When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

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Gino Under
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by Gino Under »

"What if the people that do the hiring at SWG just didn't like any of the laid off candidates that applied? Didn’t feel their personalities were a good fit for the company or some other soft skill wasn’t quite what they wanted?"

I have a theory about suggestions like that.
What if you had several airlines go bankrupt over a reasonably short period of time in a country that has a relatively small number of so-called qualified and experienced pilots and those pilots were continually re-cycled between new low-cost vacation carrier after new low cost vacation carrier whos Chief Pilots and Check Pilots keep turning up as the men in charge at that new carrier with a list as long as your arm of people they don't like or who they have a grudge against who they have no wish to hire or see turn up in their new organization?

Nah, that's not likely going on.

You think Sunwing is having trouble finding Canadian pilots?

Gino Under :partyman:
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YHZGOOSE
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by YHZGOOSE »

trey kule wrote: Look at the start of this thread Nothing like tossing out derogatory comments to convince anyone in the govt to help the cause. Good job guys..And again take a minute to step out of your own little world and ask yourself this..If you could not, or did not want to have to try and defend yourself against the howling mob who posts derogatory things about the government because they wont help them, are you going to respond to anything when you know it is going to be posted here on a public forum and ripped apart ...
I think the movement, so to speak has pretty much done its best to alienate every govt depart, politician, and organization that could help them.
Where would the taxpayer subsidization stop.. With laid off TA pilots? What about a king air pilot who has been laid off but has never flown a jet? Should they not also be given training to get a rating?
It is really to bad that all these proposals dont have someone in the group to offer a bit more common sense solutions..And there is one...
The whole issue is that the training costs for a seasonal employee do not make it economically feasable when there is a much cheaper solution. Unfortunately this solution means hiring properly rated pilots from other countries..It is the root issue that should be being addressed, and it is just being skirted around.
Meet with the companies and the govt.Dont post every response here you dont, like..There is a way to make it work, but it wont happen taking this route I dont think.
I agree bud. And lets not forget pilots fund and pay for their own ratings in Europe ie: Ryanair. Foreign pilots fly all over the world with a huge majority in the Middle East and Asia, so the topic that Canada is the only country doing it is a gross stretch.
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Gino Under
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by Gino Under »

..If you could not, or did not want to have to try and defend yourself against the howling mob who posts derogatory things about the government because they wont help them, are you going to respond to anything when you know it is going to be posted here on a public forum and ripped apart ...

Sorry, but as naieve as this may sound, any elected politician who swears (on a bible) to uphold the laws of this country doesn't have the luxury of choosing to ignore the complaints or protests of its citizens or various interest groups simply because of an unkind word or protest movement (no matter what form it may take including this forum) is used to draw their attention to any miscarriage of justice. They don't get to ignore an issue because their feelings are hurt or their ego doesn't feel like taking it on.

This isn't just about a type rating.

Gino Under :shock:
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Last edited by Gino Under on Wed Feb 13, 2013 6:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by GRK »

Uh Goose...you sure about your last statement? The one where you tell us about all the Canadian pilots working overseas and then link it to the current state of affairs in Canada. Are you really sure? Firstly, why do you think there are so many pilots offshore? Is it because there aren't enough good jobs there? (Hint: How many airlines have failed, or merged for that matter, for any reasons, in the last 10 years in Canada) How many of these pilots are, in your opinion, where they want to be? Do they really love working over in foreign countries where they have few or no rights, work long hours on short rest..live in polluted cities, or in extreme weather for half of the year, get home to see family maybe twice a year. Or have their contracts changed at the will of the contractor after signing? Or have to chase the work all over the world to survive? Living in these countries is NOT like living in Canada, and never will be. Now...on to the part where you say that Canadian pilots working overseas are taking jobs from the locals in the country they are currently working in. This one is easy...They are there because the country they are working in DOESN'T HAVE ENOUGH PILOTS! I know because I'm one of the hundreds who lost a couple of pretty good jobs at failed or merged airlines, and in order to keep working, got a job in a country where they have no one to fly the equipment on order...and it's a huge number of tails on order. (That's one example of several.) It's in no way comparable to what is happening in Canada...and it's a sure bet that I won't ever reach the employment level required to join and survive financially if I came home to work at what's left...so no coming home to work.
I admit there will be one or two exceptions, but in most of the cases, a Canadian pilot is not taking work from a local. You can be sure that as soon as a qualified group of locals are ready to replace a foreign pilot group in their own country, they will. SIngapore Air is doing it right now and has always done it. The UAE is training their own like mad to replace foreign pilots from the senior management pilot positions all the way down to producing cadets to fill the seats...so is China, so permit me to say that there are no comparisons to the tempest in Canada. Please don't mistake the two situations as being the same, they're not. Fly Safe. GRK
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TrailerParkBoy
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by TrailerParkBoy »

After 9/11, I was laid off from a non-flying job and through EI, they offered training allowance to get back to work. It cost $12000 (I paid 1/4), and 3 months later, I was working as a pilot!

