Pre Purcase Checkout.

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Kejidog
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Pre Purcase Checkout.

#1 Post by Kejidog » Sun Apr 17, 2016 2:12 pm

Good Day folks

I am new to Avation and this fourm. I am considering purchasing for my first time a used aircraft in British Columbia. I would like a a mechanic check out the plane before i make my way from Nova Scotia to look at it. Does anyone know of a good mechanic near Vancouver or the Sunshine Coast that may do this? I would like to have an annual done on the aircraft if i purchase it as well. It is a single engine and i would like to participate and help out if i can to really go over and learn the airframe. I would then fly it home with another pilot to Nova Scotia. So i am really looking for someone through and honest without a connection to the owner. Any advice and thoughts wouls really help me out.

Thanks
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Broken Slinky
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Re: Pre Purcase Checkout.

#2 Post by Broken Slinky » Mon Apr 18, 2016 1:07 pm

If the previous annual is still valid and the plane is airworthy, do the annual once you get it back home. Especially if you want to assist with the annual. Even basic stuff like getting the ELT battery changed can take days to ship, have serviced and then shipped back. Unless you can take weeks off work, you're better off doing it near your home. If the plane is out of annual or not airworthy, it's a whole different ball game.
I'd suggest having the AME that is going to maintain your plane look through all the log books before you buy the plane tickets. If it looks like it's a decent plane and you'll be buying it, take your home field AME with you. He can do the pre-buyers with your assistance and then help fly it back with you. Shy of things like a calibrated compression tester, the majority of the tools you will need can be bought from any hardware store. Buy them out there and bring them back with you as your new plane tool kit. Depending on your useful load and/or if you want to save weight, either ship them back to the east or leave them out there. You're talking less than $50 worth of tools, $100 max. You'll want to have the maintenance log books shipped back separately anyways so they're not in the plane in the event of some issue.
Still doesn't hurt to have your AME find out who the local shops are. The seller should also be able to point you in the right direction too. It will be necessary if you need to borrow jack stands to replace a tire, etc... I've found that a bottle of their favorite spirit goes a long way if you need to borrow the odd thing. Now you'll need to pony up if you're using their shop for days/weeks though.
That sort of thing can be worked out between you and the seller in the pre-buyers too. If they're keen to sell, they'll help you find the gear you need to do the pre-buyers successfully.
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Re: Pre Purcase Checkout.

#3 Post by Rookie50 » Mon Apr 18, 2016 1:33 pm

Agree.

Logs, logs, logs. Go through with a fine tooth comb. If good logs, all AD's done, ect...and plane has been flying regularly, greatly decreases chances of wasting your time, and of the plane passing a PPI.

I'd even call the shop and bluntly ask about the aircraft. Usually people are straight or you can pick up clues something isn't all right.

I bought my first set of perfect logs......and got a great airplane with them.
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Re: Pre Purcase Checkout.

#4 Post by photofly » Mon Apr 18, 2016 2:48 pm

Lots of good advice so far. But this...
Broken Slinky wrote:You'll want to have the maintenance log books shipped back separately anyways so they're not in the plane in the event of some issue.
I've never heard of anyone going to those lengths. If there's an "issue" that renders the aircraft logs unusable while you're flying the aircraft back, you're going to be, er, unusable too, and you won't care about the logs.
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Re: Pre Purcase Checkout.

#5 Post by robertw » Mon Apr 18, 2016 3:25 pm

photofly wrote:Lots of good advice so far. But this...
Broken Slinky wrote:You'll want to have the maintenance log books shipped back separately anyways so they're not in the plane in the event of some issue.
I've never heard of anyone going to those lengths. If there's an "issue" that renders the aircraft logs unusable while you're flying the aircraft back, you're going to be, er, unusable too, and you won't care about the logs.
Well, at least if you end up having "issues" that render you and the aircraft unusable, investigators will have something to look at to determine what was last done to the aircraft. I've heard of and recommend shipping tech logs separate from your flight back to home base.
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Re: Pre Purcase Checkout.

#6 Post by milotron » Mon Apr 18, 2016 4:52 pm

What he said. I just went through this and had m new-to-me Mooney flown out from Quebec. The logs came by puralotor a week later as the shop refused to put them in the plane with the ferry pilot. From what I hear now, this is the appropriate procedure.

I just did the same thing the OP has done ( except from the opposite coast ). I spoke to the owners shop at length about the aircraft, reviewed all of the logs throughly and had another, experienced shop review the logs, then once reasonable, a PPI after deposit was paid. Stuff was found, but not unexpected , nor deal breakers. Considering the distance involved, it all went quite smooth.
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Re: Pre Purcase Checkout.

#7 Post by Broken Slinky » Mon Apr 18, 2016 9:34 pm

photofly wrote: I've never heard of anyone going to those lengths you're flying the aircraft back
i always keep my journey log in a different location from my maintenance log. One is in the plane or in my flight bag. The other is at my home or with my AME. Say my house burns down or my car gets broken into. Try to duplicate those years of records from memory. Nowadays with scanners you can make a digital copy but is it always going to be 100% up to date? $20 worth of postage is worth it in my opinion to ensure I have one copy "protected".
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Re: Pre Purcase Checkout.

