Crazy Beaver Load

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goldeneagle
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Post by goldeneagle »

MUSICMAN wrote: Anyone that know's anything about aerodynamics will tell you that compression is less drag than suction, thus giving you better air flow. Ta Da!! science lesson for the day. Oh, by the way.... this is why the tail of aircraft are the pointy end.

MM
Hmm, I'll bite, this bait looks tastey. Yes, I do know _just a little_ about aerodynamics.

I can remember pretty clearly, back in 81, I had just finished another season 'in the bush', flew a bunch of boats that summer, on a beaver, pointy end to the back. I had tried to analyze the reasons mathematically, but, never did find a proper solution over the summer, sooo, when I got back to school for the winter, I asked my aerodymanics professor about it (ya, that was one of the courses in an aerospace engineering program). He was a crafty old one tho, and wouldn't give me a strait answer. Guess i shouldn't have been surprised 2 weeks later when we started getting term project assignments. My task, wind tunnel analysis of a 14 foot fishboat, using a scale model. Yipppeeeee, see, there is actually practical reasons to go to university. Off I went to do analysis of stability, control, and efficiency of flying a 14 footer, great fun, and my entire academic semester rested on the results.

I'll spare you the math and all the tables of pressure plot measurements. The conclusions were quite a surprise, NOT. The fishboat is stable flown pointy end forward. It creates a significant amount of drag, with an insignificant amount of lift. Properly oriented (keel down) it can be made to fly with sufficient airspeeed, but then again, so can a brick. Downstream of the stern, there is a significant area of turbulent airflow, the exact geometry of that turbulence is a function of the speed you drag it thru the air. The turbulent region exists for all airspeeds.

Turn it around in the wind tunnel now, and 'fly' it with the pointy end to the back. The boat is unstable, and produces virtually no lift in any configuration. At low airspeeds, there is no area of turbulence aft of the boat. Boundary layer breakaway is a function of reynolds number, so crank up the speed and you will be able to determine when the system starts to produce a turbulent airflow behind the boat. Crank the speed up high enough, and, the turbulence behind the boat is almost equivalent to the other way around, but at lower speeds it is significantly lower. The total drag produced is substantially lower at low speeds, more than a little bit significant.

The final part of my paper, take all the wind tunnel data, and extrapolate to calculate the effect of that boat when it is configured to be an appendage on an aircraft in flight, ie tied on. The final conclusions, at high speeds it becomes a bit of a wash, varios conflicting factors. At low speeds, blunt end forward produces less drag, and substantially less turbulence downstream, at the expense of a little aircraft stability. Maybe some day I'll see a high speed beaver, but, till then, guess the old farts were right after all, tie it on good (that stability thing) and put the blunt end forward. The slower you go, the more difference it makes, think takeoff and landing now....
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ettw
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Post by ettw »

I love reading replies when written by people who know shite about shite!

Thanks for the information!

Cheers,

ETTW
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Cat Driver
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Post by Cat Driver »

I'll never forget the first time I tied a 14 foot Lund pointed end foward between the floats of a Wichita Ice maker.

Only the fact that I'm the luckiest thing alive allowed me to get it turned around and landed again.

So I turned it blunt end foward and viola, it flew just fine.

Didn't need to go to school to learn what not to do after that ride.
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sky's the limit
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Post by sky's the limit »

What's that old Bush expression?

"Learn from the mistakes of others, because you won't live long enough to them all yourself...."
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Pratt
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Post by Pratt »

One other point to mention, I don't think it has been said yet. Always tie the external loads on yourself.................gives you alot more peace of mind. :D
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zero
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Post by zero »

Okay, ya got my attention Cat...now what happened in flight for interest sake?

Good post 'eagle'!!
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Rowdy
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Post by Rowdy »

We always had a safety rope tied off to at least 3 or 4 hardpoints as well as the two ratcheting straps to the canoe racks.

I would never jump in without either having supervised or done the securing myself.
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Post by Cat Driver »

Zero, I got the thing airborne but it would not fly once I got out of ground effect, managed to jump it over the RR bridge and got it turned around and back to the lake.

Was flying for George Terriault and fu.kin near wrecked his favourite airplane for him.( A Beech 18 on floats.)

Cat
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The hardest thing about flying is knowing when to say no


After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
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zero
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Post by zero »

Yikes...it's good to be alive!!
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Post by oldtimer »

Cat, I was interested in your comments about a boat on a Beech 18. I found the old Bugsmasher to be a very fine floatplane but some quirky things could cause a bit of worry. The forward portion of the lid on the battery box came open in flight and bent up and caused a terrible vibration and near stall conditions and yet the overhead cockpit escape hatch of similar size and shape would cause little if any disturbance. It was a wierd airplane in some respects. And for those who have never seen one, a boat goes under the fuselage between the floats via a boat rack as opposed to being tied sideways as is on most singles because a Beech 18 does not have flying and landing wires or a spreader bar holding the floats together or apart, as required. I tried to put a boat in the rack pointy end forward but it covered up two very important pieces of equipment, namely the pitot tubes, so I put the boat in blunt end forward and it flew quite well. I have often wondered why someone has not invented a method of loading a boat laying flat between the spreader bars. I would think the assymetric drag of the boat being offset by the rudder would increase the total drag. The old Bugsmasher actually flew boats quite well, in my opinion.
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Post by klimman123 »

There has been real testing by the feds but dam if I can find the results.

Image
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Post by klimman123 »

hmmmm lets try that again

Image[/img]
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J31
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Post by J31 »

klimman123 wrote:hmmmm lets try that again

Image[/img]
Quick now….what bush plane is that?
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Post by Driving Rain »

Quick now….what bush plane is that?

Stinson SR9 gullwing. :roll:
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J31
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Post by J31 »

Driving Rain wrote:Quick now….what bush plane is that?

Stinson SR9 gullwing. :roll:
Hats of to you for recognizing a unique bush plane of the 40’s, 50’s and 60’s. The Stinson was a powerful modern bush plane in its day.
It could however be a SR8 with the flat windshield while the SR9 has a wrap around windshield. :wink:

Stinson SR8 from http://www.edcoatescollection.com/ac4/C ... .html.html
Image

Then there is the Stinson SR9-FM pictures from Canadian Bushplane Heritage Centre. http://www.bushplane.com/homepage.spml
Image
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