In Response to Racist Posts...

2R · Post by 2R » Sun Oct 21, 2007 4:45 pm

No apology ?
No recanting ?
Your Hateful racist views are still up on a governmnet funded web site for all to see .Do you intend to remove your hatefilled diatribe?
Do you intend to apologize to the users on this forum for your false accusations ?
Or do you intend to attempt to obfuscate the issues with more BLAH BLAH BLAH

Will you apologize or will you be taking the cowards way out by saying good-bye.

Have you wondered how many people who read your twisted hateful crap visited the areas where the railways have had so many "accidents" this year ???

Widow · Post by **Widow** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 5:00 pm

As someone who has also tried to use this website to change the way others think ... my two cents.

I know very little of reserve life in Canada, outside of what I've read in the media or here, both sources of information taken with grains of salt. I take most everything I see/hear/read/learn with the proverbial grain of salt. I like to get as much information as possible directly from the source, and then make my own conclusions and search for my own solutions. This means that when this thread began, I googled you Deanna, as I did the first time I saw ". .". I do it when someone tells me a "story" that peaks my curiosity. Heck, I even do it before I date someone. This is the information age, and that appears to be your personally maintained website. If you no longer think the way you have expressed yourself there, then change it. Before it does incite the violence and unrest it is decidedly intended to provoke.

I do not condone anarchy. As educated and experienced as you claim to be, you should not either. I do not believe you can simply rebel without understanding the root of the problem and having a solution in place. You cannot simply "not think about" (Caledonia) the serious issues which reflect upon your calls for change, or the prejudices that people will form on their own due to what they read/see/hear/feel for themselves. If you want to be a part of the solution, you must address the "touchy" issues head-on.

Like you Deanna, I have a good mind and "a little" power with words, and I am trying to affect positive change - while supporting my family as a single mother. Like you Deanna, I suffered bullying (my mother killed herself when I was a child and I was the "unloved one" and "the crybaby" for more years than I care to remember) and have suffered many, many other traumas in my life. I also lived for a few months on what is more or less a "reserve" in a Central American country. Like you Deanna, I have been to other places in the world, where I have seen racism and oppression. I came on this website and addressed issues, faced criticism and rebuttal. But Deanna, I don't think anyone would accuse me of skirting any issues.

When I do as you suggest and google "white-minded", the results are overwhelmingly rooted in "white pride". I would have to disagree that the majority of those posting "against" you are instilled with that kind of hate - I also believe the majority of Canadians recognize the terrible circumstances "your" communities have been left with (I am Canadian - so are you, as such, "your" communities are also"mine").

I do not know what the answers are, but I have to agree with the majority here, that you have used aggressive tactics - I do not believe that aggression can solve problems. The threads which you originally addressed as racist, were often already prodigious threads - with many of our oft-time members feeling as you do - or not. But it was being discussed. There was already awareness on the site of the prejudices that have formed. Your attack on the site as described by yourself and our venerable moderators was unwarranted. While I agree that there are some who could choose their words more wisely - I also understand that this is an anonymous discussion forum - you don't have to be the person you are in "real" life if you don't want to be. You can profess whatever opinions you choose - but expect to be held accountable for them - and to be called to defend your position.

Finally, I do not know if someone from the website "ratted you out" to your employer or not ... I have worked several places where computer use was continually monitered and personal use of the internet was cause for immediate dismissal. But if you had attacked my website the way you did this one, you better believe I would attack back.

C-GGGQ · Post by **C-GGGQ** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 5:08 pm

I never once said your childhood bullying incident didn't happen, i said all kids get bullied and labeled.

2R · Post by 2R » Sun Oct 21, 2007 5:21 pm

http://hk.myblog.yahoo.com/2-R

DMH · Post by **DMH** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 5:26 pm

I've apologized a number of times for a number of things. Look passed what you want to see and read what's really there! Anyone esle care to apologize for being completely out of line??? Yeah...didn't think so, because the majority out there believe they are never wrong. As for the website I have taken it down, move on.