#8 Post by photofly » Tue Apr 19, 2016 4:21 am

Since I sleep in the same house as my wife and children, drive in the same car with my wife and children, and fly in the same airplane as my wife and children - both GA and commercial - my assessment of the risks of losing the technical logs during a flight must be correspondingly lower than yours.

I would probably institute a policy about having my children's parents travel separately and sleep in different widely separated buildings for safety reasons before giving a toss about where some random paperwork travels. It's all about perspective.

If the records die in a crash you'll either be dead too, or be happy to have escaped with your life and the airplane will be written off. Either way, the loss of the tech logs isn't going to bother you in the least. Have you considered how many parcels Purolator lose each year, and the paltry compensation you'll get when your technical records go missing? The TSB can go duck themselves; I'd never take that risk just to please the TSB in circumstances I guarantee I won't care about.
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Re: Pre Purcase Checkout.

#9 Post by Broken Slinky » Tue Apr 19, 2016 4:30 am

photofly wrote: (Have you considered how many parcels Purolator lose each year, and the paltry compensation you'll get when your technical records go missing?)
Thought never entered my mind. Good thing I use Fedex huh?
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Re: Pre Purcase Checkout.

#10 Post by photofly » Tue Apr 19, 2016 4:45 am

You can all thank me later:

https://www.purolator.com/purolator/res ... claim.page?
http://www.fedex.com/ca_english/eclaims/

I hope you bought the extra insurance.
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Re: Pre Purcase Checkout.

#11 Post by Rookie50 » Tue Apr 19, 2016 5:28 am

photofly wrote:Since I sleep in the same house as my wife and children, drive in the same car with my wife and children, and fly in the same airplane as my wife and children - both GA and commercial - my assessment of the risks of losing the technical logs during a flight must be correspondingly lower than yours.

I would probably institute a policy about having my children's parents travel separately and sleep in different widely separated buildings for safety reasons before giving a toss about where some random paperwork travels. It's all about perspective.

If the records die in a crash you'll either be dead too, or be happy to have escaped with your life and the airplane will be written off. Either way, the loss of the tech logs isn't going to bother you in the least. Have you considered how many parcels Purolator lose each year, and the paltry compensation you'll get when your technical records go missing? The TSB can go duck themselves; I'd never take that risk just to please the TSB in circumstances I guarantee I won't care about.
You, me, and the Colonel agree on that perspective.
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Re: Pre Purcase Checkout.

#12 Post by robertw » Tue Apr 19, 2016 7:44 am

photofly wrote: I would probably institute a policy about having my children's parents travel separately and sleep in different widely separated buildings for safety reasons before giving a toss about where some random paperwork travels. It's all about perspective.
Hah! Good one! That's a bit of a stretch though...

You've accepted the risk of flying with your tech logs, but I just don't think that it's good practice. The OP would be better served by shipping logs separately in my (and others) opinion. As far as shippers losing parcels, well, I've been with the company I work for presently for about 14 years and we use UPS, FedEX and Purolator and I can say that I can only recall twice in 14 years that anything has been lost. Stuck in customs many times, but actually lost, only twice. Both times, the packages were found and sent on their way.
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Re: Pre Purcase Checkout.

#13 Post by photofly » Tue Apr 19, 2016 11:52 am

Two parcels lost. How many aircraft destroyed by fire?
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Re: Pre Purcase Checkout.

#14 Post by digits_ » Tue Apr 19, 2016 12:20 pm

Broken Slinky wrote:
photofly wrote: I've never heard of anyone going to those lengths you're flying the aircraft back
i always keep my journey log in a different location from my maintenance log. One is in the plane or in my flight bag. The other is at my home or with my AME. Say my house burns down or my car gets broken into. Try to duplicate those years of records from memory. Nowadays with scanners you can make a digital copy but is it always going to be 100% up to date? $20 worth of postage is worth it in my opinion to ensure I have one copy "protected".
He is talking about a one time transport with the logs in the airplane after he bought the airplane. Not flying around every day with a bunch of binders in the back.
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Re: Pre Purcase Checkout.

#15 Post by robertw » Tue Apr 19, 2016 3:07 pm

digits_ wrote: He is talking about a one time transport with the logs in the airplane after he bought the airplane. Not flying around every day with a bunch of binders in the back.
Yes, I realize that. My opinion is not going to change on this and probably neither is yours. In the end the OP will decide what he/she wants to do.
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Re: Pre Purcase Checkout.

#16 Post by pilotboy99 » Sun Apr 24, 2016 9:57 pm

I would suggest you contact Dale at Coast Dog Aviation based out of Pitt Meadows if you are looking for a pre-purchase inspection or whatever. There's not much he doesn't know about most aircraft.
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Re: Pre Purcase Checkout.

#17 Post by Kejidog » Tue Oct 11, 2016 6:10 pm

pilotboy99 wrote:I would suggest you contact Dale at Coast Dog Aviation based out of Pitt Meadows if you are looking for a pre-purchase inspection or whatever. There's not much he doesn't know about most aircraft.

Sorry to not have followed up I ended up passing on the plane in BC. But I do now own a C172G bought here in Nova Scotia. Interesting read about the tech logs :)
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