Cargo North (North Star Air) Crashes DC3 in PickleLake

[GyvAir]

From the CADORS:

Occurrence Category(ies):

Collision with obstacle(s) during take-off or landing whilst airborne.

Is the lake surface considered an obstacle?

[FOD_Vacuum]

Lets be happy the lake was frozen...could have been a lot worse for the company and crew trying to get out of a sinking airplane and also having to salvage and aircraft from the bottom of the lake. I've always wondered how the ice would hold up a small turboprop, and I have always been fairly confident that ice will hold it, based on the fact that loaded semis go on the ice every day. Could have been a lot worse. I do hope they find out what happened so it doesn't happen again and keep flying safely.

[Mick G]

There have been a lot of accidents at Pickle Lake over the years, anybody keeping track?

[piperdriver]

There have been a lot of accidents at Pickle Lake over the years, anybody keeping track?

1986-1987 I personally think the damn place was cursed.

March 17, 1986 DHC-3 C-FBEW SN#140 was landing on remote lake 46 miles north of Pickle Lake hits ice ridge on landing and gear folds up and the aircraft comes to rest on the lake. From what I heard it wasn't damaged too badly initially. During the recovery slinging the aircraft out with a helicopter the aircraft was dropped were it was substantially damaged and the wreck was hauled to Kuby's in Kenora and sat there for at least a decade. I believe Recon Air purchased it from Kuby. Recon Air rebuilt and converted it to a Garrett sometime between 2007-2010? I believe this aircraft now sports an american registration.

Septemeber 2nd 1986 DHC-3 C-FBER SN#86 Suffered an engine failure and was force landed in a swamp and most of the aircraft burned in post impact fire. Pilot and swamper made it safely out of the aircraft. More info on this thread: viewtopic.php?t=36165

May 11 1987 DC-3 returning to Pickle Lake from Big Trout on a freight haul, wing folds up in flight and crashes 3 km from Pickle Lake Airport.
https://aviation-safety.net/database/re ... 19870511-1

[Illya Kuryakin]

Still trying to figure why a departure at 5/8 vis??? If you think vis is a non issue, get some dual.
Illya

It's above the legally required 1/2sm required for an IFR departure. Take-off alternate was even discussed briefly earlier on in the thread.

Perfect example of legal not being necessarily wise, or safe. Check the WX at the destination then get back to me. We have no idea what their takeoff alternate was. You don't file them. When the smoke clears I'm sure you'll find they were attempting to return for a landing. Me? I'd be putting the coals to my one engine and heading to YQT!! They have a KEG there.
Illya

[Siddley Hawker]

ETAR CYTL 171700Z AUTO 02006KT 320V060 3/4SM -SN BKN006
BKN011 OVC024 M01/M02 A2983 RMK SLP119=

Had they been deiced?

[Antique Pilot]

There have been a lot of accidents at Pickle Lake over the years, anybody keeping track?

On May 12, 1977 a DC-3 went into the lake at about the same spot after taking off from runway 27. Engine problem and they couldn't get the gear up. Load of fuel oil in a bladder. The accident was witnessed from the seaplane base over at the waterfront. A pilot jumped into a Beaver and either flew or step taxied over to the site. The DC-3 captain was trapped in the submerged cockpit but the first officer was able to get out. The Beaver pilot tried to dive down and get the captain out but was unsuccessful. So now the Beaver pilot with the rescued DC-3 FO takes off and heads back to the waterfront. The Beaver flipped on landing but they got out ok. Just imagine, the DC-3 FO was in 2 serious crashes in the space of about 20 minutes.

AP

[bald seagull]

There have been a lot of accidents at Pickle Lake over the years, anybody keeping track?

On May 12, 1977 a DC-3 went into the lake at about the same spot after taking off from runway 27. Engine problem and they couldn't get the gear up. Load of fuel oil in a bladder. The accident was witnessed from the seaplane base over at the waterfront. A pilot jumped into a Beaver and either flew or step taxied over to the site. The DC-3 captain was trapped in the submerged cockpit but the first officer was able to get out. The Beaver pilot tried to dive down and get the captain out but was unsuccessful. So now the Beaver pilot with the rescued DC-3 FO takes off and heads back to the waterfront. The Beaver flipped on landing but they got out ok. Just imagine, the DC-3 FO was in 2 serious crashes in the space of about 20 minutes.