In 2010, I was laid off from a flying position, and this time, EI funding program didn't exist. It took me 1 year to be back in a pilot seat.

If the goal is to have Canadians working and not on EI, which method do you think is beneficial?

Food for thought: If you've never had a problem finding work, never been laid off, never been part of a company that has closed your doors, then you will never understand.
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termerair
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by termerair »

TrailerParkBoy wrote:Food for thought: If you've never had a problem finding work, never been laid off, never been part of a company that has closed your doors, then you will never understand.
+1

For the people who do not understand the foreign pilots issue, I just wish they would end up for one day in the shoes of the guys/gales who have been laid off and who are looking for a job while there are +150 foreign pilots flying canadian registered aircrafts... I am pretty sure their views would be slightly different! A HRSDC request to fund a 737 TR would probably become something obvious as there seems to be a lack of 737 drivers in Canada...!

Those same people would maybe even feel insulted when they don't get an answer from the governmental agency regarding a 16 page long document that took a few days and a few nights to put together! Remember this governmental agency runs thanks to the tax payers like you and me...

Just sayin'

T.
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AFIRS
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by AFIRS »

Meanwhile, in Canada’s House of Commons....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=p ... eBZuZAoglE
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ea306
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by ea306 »

Nice link.

Evidently Parliament have other pressing issues to concern themselves with.
:lol:
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termerair
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by termerair »

Ô Miracle!

HRSDC has finally responded to the request to fund 30 x 737NG type ratings at CAE in Montreal... It took them just over 16 weeks to prepare their document. I will let you discover the level of incompetency we are dealing with... I don't know what they've been smoking while responding to our request but this shows the mess that is going on in the government agencies.

I am glad the canadian pilots are a more professional group than those clowns...

For those who don't read french, "Centre Agricole Emploi" (CAE) could be translated by "Employment Agricultural Center"... Enjoy!

T.

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Gilles Hudicourt
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by Gilles Hudicourt »

The 30 AT pilots were from several Provinces. Were they all told to go ask the Government of Quebec to fund the type rating?
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by termerair »

It sounds like it. The report was very clear though. It was specifically mentioned that the pilots are from QC, ON, SK, BC. Did they even read that far...? I doubt.

Cheers,

T.
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by Gilles Hudicourt »

OTTAWA — A group of 30 laid-off pilots was left perplexed following last week’s federal budget, after the government introduced a job training grant and a commitment to Canadian workers over temporary foreign hires less than a month after rejecting a similar proposal from the pilots.

Pilots are now cautiously optimistic the budget measures will resolve their long-running complaint that companies like Sunwing and CanJet shouldn’t be allowed to hire European pilots for the busy sun destination season when Canadians are available and qualified — if only they could get routine training on the airline’s particular brand of passenger jet. Most airlines consider the training, called a “type-rating,” a cost of doing business, but the charters argue they’re prohibitive from a seasonal hiring perspective.

For a number of years, the airlines have successfully applied to the government through a couple of different programs for permission to hire foreign pilots, saying they’ve advertised for the position in Canada but could find few qualified candidates. Hundreds of foreign pilots have benefited from the deals as a result while Air Transat pilots lost their jobs.

The laid-off Air Transat pilots sent Human Resources and Skills Development Canada a detailed, 16-page proposal in November calling on the federal government to pay for their “type-rating” training. They said it would be more cost effective than having them all go on employment insurance.

While the training could run anywhere from $25,000-$30,000 per pilot, they pegged the EI cost to taxpayers at $580,000, noting that doesn’t take into account the tax revenues the government would make if they were working.

“The government will be able to save employment benefits. The government will collect more taxes through more Canadian taxpayers. The government will be able to demonstrate it is working in the best interests of Canadians,” they argued in the proposal obtained by Postmedia News.

“In the medium and long-term, the Canadian airline industry will remain competitive on the global stage without relying on foreign labour and last but not least, Canadian pilots will be able to work at home in Canada.”