DMH · Post by **DMH** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 5:38 pm

[quote="Northern Skies"]Why should something be ok if a caucasian poli sci professor used it? Why should I have any respect for an isolated professor who lives in an ivory tower away from the real world?

Not an isolated term. Readily used in academia when discussing, analyzing various economic, political and cultural circumstances/ideas where marginalization and similarissues are concerned. That's it. My last point pretty much spelled out that the term itself isn't really about the colour of one's skin...and that in our pre-conditioned mind-set (regardless of ethnicity) we simplify diversity by associating it with a colour. That is sad. That is all I can and have to say about the term. I KNOW with great certainty that it's likely not good enough for someone out there, but I cannot say what everyone wants to hear...especially when they aren't even sure what it is they want/need to hear.

Widow · Post by **Widow** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 5:51 pm

DMH wrote:My last point pretty much spelled out that the term itself isn't really about the colour of one's skin...and that in our pre-conditioned mind-set (regardless of ethnicity) we simplify diversity by associating it with a colour. That is sad.

You used the term, and are therefore guilty of that same over-simplification of which you accuse others.

2R · Post by 2R » Sun Oct 21, 2007 6:23 pm

There is hope for you yet.
Growing and learning it is all part of life.
You do not have to be anti-other peoples to enrich the lives of your people and family. It takes all kinds to make the world go round.It took Mandela years on Robin island to realize the true path of a Statesman.

Good luck on tuesday. After all it is not like you were looking at naked people on the internet .You were being healed by the AVCANADA healing circle

After all ,if we are talking ,we are not fighting .and that is a good thing.

sky's the limit · Post by **sky's the limit** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 8:01 pm

2R wrote:You were being healed by the AVCANADA healing circle

Don't believe a word.... it's actually a Murder Ball session, he's just trolling for new players.

stl

Dust Devil · Post by **Dust Devil** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 8:50 pm

Clodhopper wrote:And they're all mine! Muhahahahahahha.

Doesn't mean anything without pics.

I'm just pulling your leg

But if they did turn up I don't think.............um never mind I think I should stop now

BigB · Post by **BigB** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 11:05 pm

DMH wrote:I've apologized a number of times for a number of things. Look passed what you want to see and read what's really there! Anyone esle care to apologize for being completely out of line??? Yeah...didn't think so, because the majority out there believe they are never wrong. As for the website I have taken it down, move on.

One cannot qualify an apology. If I were to say to my wife...."I'll apologize if you do", the apology, in essence, is meaningless. Perhaps that is where you are finding so much resistance......the qualification of most everything you state.

Dex · Post by **Dex** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 3:53 am

Deanna, its good to see you took the page down. I hope you get a chance to rewrite it in a positive way. The principle is worthy. I wish you well with your employment today and hope you can respond here with good news. Good Luck!!

TITAN · Post by **TITAN** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 9:30 am

My Papa , moved here to this great nation in 1968 from a small little country called Portugal.. I was born here in Toronto in 1975 , and went off to school
as most children do, due to my skin color ( olive) I was immediately picked on and called a disturbing name by white crackers, which I'm good friends with today ..

The name was " PORK-CHOP" and I cried so hard for not knowing the meaning of that word , until I asked my papa..

ME : Papa whatsa Porka-chopa?
DAD : we are my boy..
ME: why??
DAD: becausa , we eat lotsa and lotsa porka and a cheesaa...

so I was happily labeled and tagged from that day on, and every Tuesday I brought Pork and cheese for my classmates....

Flybaby · Post by **Flybaby** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 2:18 pm

Mmmmmmmmm...pork chops.

Dust Devil · Post by **Dust Devil** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 3:12 pm

TITAN wrote:My Papa , moved here to this great nation in 1968 from a small little country called Portugal.. I was born here in Toronto in 1975 , and went off to school
as most children do, due to my skin color ( olive) I was immediately picked on and called a disturbing name by white crackers, which I'm good friends with today ..

