last two years, can I still be employed by a company (i.e. FO on a B737)?

I mean when I will do the PPC I guess it's gonna renew my Group 1 automatically... Or I will have to do an IPC before the PPC?

[bald seagull]

How is it theres so much confusion and uncertainty on this? Is it TC not sending out the message? Pilots too lazy to research it?