The department finally responded in late February with a curt thanks but no thanks, noting the provinces get millions in federal dollars through labour market agreements to fund training and that the pilots should contact their provincial governments. The long-delayed response also appeared to be slapped together in haste. For example, a reference to the CAE, the civil aviation training centre in Montreal that offers type-rating courses, is mistakenly identified as the “Centre Agricole Emploi.”

Fast forward a month, a highlight of last week’s budget was the new Canada Job Grant. It’s to be the centrepiece of new labour market agreements that have yet to be negotiated with the provinces and is an attempt to redesign the way short-term job training money is dished out. Recognizing a disconnect between training and actual employment, the federal government is making the grants a three-way partnership. The federal government will fork out up to $5,000 for retraining so long as the provinces and employers agree to at least match it.

The budget also promised to reform the temporary foreign worker program to ensure non-residents are only considered when “Canadians genuinely cannot fill those jobs” and that employers that rely on temporary foreign workers make efforts to “transition to a Canadian workforce over time.”

The former Air Transat pilots are generally afraid to speak publicly since they’re still trying to find gainful permanent employment. One of the ringleaders of the HRSDC proposal, however, said he hopes the new grant is a solution to the ongoing battle with charter airlines, but remains wary given the government’s disappointing response to his initial proposal.

Another organizer argued getting government money to pay for type-rating shouldn’t “become systematic” for companies as “training pilots is just part of the operating cost of business.”

Neither CanJet nor Sunwing responded to a request for comment on whether they would welcome the new grant as a means of sharing the cost to type-rate Canadian pilots.

CanJet president Stephen Rowe has said in the past that he would gladly hire Canadians if they had the proper type-rating but that his company couldn’t afford to train temporary employees, only to lay them off months later so they could find work elsewhere and maybe not be available to him again the following year.

Sunwing president Mark Williams has said his company is trying to reduce its reliance on foreign workers and last year forked out about $800,000 to get 20 seasonal Canadian pilots type-rated.

That said, it’s still not entirely clear whether pilots will be eligible for the new grant for type-rating training.

“The detailed design of the grant will be negotiated with provinces and territories over the next year, in consultation with stakeholder groups including employer associations, educational institutions and labour organizations,” said Alyson Queen, a spokeswoman for Human Resources Minister Diane Finley.

It seems plausible, however, since the grants are open to those who need “short-duration training” through a community college, career college or trade union training centre. Type-rating training requires about 60 hours of simulator time per two-person crew and can be completed in about six weeks.

Jaren Belrose, a Manitoba pilot who was not among the laid-off Air Transat employees, said he was in a similar situation and managed to convince his province to cover his type-rating costs. Unfortunately, approval came too late as the sun destination flying season was already well underway, but he’s optimistic the new grant program will remedy the situation.

“When I proposed the training to Manitoba, it seemed that they did not have any framework or guidance and were working with their best instinct. I believe that this is why it took them so long to make the decision,” he said.

“We remain optimistic that the airlines that have gone to HRSDC looking to bring in European pilots will now be able to go and apply for training grants instead. I look forward to the time when we won’t have to worry about our jobs going overseas because companies see training as too expensive.”

tcohen@postmedia.com

Twitter.com/tobicohen



Read more: http://www.canada.com/business/Canadian ... z2OvawbnC7
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Gilles Hudicourt
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by Gilles Hudicourt »

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2013 ... alkom.html

Canadian employers won't bother training workers as long as they can import cheap temporary help from abroad.