The name was " PORK-CHOP" and I cried so hard for not knowing the meaning of that word , until I asked my papa..

ME : Papa whatsa Porka-chopa?
DAD : we are my boy..
ME: why??
DAD: becausa , we eat lotsa and lotsa porka and a cheesaa...

so I was happily labeled and tagged from that day on, and every Tuesday I brought Pork and cheese for my classmates....

I've never heard that term before. I would have thought kids might use that on a fat kid or something. I guess I know so little about Portugal I wouldn't even know the racial slur to use. Stop racism through ignorance I suppose.

shitdisturber · Post by **shitdisturber** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 4:17 pm

Pork chop is a racist slur for the Portugese? I learn the most fascinating bits of trivia from AvCanada.

hazatude · Post by **hazatude** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 5:20 pm

Sometimes I feel bad when pilots call me:

-Rampie
-Ramp boy
-Ramp rat
-Hey you
-(whistle)
-Gassy
-Hose boy
-Nipsy Nozzle
-Desksgo
-Uncle Fester
-Fucknuckles

I really don't care at the end of the day though because I look deep into my heart and know exactly who I am.

C-GGGQ · Post by **C-GGGQ** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:07 pm

rofl, those are priceless (having served as a ramp rat myself)

paralyzer · Post by **paralyzer** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 8:53 pm

Wilbur wrote: As for blockades and civil disobedience, how many tax dollars have to be spent on security everytime an international conference is held in this country. How many "white" socialists, anarchists, and assorted other complainers have damaged property, thrown rocks, crashed police baracades, blocked streets, etc in protest of something they didn't like? How many of them dress in "military" style dress?

How do new immigrants succeed in Canada? Well, mostly they settle in large urban areas with large populations of their own ethnicity. Most that get into Canada do so because of the money, education and skills they bring with them. How well do you think they would do if relegated to some isolated community with few services and economic opportunities?

Yes, Indian Affairs has a huge budget, but who is that money actually going to? My bet is that the largest portion by far is consumed by the salaries of their employees, many of whom have a vested interest in maintaining the status quo.

Deanna, two points of view on your suspension from work. I suppose you shouldn't have misused your employer's computer sytem, and perhaps work hours as well, and now what happens, happens. And, if its true that some asshole fink ran to your boss to tattle tale, someone ought to take him/her out back for a good tune up. If I were the boss, you'd both be in shit. A couple days unpaid leave for you, and the tattle taler would be canned for poisoning the work environment by finking about trivial bullshit.

Finally some good sense.

Guess I'd like to put my two cents about that department. Many people, including politicians, civil servants, people looking to get into the government, come to the department to advance their careers. It is used as a stepping stone. Just look at Mr. Prenctice. Stephen Harper rewarded Mr. Prenctice for his work at Indian Affairs and so he moved him into a more important department.
Other people take advantage of the situation, where Aboriginals are not being hired, and so they work there to make the big bucks.

