Confederation Sept 2008

[fingersmac]

FOUR Now here is the thing, going to confed is a dice roll, the college does not have the resources to bring all the kids though first semester, so you have a 33% chance of loosing allot of money w/ only 15hrs to show for it..

Not true. It was made very clear to us that there was funding available to each and every student that passes first semester. There's no quota involved. The attrition rate was closer to 50% in my year but the vast majority where people that didn't take things as seriously as they should have. After all the tax payers are flipping the bill for the flight training.

The program isn't rocket science. Any one with a little aptitude and ambition can put forth the work required to pass the first semester and all other subsequent semesters. Sadly there are some that don't pass that tried but they are few and far between.

As for not refunding your residence or meal plans.. That's a college policy that applies to all students, in all programs.

And furthermore, many post secondary classes are decided on a heavily weighted final exam. The PPL ground school final at Confed is only worth 50% of your mark (10% for a pre-final and 40% for tests/assignments/quizzes). It's a difficult class and a difficult test for people new to aviation, and even to those that already have their PPL. But it's not suppose to be a cakewalk. If you put in the time and effort and study, a 70% pass mark is attainable.

[SuperchargedRS]

Well ANY SCHOOL where 33% or more fail out 1st semester...EVERY FIRST SEMESTER, is unacceptable, and highly improbably in any [reputable] institution.

There policy about not refunding the res and meal plan is BS, policy or not, it's BS


I can think of a few people that passed, some that got poor quiz marks all through the semester and vise versa

Draw any conclusions you want from the what I wrote, however there is a REASON THEY DONT POST THE FAIL OUT RATE,

also if this school was in a more.... regulated place the program would have been "overhauled" as a 33% first semesters fail rate with the "polices" in regards to refunda and the low amount of return on the students investment is HIGHLY SUSPECT and UNACCEPTABLE,

bringing kids in and kicking 33% out and keeping there money is not right in any light, it is even more... disgusting when you lure them in by stating that you will, as the college says, "change there lives through learning".

Also when the dean of the "aviation" program has all his training and experience in MARKETING one has to think.

GO TO CONFED AND YOU WILL HAVE A 33% CHANCE OR HIGHER OF LOOSING YOUR MONEY W/ 15HRS TO SHOW FOR IT.

Also who told you the funding was there?

[fingersmac]

It's not some conspiracy theory where the college has designed a program to rid young people of their money. It's their fault if they can't maintain the course objectives.

As for the Dean, the college has gone through several in the last few years. When I was there, the Dean was a former DC3 pilot. So what if the lastest Dean has a marketing background?

Funding available was told to me by the senior staff. But that must be part of their master plan.

By the way, fail out rates are equally as high at Sault and Seneca.

[AUGER9]

Did you fail out of ths school or what? Everything fingersmac has said is quite correct

Well ANY SCHOOL where 33% or more fail out 1st semester...EVERY FIRST SEMESTER, is unacceptable, and highly improbably in any [reputable] institution.

It's the same, if not worse, at Sault and Seneca. They have MORE than enough resources set up for you in order to help you be successful. If you fail out, it is 100% your fault, no arguing about it. It is more than a regular FTU, it is College. It's not meant to be easy by any means.

THREE All of your grades will be decided by two tests at the end of the semester

Again, this is simply not true, where are you getting your information?

Go troll somewhere else.

[SuperchargedRS]

The info I stated is ture, if that sounds like some con-game then I guess that's how you inturpited it.

If other colleges have the same failout rate then that's BS on them too, that's like saying it's ok to break the speed limit if others are doing it too...ever try that argument with a cop?

And why is it important if the dean is a ad man... I know this is canada, but pull your head out of your azz, how many people on this board have compianed about schools selling a pipe dream of going right from school to A/C or jazz?

I am not trolling I am just saying when the school says that they have seats avalible and advertise a no quota system to compete with there rival schools they should also state the failure rate. If you are failing out 1/3 OR MORE of your student population EVERY YEAR, that's bad teaching... especialy when some people who you fail out hold degrees from real univeristys, and have a high avrage going into a test...