The federal government says it is serious about job-training. It is not.
If it were, it would not make it so easy for business to hire cheap workers from abroad.
This is the dirty little secret about job-training in Canada. Employers don’t train workers because most don’t have to.
They expect government to train workers at public cost. And if that doesn’t work, businesses expect government to let them import from abroad workers who are already trained.
This is why employer organizations welcomed Finance Minister Jim Flaherty’s announcement Thursday of a proposed wage subsidy scheme that would see governments provide business with up to $10,000 per worker for training.
This proposed Canada Job Grant requires provincial approval. (Quebec has already announced its opposition, so good luck there.)
And while Flaherty wants business to chip in $5,000 per worker as well, his scheme remains very much dependent on public largesse.
However, aside from a few vague mutterings, the Conservative government does not seem prepared to seriously scale back temporary worker programs that allow business to cherry-pick cheap labour from abroad.
If companies knew they couldn’t import, say, skilled pipefitters from Europe, they might put more effort into training domestic workers to meet their needs.
But employers know they don’t have to train. Instead, they need only wait until the last minute and then complain of labour shortages.
Over the last decade, as my friends at the Globe and Mail have reported, the number of temporary workers admitted to Canada has more than tripled, from 101,000 to 338,000.
This in the midst of the worst recession since the 1930s.
Business insists that such workers are needed because skilled Canadians are unavailable. But far too often the real reason is that foreign workers are willing to work for less.
The Conservative government has codified this practice by permitting Canadian employers to pay their foreign workers up to 15 per cent less than the going wage.
Indeed, the program for temporary foreign skilled workers has become a national joke. Alberta fast-food chains have famously used it to import skilled coffee pourers.
In British Columbia, one mining company received federal permission to import low-wage Chinese miners because it claimed that fluency in Mandarin was an essential skill.
To his credit, Flaherty has pledged to block that particular loophole. His budget would forbid fluency in any language other than English and French to be used as a job requirement by companies applying to hire temporary foreign workers.
But the Conservatives still insist that importing cheap foreign labour is a necessity if the needs of business (or, as they call it, the economy) are to be served.
In this, they are very much in the Canadian tradition. Training and immigration are inexorably linked in this country. Throughout its history, Canada has always looked to immigrants to solve its economic problems.
In the late 19th century, Eastern European immigrants to the Prairies provided business for the railways and a market for Ontario manufacturers.
Those same manufacturers employed skilled British artisans to staff their factories.
After 1945, immigrants from countries like Italy and Portugal provided labour for the post-war boom.
But at least all of these were real immigrants, who were offered citizenship and a permanent home in a new land.
Now we want immigrants who will do their jobs for a while and then quietly go away.
We import cheap temporary workers to pick crops and cheap temporary nannies to look after kids.
We import cheap temporary plumbers and cheap temporary welders. And then we wonder why firms don’t bother training Canadians to do those skilled jobs.
Why should they? It’s cheaper to bring in temporary workers from abroad. That’s the real training story.
Yes this country has always relied on immigrants. But normally immigrants come here to stay and establish themselves in Canada, participate in the country's economy. Often, they sell all they have in their country of origin to purchase a home and goods in this country, to start a new life here. As I did.

A temporary foreign worker is in Canada to make money to send to his country, to his family. He lives in temporary quarters. In theory he should pay taxes and contribute to EI and to the CPP but the pilots that Sunwing and Canjet hire as TFW do not pay any taxes in Canada and do not contribute to EI or to the CPP. They act as though they were foreign pilots flying wet-leased aircraft in Canada. Which they practically are.

Here is what the Immigration and Refugee Protection Regulations (IRPR) have to say on issuing a Labour Marker Opinion to hire a TFW:
(3) An opinion provided by the Department of Human Resources and Skills Development with respect to the matters referred to in paragraph (1)(b) shall be based on the following factors:
(c) whether the employment of the foreign national is likely to fill a labour shortage;
(d) whether the wages offered to the foreign national are consistent with the prevailing wage rate for the occupation and whether the working conditions meet generally accepted Canadian standards;
(e) whether the employer has made, or has agreed to make, reasonable efforts to hire or train Canadian citizens or permanent residents; and
(f) whether the employment of the foreign national is likely to adversely affect the settlement of any labour dispute in progress or the employment of any person involved in the dispute.
Last fall, Sunwing created a wholly owned Pilot Contracting company, whose official purpose was to employ temporary Canadian pilots. They were outside of the Sunwing Pilot's Union who are under CAW. In reality this new entity had darker purposes.

This allowed Sunwing to by-pass three problems that the IRPR presented. It allowed Sunwing to claim that the job for which the foreigners were being hired was not part of a Union. All they had to do was to claim that the TFW pilots were not going to work for Suning per se but for that non-Union Temporary contract company, which was not part of a Union. Which they in fact did in their applications, of which I have copies.

This also allows Sunwing to claim that the TFW pilots would be paid the the same wages as the local pilots. That is the same wages as the non union pilots. Not the wages of those Union pilots that just negotiated a descent pay increase.

Then it fulfilled the requirement that Sunwing had to hire and train local pilots before it could import any foreign workers. They hired and trained 20 Canadian pilots, and used that as an excuse to to justify 96 foreign pilots under reciprocity, and 119 additional foreign pilots under an LMO application. A pretty good return for hiring just 20 Canadian contract pilots.

