Insurance for older, 80+ pilot?

[bodyflyer]

Anyone know much about insurance for the older pilot?
How do they keep flying?

My dad is a PPL, 84 years old this year, and the plane he is insuring is the Zenair Zodiac 601 HDS homebuilt we built and have 550 hours on since 1999. Our insurance company just slipped a clause into the insurance stating "dual operations only" for my dad. This came with no warning, providing the quote 3 days before the insurance expires.

Over the years one hears plenty about pilots retiring (from solo flight) when they lost their medical, but I hadn't realized they might lose their ability to fly on age alone due to insurance. It wasn't that over the years premiums started going up steeply or anything. Things were perfectly fine one year, then this came out of the blue.

Even if my dad and I took the risk ourselves on the hull value, we still need insurance to cover the legally mandated liability requirements.

We have been on the EAA insurance the last 5 years or so. (Broker is NACORA, and they prefer Global as the insurer). The broker was apparently just as surprised and is now checking with other insurers. I'm also checking with Magnes (who are COPA's broker), although they're not hopeful they'll find anything better. Apparently it is harder to get good terms if one is new business for an insurer -- a long time client can fare better.

One time about 8 years back my dad had to do a flight check, but after that we managed to get that hassle removed from the requirements. I might have expected that to come back, although it is a bother if flying a homebuilt as not all instructors want to go up in other than their normal certified school aircraft.

[CpnCrunch]

Try Aon...they use Allianz as the insurer. Your Dad might just need to have an annual PPC done, depending on how many hours he has flown (basically a checkout with a flight instructor).

[Cat Driver]

As one ages ones reflexes and physical abilities degrade.

Recurrent flight checks are normal for all pilots.

My personal opinion is recurrent flight checks for older pilots should be mandatory, say starting at age 60 as a base line.

[Bede]

I would go with COPA silver wings and forgo the inflight hull insurance.

[AirFrame]

This came with no warning, providing the quote 3 days before the insurance expires.

Don't let that rush you. There's no harm in your insurance expiring for a few days while you deal with a renewal.

We have been on the EAA insurance the last 5 years or so. (Broker is NACORA, and they prefer Global as the insurer). The broker was apparently just as surprised and is now checking with other insurers. I'm also checking with Magnes (who are COPA's broker), although they're not hopeful they'll find anything better. Apparently it is harder to get good terms if one is new business for an insurer -- a long time client can fare better.

Check with Marsh as well, and Air-1 / Park Insurance. They may end up with the same underwriters, but there are multiple underwriters so making sure you hit them all somehow is key.

...it is a bother if flying a homebuilt as not all instructors want to go up in other than their normal certified school aircraft.

Not all, but a few would love to. Look for another one.

[bodyflyer]

FWIW,
In the end, COPA came through -- that is, their broker Magnes and their preferred underwriter AIG.
It's the full COPA Gold insurance (thus including in-flight hull), no restrictions at all. It's a couple hundred bucks more than the insurance we had last year (and I reduced the hull value somewhat too), but pretty good all in all.

Nacora (EAA) did check with other underwriters too. Canadian and Allianz declined, while Eagle also required Dual Only but was cheaper than the original Dual Only quote from their preferred underwriter Global.

My dad is unlikely to break George Neal's record but I hope he enjoys a couple more years of flying!

[C-GKNT]

bodyflyer,

I have several friends getting to that point in their flying career and it is good information to have, thanks for sharing.

For what it is worth, I think your broker did your father a disservice. This issue should have been brought up a few years ago so you could align yourselves with an insurer known to be fair with older pilots then rather than now when it is an issue.

Over the years, I have switched away from the brokers who just happily collect my premiums every year towards the ones that take the time to understand my particular situation and advise me accordingly. A GOOD broker knows this stuff and that's why he/she earns your business. It does make me wonder what else he/she is missing.

Glenn

[AirFrame]

(and I reduced the hull value somewhat too)

I cringe when I hear this. I hope you reduced the hull value after taking a good look at your aircraft, evaluating it relative to the market, and valuing it accordingly.