AP

via Imgflip Meme Generator

[Mick G]

I believe one of Air Manitoba's C46 was crash landed in the late 1980's at Pickle Lake, not sure what became of it

[Antique Pilot]

I believe one of Air Manitoba's C46 was crash landed in the late 1980's at Pickle Lake, not sure what became of it

Aircraft did not crash land. Control was lost during take off in a strong crosswind and the aircraft went off the side of the runway. It was salvaged and made ferriable. It went to Buffalo Airways after that.

AP

[Surfer Dude]

Having to carry the extra fuel decreases the freight load and when you charge by the pound or kilogram, that extra fuel your carrying is your profit.

I hope the TSB flipped the master on and checked what's in the tanks vs. what's written down on paper. I imagine there might be quite a bit more on board than minimum fuel considering the weather that day.

[Cat Driver]

I hope the TSB flipped the master on and checked what's in the tanks vs.

Even more logical would be that they drain the tanks and then get an accurate measure of how much fuel there was in it.

There was a time when that was the way they did the investigation.

Another advantage to draining the tanks is what they may find.

We lost a waterbomber just after take off.

When they drained the tanks they found the tanks had hundreds of pounds of water in them.

[shimmydampner]

I imagine there might be quite a bit more on board than minimum fuel considering the weather that day.

Jeez, I hope so. That's just good common sense.
Although, I don't understand the sentiment from a couple posters here that seem to be gleefully hoping these guys get nailed to the wall for something they may or may not have done. We have very little info on this incident other than the crew got served a turd sandwich at a very inopportune time and did an impressive job of dealing with it. Why not leave it at that for now? You could save your self righteous indignation until an investigation reveals the facts.

[TG]

I see that nobody still as a clue of what happened.

To add another silly (or not) theory since one of the prop seems feathered.
-The pnf pulling out by mistake, with his/her winter's sleeve, one condition lever to "stop" while reaching back from the instrument panel.



Don't laugh, it is something relatively easy to do on the Basler. Mainly from the right seat if you don't pay attention.




Disclaimer: Again, it is a just another possibility out of hundreds.

[valleyboy]

To add another silly (or not) theory since one of the prop seems feathered

That is one fact that is known, the engines were both producing power, but you should read the whole thread because that was already proposed. For all the other throwing stones, the aircraft was under max gross. As pointed out there are several ghouls posting. All I have to say about that is don't even consider it could never happen to you, unless you post here as an expert and have really never flown. Then likely something going sideways in and aircraft is remote.

[TG]

To add another silly (or not) theory since one of the prop seems feathered

That is one fact that is known, the engines were both producing power, but you should read the whole thread because that was already proposed.

Ah, I must be blind...
Actually I think you misunderstood me.

I 'm not talking about intentionally shutting down a wrong engine but just shutting one off via its condition lever. After doing an unrelated move with your arm accross it.
Like I said, with those long levers, it is a mistake easy to do on this type.


I am not saying it is what happen, or saying that to blame the crew. Not at all, I am just throwing another scenario out of a hundreds since nobody here have a clue yet of what happen to bring the aircraft down.

[NotDirty!]

since nobody here have a clue yet of what happen to bring the aircraft down.

My guess is gravity.

[Jean-Pierre]

I am quite interested in the recovery operation. Could someone take some picture that is in Pickle Lake? As other said it would be best to fix it there and fly it off but the weather forecast shows plus temperature all week. It will be very slippy and maybe slushy place to work. Towing it to the airport would be harder though it looks like a lot of tree and steep hill.

[Illya Kuryakin]

There have been a lot of accidents at Pickle Lake over the years, anybody keeping track?

Actually, for the number and type of flights in and around YPL, it's not been all that bad.
Illya

[Donald]

Double post