Says the school of aviation's interim director Brian Ktytor, "All (three programs grads) can pretty well writetheir own ticket for any job they want.

"Airlines are recruiting right out of the school. Flight management grads are getting multiple offers and we're getting contacts from companies constantly looking for grads in all three disciplines.

Yea that's how the industry is all right lol

I'm just stating the facts, draw your own conclusions, I just think they should be more transparent and not publish this crap to attract kids.

[AUGER9]

"If other colleges have the same failout rate then that's BS on them too, that's like saying it's ok to break the speed limit if others are doing it too...ever try that argument with a cop?"

If a student doesn't meet the requirements for the course, why should they be allowed to move on? Again, this is college. If you fail, you fail, it's that simple.

"how many people on this board have compianed about schools selling a pipe dream of going right from school to A/C or jazz?"

Confed sends 1 student a year to represent the school for the jazz award. Only 3 students applied for it in the last class. Your told right off the bat that when you graduate, your gonna be working crappy hours for no money, if you even get a flying job. They never sugar-coated it for anyone, and no one thought they would be flying for AC upon graduation.

"If you are failing out 1/3 OR MORE of your student population EVERY YEAR, that's bad teaching..."

This is probably the most wrong point, but an easy assumption to make. The ground school teachers have been teaching for 10, 20+ years, they are absolutely brilliant. The biggest fault is for making the final PPL ground school exam so difficult. But it is obviously possible to pass, if you work hard. Of the students that pass their gs final, 100% not only pass TC, but friggin rape it.
So, if they were to show the failure rate, they might as advertise their TC marks which are very well done.

"I just think they should be more transparent and not publish this crap to attract kids."

I do very much agree with this. But where does it say that on their website? All I saw was this "The majority of our graduates work initially for small aircraft operations across Canada."

[SuperchargedRS]

xx

[SuperchargedRS]

If a student doesn't meet the requirements for the course, why should they be allowed to move on? Again, this is college. If you fail, you fail, it's that simple.

If you dont prepare people for a final worth the majority of the grade your not doing right by the students, and failing as a "learning" institution
..Also I can think of people who were failed out (just on the final) who hold degrees from universities...

Confed sends 1 student a year to represent the school for the jazz award. Only 3 students applied for it in the last class. Your told right off the bat that when you graduate, your gonna be working crappy hours for no money, if you even get a flying job. They never sugar-coated it for anyone, and no one thought they would be flying for AC upon graduation.

It doesnt sound like that in the articles quoted from Mr. Kytor.

The biggest fault is for making the final PPL ground school exam so difficult. But it is obviously possible to pass, if you work hard.

AUGER, the big thing we agree on is that final test, it is disproportionate to the caliber of work prior to it (and worth the majority of ones grade), and if it WASNT for that test the fail out rate would not nearly as bad.

I do very much agree with this. But where does it say that on their website? All I saw was this "The majority of our graduates work initially for small aircraft operations across Canada."

Once again that was publicity work done on the part of Mr. Kytor which can be found on the internet and in papers such as the one I listed in my previous post.

FACTS
1) In the end of the day every 1st semester 33% or more (1 out of 3 kids) will be kicked from the program and there money (the res and food money for the next semester) will NOT be refunded,

2) The counselors WILL try to move you into a different program.

3) AND you will not be allowed to see your final tests (these tests MAKE OR BREAK YOUR GRADE)

Those are the facts...take it for what it's worth

[CLguy]

When I was there, I had 5 job offers before I had my commercial license. That was a few year ago but talking with some that are graduating this year it seems that those days have returned!!

[AUGER9]

If you dont prepare people for a final worth the majority of the grade your not doing right by the students, and failing as a "learning" institution

So when half the class starts studying for the final exam the weekend prior, who's fault is that?

It doesnt sound like that in the articles quoted from Mr. Kytor.

Well that's too bad he's advertising like that. Go to the school and you will find it is not like that. My words were completely true.

