Crash @ North Spirit Lake Ont (4 dead, 1 survivor)

[Brown Bear]

The lesson here is a simple one. These turkeys should be shut down before the company culture kills anybody else.

[Brown Bear]

Legal action.

http://winnipeg.ctvnews.ca/ontario-plan ... -1.1638814

Hey, that's great! Sure, the pilot's "estate" lost a son, but the passenger lost his cell-phone case and coat! Sue 'em!

I can't even imagine the type of bottom feeding, scum eating low life, money grabbing moron who would have the nerve/balls/gall, to even mention such frivolous items as a "loss" in a lawsuit like this! Makes me want to toss last week's lunch!
BUT. Let's force Keystone OUT of the passenger killing business!

[Mr. North]

And folks, this is why I stay on the ground when it's iffy...even if company is pressuring and the other pilots are scoffing. I'm thinking about what is going to happen to my family after they scrape me off the ground. All the investigators have to prove is that you did one thing outside of the margins. That company is going to throw that dead kid under the bus, you watch. Hope this is a lesson to you eager hotshots.

Couldn't have said it better myself. Keystone may very well be the worst operator in Canada but that doesn't let the PIC off the hook. No certified approach, no METAR, no TAF, just an ambiguous "who knows what's going on there" GFA. I don't know what the weather was like at Deer Lake (his final destination) but under those conditions I would have scrubbed the flight or at the very least skipped North Spirit altogether.

The pilot's decision to conduct an approach to an aerodrome not serviced by an instrument flight rules approach in adverse weather conditions...

The pilot's decision to continue the flight below area minimum altitude (AMA)...

Regardless of how the company influenced these decisions, he made them on his own. You'll find the courts will have a hard time laying blame on poor company culture when some basic rules were broken. And while I don't think it's morally right to go after the pilot's estate, he does have the legal right for litigation. That's just the world we live in. You young guys take note, your family could lose a lot more than just a loved one if you make a dumb mistake.

Keystone... I'm starting to think the more accidents they have the better they get at evading TC.

[Brown Bear]

On more or less the same subject (piss poor training and company culture) I'd NEVER fly Air France either.

[frozen solid]

Legal action.

http://winnipeg.ctvnews.ca/ontario-plan ... -1.1638814

Hey, that's great! Sure, the pilot's "estate" lost a son, but the passenger lost his cell-phone case and coat! Sue 'em!

I can't even imagine the type of bottom feeding, scum eating low life, money grabbing moron who would have the nerve/balls/gall, to even mention such frivolous items as a "loss" in a lawsuit like this! Makes me want to toss last week's lunch!
BUT. Let's force Keystone OUT of the passenger killing business!

I'm not able to tell if this is a sarcastic response or not, but my comment did anger one other person who sent me a private message, so I would like to clarify: I'm not defending the pilot or his actions. I just don't think there is any "estate" here to be sued. I think in this context an "estate" means the wealth amassed by a wrong-doer as a result of his wrong-doing that is being enjoyed by his descendants. In this case I do not believe the dead pilot's family are enjoying or benefitting from the wages of the pilot's wrong-doing, therefore I do not believe that they can be responsible for any of his liability. By all means, sue Keystone. Take them apart, sell the pieces and give the money to the victims. But the pilot's family in my opinion are blameless, in all likelihood already quite devastated, and should be left alone.

[CFR]

You and your "estate" are two separate entities. Your "estate" continues to exist after you die until it is settled. This pilots family is not being attacked, his estate is. There are many entities that will have claim against this pilots estate including Revenue Canada, mortgage companies, banks, etc. Frankly just dieing can wipe your family out financial if you do not have adequate insurance and/or have not left a will that lays out how you want things dispersed. The value in the "estate" does not go to the family until all claims are settled (clearly it is more complex than this but I'm only illustrating the point)

The fact is that when lawsuits are filed in cases like this everyone remotely involved gets sued. In the end the last hand on the controls is directly responsible for the death and injuries and has primary liability. It may seem distasteful, but ... Most real airlines jump to try and settle to avoid these types of suits before it gets to this stage.