Whatever the government comes up with as far as regulations, the Sunwing legal team will find a loophole around it. And the government official deliver the permits.

What will put an end to all these legal and regulatory shenanigans ?

The fact that the Canadian Aviation Regulations (CARs) do not allow foreign licensed pilots to fly the line under Sub-Part 705. It's coded into 705.106(1)(a). So there will no longer be any foreign pilots flying for Canjet or Sunwing with a FLVC, no matter what shenanigans they come up with.

The game is over.
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by OPEC6-Heavy »

Gilles,
Last fall, Sunwing created a wholly owned Pilot Contracting company, whose official purpose was to employ temporary Canadian pilots. They were outside of the Sunwing Pilot's Union who are under CAW. In reality this new entity had darker purposes.
First of all this Contacting company no longer exists, all pilots are now full time Union SWG pilots. If it had "Darker purposes" it would still be around, "Darker" meaning more efficient cost wise.
This also allows Sunwing to claim that the TFW pilots would be paid the the same wages as the local pilots. That is the same wages as the non union pilots. Not the wages of those Union pilots that just negotiated a descent pay increase.
Secondly, these contact pilots where actually paid more than a Union Sunwing pilot. Plus they received a cash bonus after a certain time period. Hardly under cutting Union guys. You can chalk this up to being an experiment on how to more effectively hire Canadians.

Lets stick to facts.
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Gilles Hudicourt
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by Gilles Hudicourt »

Here are some facts. Page 3 of the Sunwing LMO application as received by HRSDC on Oct 24 2012

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/105225711/SunwingLMO.xps

Box 46. Is the position part of a Union ? Reply "No"

Because had the reply been "yes", Sunwing would have been forced to admit the Union was in arbitration at the time........

There are brilliant people working at Sunwing, I'll give you credit for that much.

PS Box 45 should also have been "yes". The job is regulated by Transport Canada whose CAR 705.106(1)(a) says no foreign licensed pilot.
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TrailerParkBoy
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by TrailerParkBoy »

I'm surprised Sunwing still has customers. Their product is cheap and misleading. My one and only experience got me to my resort at 2am to start my 8 night vacation. When we checked in, they informed us that Sunwing hotel rooms are not close to the beach, 10 min walk. To be closer, we could pay more! Our 8th night, we had to check out of the hotel room at 11am, hang by the beach a day then take the shuttle to the airport at 6pm, only to arrive there to find out our plan will arrive late, 1am.

All we wanted was a cheap beach vacation ...I guess we got what we paid for!

I can't see Sunwing being a contender for many years. It's only a matter of time before they run out of loopholes and catchy phrases which seem to get them through the season!
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by monkey »

how much did you pay? Where did you go?
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by OPEC6-Heavy »

TrailerParkBoy,

Keep dreaming, I love it when guys like you make such bold predictions. Sunwing, like many other company's has 2 to 5 star hotels. My guess judging by your name is that you picked the 2 star Cuban option, with the Red-eye flights... And your 100% correct, you get what you pay for. Next time I suggest the Barbados or Aruba 5 star package that leaves YYZ at 9 am for your 7 day package (start saving, it's not cheap). Keep us posted on that one Eh.
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by GRK »

Trailer Boy...
You are so right when you say you get what you pay for...I spent a good few years watching the vacation crowd stagger and stumble in shock and an alcohol induced daze after being booted out of their hotel on "changeover day" and then proceed to drink themselves stoopid until the redeye back to middle Alberta or Canadia or wherever (and it was -30C at home) and then cry like a little kid because it was a sh*tty room at a sh* tty hotel with terrible food and yadayadayada...and the legroom wasn't enough and I want my 400 bucks back...the company who sold them this lovely holiday likely still exists, and so will TA and SW etc...so it never changes does it? You DO get what you pay for...why the surprise then?
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by Gilles Hudicourt »

This is way off the subject of this thread.
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by whipline »

Maybe you should start another Sunwing thread Gilles? I personally don't think there's been enough.
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Gilles Hudicourt
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by Gilles Hudicourt »

Please bear with me just a little bit longer, my job will soon be over I promise. I've been at this for a year now and I am honestly fed up with it. I have other things to do with my life. I've put personal projects off because of this. But I am not a quitter. Except when I am wrong.

