Seneca grads to go direct entry Jazz & Mid East

[canpropjock]

Everybody,

It is a hot issue and yes it's true, I was in CYKZ not too long ago and that's all I heard. Now it's true, automation, does make the CRJ Safer, and yes a 200 hour guy can probably handle the normal day to day operation. However I have worked on CRJ's A320's A340's B767's for AC and when something goes wrong in those cockpits they really go wrong, the experience and good decision making that comes from years of flying crap has no substitute. We only need look to some of our asian operators, where in a lot of cases they fly highly automated aircraft into the ground. It is more common than we hear about ... do the research. Ofcourse this won't change Jazz's corporate hiring practices, for a lot of reasons mentioned on this thread alone (some very good points I might add) but it can change the way we think as hard working pilots. Do we, after years of sacrifice, flying crap, flying into gravel 2500 ft strips, at night! want to take a pay cut from a Turbine Command Job to eat KD with Ketchup in CYYZ to work for a flag carrier that doesn't respect the journey you've taken to get where you are? Maybe Yes Maybe No, I'm just saying think about it, there are other avenues, and sometimes way better avenues than Jazz or AC.

Cheers

[kurtis1981]

Why doesn't someone go public with this shit. Let the whole population know what Jazz is doing, hiring fresh commercial pilots to fly RJ's. Everyone would freak out, not fly Jazz anymore with these low timers. Maybe it would turn things around?? what do you think?

[JohnnyHotRocks]

What is the big deal? With proper training, a 200hr pilot will do just fine as an FO...as long as he is with an experienced captain...
Stop making such a fuss...as the pilot shortage worsens, this kind of thing will be standard, and maybe it will raise the quality of life and the salary of the experienced guys.

[wallypilot]

Unfortuantely that is not my problem, KWIM?
A for profit company should not have it's training subsidised by the gov. Either Jazz can fund them, or the students end up paying for it all, much like in the US.

Why not? All companies who require a university degree have training subsidized by the government. You want to be a Lawyer? Guess what? It's subsidized. Financial type? Subsidized. IT technical or management? yep, you guessed it...subsidized. Carpenter? yep. Plumber? yep. Artist? yep. Accountant? Pharmacist? Chemist? Engineer? The list goes on. And they are funded to the tune of 10's of thousands of $$ per year. And it doesn't matter whether the trade or skill is in demand or not. It is subsidized.

ps...i am in no way saying i support the government subsidies over there, ....just making a point.

[saucer_driver]

[quote]Why doesn't someone go public with this shit. Let the whole population know what Jazz is doing, hiring fresh commercial pilots to fly RJ's. Everyone would freak out, not fly Jazz anymore with these low timers. Maybe it would turn things around?? what do you think?[/quote]

Lots of other countries do this, its not new. I feel better on Jazz with seneca guy then i do on some asian ariline where all the pilots were trained this way...

[kurtis1981]

What is the big deal about 200hr pilots flying right seat??? Shit man, when you have thousands of other pilots that sacrificed years of there lives to build hours flying in the bush, flying shit airplanes just so they can get these kind of jobs that "Seneca" grads are getting fresh out of school. WTF. that is absolute shit, and anyone that thinks otherwise can kiss my a** what's so special about a seneca grad anyways? i flew with people that went to school there and i could fly circles around them. It's experience that counts, this is so stupid. Jazz can kiss my ass

[wallypilot]

Why doesn't someone go public with this shit. Let the whole population know what Jazz is doing, hiring fresh commercial pilots to fly RJ's. Everyone would freak out, not fly Jazz anymore with these low timers. Maybe it would turn things around?? what do you think?

Ummm....i don't think so, dude. It's been done in Europe safely for decades. With an experienced captain, there's no reason it wouldn't be safe. Besides, the salaries at Jazz are pretty hard to swallow for an experienced driver. The younger, less experienced drivers will be more willing to accept the lower wage, and probably stick around longer...like 5-10 years instead of making the jump to mainline ASAP.

It makes tonnes of sense from an operator's point of view. They have no obligation to adhere to this perceived heirarchical structure of canadian pilots. Do you also think that airbus should not lay off all those people, and that the european governments should bail them out, simply because, well, "those workers deserve to work there?" It's market economics, man, accept it.

Eventually, there will be such a shortage of pilots with real north/bush stick and rudder experience, that the larger airlines will be pushing and shoving to hire the guys with lots of command experience in dodgey situations. That's the way it is in europe. It's a blessing in disguise. Besides there are tonnes of other great companies to work for. Don't sweat it.

[motionsickness69]

WOW...That makes me feel for alot of people who have been eating s**t sandwiches in this industry ( and food from the northern store....but i guess the future right seaters of jazz won't know what that is) are being over looked.......Thought industry experience was of some value?....Forget it. It will never make sense. I have been fortunate and lucky so far in my career so I do exclude my self from this commentary but I really do feel you folks who are going to be overlooked in this new situation. Keep a stiff upper lip I guess. I just don't get it, but who the hell cares what I think i'm just a pilot.

[captaingomes]

Jazz is continuing to hire pilots with plenty of experience flying into gravel strips and eating KD. All they are doing supposedly is hiring 8 of these Seneca grads.. Other airlines talk about how in the future they may need to offer cadet programs like in Europe, so it makes complete sense for a company like Jazz to start with a small sample group so that when they are forced into this practice in the future, they are well prepared.

The industry is changing (as always), and those companies that are best prepared will deal with the changes better than the rest.