Invertago wrote:They could have multiple review checks along the way rather then just one final exam at the end.

Don't Class 4's have to have three solo recommends and three flight test recommends to become Class 3 and no longer be under supervision? If they are not good recomends don't they come under further scrutiny? You still have to have a Class 2 or 1 around so there is experience available. And in the end flight schools are only teaching pilots to fly basic aircraft.

We won a world war with green pilots taught by green instructors (read Behind the Glory for some interesting instructing stories and follow up heroics). Sure it's not the best situation, but it was that or lose the war and it is that or exclude people who will no longer be able to afford flying.

I think for the most part the quality of flight instruction is fine, just the wages need to be boosted a bit. Many pilots will take the reward of flight intruction combined with being able to stay close to home if they can make a decent wage. But we are always willing to take less. I got out of flight instruction because I could not survive; even by doing maintenance on the side during the few free hours.

Im with you PIE.

I agree the wages have to go up, but you have to pass that cost on somewhere. Many flight schools make their profit not paying the instructors, so they have to up the dual rate if they are going to pay better. $180/hour dual on a 172 does not pay the bills if the instructor takes away $40 which is probably a reasonable hobbs time rate for a class IV to want to make a career out of it. Keep in mind the aircraft provides 90% of the income for the flight school and has to pay for the building, utilities, fuel, maintainence, insurance, goverment fees and the rest. Till instructors earn a decent living, it will remain just a step towards big iron and many instructors will treat it that way.

That's a bad business plan, no wonder there's so much complaint.

When I started my flying business I was happy for the aeroplanes to pay for themselves, and they did.
In two years of operation the Condors paid themselves off!
I never meant to make money from operating aeroplanes, but what I did make was residual value if you like.

What makes money is the services you offer in addition to the operation of the aircraft.

1. Maintenance. I made a lot of money out of maintenance.
2. Instruction. The instructor is not there to subsidise the aeroplane. The instructor is there to offer a service and that service includes almost as much ground time with a student as air time if the job is done properly.
The 50:50 split between the instructor and the school should cover most of the overheads.
3. Sales of things. All students and pilots need supplies. Even vending food and goodies can bring in income.

In my old business I had film work and photography as well...

I just estimated the amount of briefing times for a PPL. Done properly the amount of ground briefing time adds up to nearly 35 hours!
If the student does self study and passes the threshold knowledge test then this time can be more than halved.
We are required to do preflight and post flight briefings!
The student saves money, the 70+ hour flight time average in Canada is probably due to insufficient ground time.

I agree that maintenance should be part of the revenue stream for a flight school if they have their own shop, that is the ideal setup for sure, I'd like to see more places set that up, but I'm not an owner and my suggestions to management are never listened to which has cost them lots of money but in the end, that is their problem and I only plan on another few months with them anyhow. I'm only 1 more flight test away from instructing becoming my fun part time job. I want my income to be based on a more solid company. I love instructing, the students are great, there is a variety of aircraft and a variety of flying, but I want a more stable career to pay the bills. It would be a great part time job. Career instructing only really works when you're on a salary at a large school or college program etc.