AUGER, the big thing we agree on is that final test, it is disproportionate to the caliber of work prior to it (and worth the majority of ones grade), and if it WASNT for that test the fail out rate would not nearly as bad.

It's true but what's the easiest solution? It's not really an "exam" if it's only worth 25-30% of your mark. They need something to recommend students for the TC exam, making it easier will sacrifice that and the marks. It would also let students get by with doing minimal work, which isn't suppose to happen.


If you're so unsure, take a look for yourself rather than judging from the outside about what you've heard.
I'm done with this.

[jamesinator]

just thought i'd post here so i can get my case of beer from deflux if he gets in:P some people got accepted as late as september last year.

[Highflyinpilot]

im not gonna get in any arguments but supercharged YOUR WRONG

Auger9 you right.

Been there done that( and passed), If the guy next to me failed, was it because the teacher taught him something diffrent then me, no cause were in the same class, it`s not poor teaching. If you dont make the grade(which is very doable), it`s your own fault and get the phack out, easy as that.

It`s not a scam, everyone knew before handing over tuition that there is a chance you wont make it past the first semester, It`s not rocket science.


anyways for me I would encourage anyone who gets accepted TO GO. It was an amazing 2 years of my life that ill never forget, And would do all over in a heart beat.

[Bliss]

I agree, everyone is taught to the same standard which is quite high. If you don't get it or can't figure it out, then it shows on your final mark/test result. Reading some of these posts about it not being right or fair/not being able to see your test results/ a high failure rate, is sad yes, wrong no. Get used to it! This is aviation your getting into, the business of taking people's lives and expensive machines in your hands and there has to be some accountablity. In every other part of this business you will face the same thing, it's the nature of the business. You can argue till your blue in the face but the college is starting you off right by setting the standard and allowing you to achieve it and if not, well sorry but you gotta go. I would've agreed with Supercharged 10 years ago when I was going through the program, but now I see why they set high standards and why you get the boot if you don't meet them. I've seen friends who have squeaked by or "fell through the cracks" only to get hired and then fired from companies because they had no business flying aircraft. Look at similar programs or disciplines, many have high standards and high fail rates. It is because they are not for everyone and somewhere the grade/marks have to be cut off.

I know it may not seem fair or right, but life isn't and aviation isn't for damn sure, get use to it now or you will have a long bitter career if this is what you choose to pursue.

[mathias_now]

Hello all,

Does anyone have any updates? How many people are still holding out hoping to get an offer, and how many are just going elsewhere? If holding out, hang in there and if you're planning somewhere else, where?

Best of luck to all of the wait listed people, and people who chose to go elsewhere. Keep chasing the dream and don't give up, or let up no matter what anyone says or how hard times get. You'll make it and appreciate it more the harder you have to work for it. It's like departing in a storm, whether it's snow, hail or rain, once you break through the clouds its clear sky and the sun is shinning.

I can't want to fly with some of you in the future. Until then stay up, and work hard.

kindest regards,

MN

PS. DK if you read this Congrats buddy!!!!

[deflux]

I've started training at a local FTU. Going well so far. Got a class 2 instructor that I realy get along well with.

[Night Hawk]

Hey guys,

I spoke with the admissions office, and they said they have handed out more offers, anyone from the waitlist get any offers recently?? Best of luck to those on the waitlist. Hope to see you this fall!

P.S Thanks Mathias, I hope your offer is in the mail soon.

[sstaurus]

So much crap being flung around this thread.

There is no quota, anyone who can make the grade, will move on. You can't compare the failure rate of this program with other colleges as this program is very different. Most of the people entering the program are straight out of high school and those that are unprepared to work are most likely to fail. Let's face it, highschool is a joke and the discipline all of a sudden required comes as a shock to many people going right into this program without any other experience.

The faculty and instructors are genuinely interested in you succeeding, and will make sure you know it.

[Highflyinpilot]

exactly what sstaurus said.



Anyways good luck to those who get in, you wont regret it.