PS. And I do not write against Sunwing. I write against the use of Foreign pilots. Sunwing just keeps putting itself in my line of fire. All it needs to do is step aside.
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by 24Left »

[quote=" Sunwing just keeps putting itself in my line of fire. All it needs to do is step aside.[/quote]

Sunwing should step aside for the almighty Gilles.

Maybe you should step aside Gilles and let the union you pay dues to take care of the foreign pilot issues.

Take a stress leave Gilles. This has become beyond nails on a chalkboard.
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Gilles Hudicourt
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by Gilles Hudicourt »

24Left wrote: Maybe you should step aside Gilles and let the union you pay dues to take care of the foreign pilot issues.
Ah see! Instead of personal attacks, you are quite capable of reasoning and providing very valuable arguments. You just hit the nail on the head.

You remember this ? As an ALPA member you must have received it ?
December 14, 2011

ALPA Canada Board Fastread

Call to Action: Temporary Foreign Worker Program

On November 30, Capt. Dan Adamus, ALPA Int’l Canada Board president, appeared before the Standing Senate Committee on Transport and Communications. In his remarks, he focused on a number of emerging issues that the Association sees as potentially having a significant impact on the airline industry in Canada.

One issue of particular concern is the trend among some Canadian air carriers to augment their crew contingent, on a seasonal basis, with foreign pilots. Capt. Adamus expressed concern that the program “is being used to create economic advantage as the carriers can eliminate training costs and hire a pilot only seasonally.”

As the leading advocate for Canadian professional pilots, the Canada Board is initiating a legislative campaign regarding this issue, and we are seeking your full assistance. Please take some time to contact your Member of Parliament (MP) to express your concern about the issue of foreign pilots.

Please note that our intent with this letter-writing campaign is not to slight the CanJet pilots or any other of our pilot groups. We recognize the efforts that the CanJet Master Executive Council (MEC), working with its management, has made to mitigate the effect of foreign pilots on their pilot group and Canadian pilots overall. For example, as part of their collective agreement, no foreign pilot is currently flying as a captain at CanJet. This is one example of how ALPA pilots work collectively through their union on behalf of their fellow pilots.

Now, we are calling on you to join us as advocates for Canadian professional pilots. Please write to your MP and urge him/her to raise the matter of foreign pilots in the House of Commons with the minister for Human Resources and Skills Development Canada (HRSDC). To facilitate your efforts, attached is a sample letter that you can personalize. This sample letter with instructions for contacting your Member of Parliament is also posted below.
In response to this call for action, I wrote a real nice letter to the Immigration Minister which I copied to my MEC. At the time, Air Transat had just laid off 17 pilots for the winter while Canjet was hiring foreigners to fullfill its contract with Transat. We were incensed! (I know, you don't give a hoot and you probably didn't write any letters either)

When my MEC chair read the letter I had written, which was well written and documented, he asked me, on behalf of the TSCMEC, to head the fight against the foreign pilots and here I am.

Before writing to the Immigration Minister, I took the time to look into the laws and regulations that our government was using to let these foreign pilots into Canada and was quick to find that our government was not respecting its own rules, mostly by ignorance. CIC was looking the other way in enforcing reciprocity and didn't know the difference between a wet-lease and a dry lease. HRSDC had no idea what a type rating was or how one was obtained. Transport Canada didn't seem to know that FLVC were not allowed to be issued to fly the line under Sub-Part 705.

Sunwing and Canjet took full advantage of all of this. I seek to redress these past errors. Respectfully. In the name of all pilots in this country, in your name too, even if against your will, so that all flying jobs in this country benefit not foreigners but Canadians and legal Permanent Residents.

I understand quite clearly that if the rules are not applied to one company, it forces other companies to bend them also, but what I seek is for all regulations to be applied to the letter by all companies, and I will win. Not because I am conceited, not because of my ego, not because of any popularity contest but because I am right and that the regulations and laws are clearly and univocally on my side.

I only seek to have existing laws and regulations respected and enforced.

(The only exception I can mention to what I just wrote is when the CTA seems to think that any reason is valid for applying for the wet-lease of a foreign aircraft, which I do not agree with)
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Last edited by Gilles Hudicourt on Sat Apr 06, 2013 2:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: When HRSDC has to chose between Canadians and Foreigners

Post by Scuba_Steve »

+1 Gilles....

Only reason this issue is like 'nails on a chalkboard' is because it has not been redressed yet...

And anyone tired of this conversation, here's any idea, don't click on these posts...if you are, clearly you are still interested or...you're a tad masocistic?

Cheers
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