shimmydampner · Post by **shimmydampner** » Wed Oct 24, 2007 12:45 pm

After spending years flying a lot of floats and a little bit of wheels into the majority of the reserves and native communities across northern Ontario and Manitoba as well as many in NWT and northern Alberta and Saskatchewan and living in predominantly native towns throughout the north, including a stint on a fly-in reserve, I have had the chance to observe and learn a great deal about native Canadians and their culture and way of life. It has been an interesting way to gain a fairly unique perspective. I have witnessed depravity first-hand and heard of plenty more second-hand. From airplanes and pilots being shot at to teenagers burning down houses while the elderly residents slept inside; government repair workers being pelted with rocks by children; parents purposely injuring their own babies in order to get a free ride to the hockey tournament in town; a 4 year old boy pulling his drunken mother off the hood of my truck at the local Northern store one morning; defecating in public; copulating in public; one drunk man using his hands to catch and drink the vomit of another man who had just chugged a half a mickey.
However, I have also witnessed the flip side of that coin. The friendly faces ready to greet me at the dock, always there to help out and crack a joke and have a laugh. Complete strangers offering rides around the community to track down some gas in a low-fuel situation or jumper cables to boost a dead aircraft battery; food and shelter on bad weather days; phone calls to base; choice cuts of moose and caribou meat after a long day of hauling hunters and meat; elders sitting and talking with me and answering my many questions about their cultural traditions and spiritual beliefs.
I realize that a major point of this discussion is to stop generalizations but allow me to paint with two broad strokes for a moment. It has been my observation that one could group native peoples into two categories: one which contains those that struggle with the problems that are rife on reserves and in many communities; those that are racist against white people; those that are alcoholics; those that don’t work and instead abuse the system; those mentioned first in the above paragraph. These are apparent and well-known to those pilots flying in the north;
The other group however, contains some of the most personable, genuine, happy and warmest people on the planet. As mentioned above, I have personally been the beneficiary of the most sincere hospitality and it was from native peoples. They are always smiling, always laughing. They work, albeit, most often in the false economy of their communities, but they work for their money. They contribute to their society. They are good people.
DMH, I don’t think that when many people refer to native people in a negative way, they are referring to all native people, rather those in that first broad category I mentioned. I think that most people are evolved enough to know that that group is not representative of all natives but unfortunately it is a large and highly visible group. I myself am guilty of referring to that first group of people in a negative way, not because they are native, but because of their behaviour. If it were white people behaving in that way, I would feel just as negative towards them (in fact I have run across a few.)
As for the larger political issues….they are a little more complicated. One thing I know for sure is that the current arrangement of the government simply throwing money at the problem and hoping it will go away is futile. The only people it benefits are the corrupt community officials whose pockets are lined by the desperate situations of their own people, and the politicians who create the illusion of concern so they can say to the many ignorant voters, “Look how much we care: x-billion dollars worth!” as they lift up the rug and sweep the real problems underneath.

xsbank · Post by **xsbank** » Wed Oct 24, 2007 6:25 pm

Good post, Shimmy. Well-reasoned and no nasty invective.

Dex · Post by **Dex** » Wed Oct 24, 2007 6:38 pm

Dex wrote:******, its good to see you took the page down. I hope you get a chance to rewrite it in a positive way. The principle is worthy. I wish you well with your employment today and hope you can respond here with good news. Good Luck!!

You have got to be kidding me!! Which mod ****** ed DMH's first name and why?

Post by **avcanada** » Wed Oct 24, 2007 7:35 pm

I placed the word censor.

I never received a request to censor this name, I just felt it was the right thing to do after I received a very nice letter of apology.

I want AvCanada to be a place to visit that is friendly for all. Racist posts or posts that could be considered inappropriate are not welcomed on AvCanada and never have been welcomed.

Very few posts ever truly cross the line of being inappropriate, but in the rare case that you come across one, please let myself, or one of the mods know so we can remove and review the topic.

Often we delete or split out the offensive post and then latter move the topic back.

Dex · Post by **Dex** » Wed Oct 24, 2007 10:50 pm

avcanada wrote:I placed the word censor.

I never received a request to censor this name, I just felt it was the right thing to do after I received a very nice letter of apology.

I can respect it is your prerogative, but may I suggest this was an emotional reaction to something so trivial as a persons first name. A first name would not identify "her" any more than her login name. Especially when you consider your censorship affects many posts on this thread, and others. BTW You forgot to place a "word sensor" on her middle and last name. See page 3

Driving Rain wrote:
****** Marie *********
Thank you ******. Do you have relatives in Kenora?

Dex · Post by **Dex** » Fri Oct 26, 2007 12:53 pm

LOL, at least we can keep the middle name!