AC Pilots leaving to the US?

[co-joe]

...
We have lobby groups on the hill do we not? .. ALPA etc..

...

ALPA USA has been very vocal against allowing immigrant pilots. They always reiterate that there is no pilot shortage, only a pay shortage in the US.

[Jetlifer]

...
We have lobby groups on the hill do we not? .. ALPA etc..

...

ALPA USA has been very vocal against allowing immigrant pilots. They always reiterate that there is no pilot shortage, only a pay shortage in the US.

I would agree with the approach of ALPA on the financial aspect. However, the thing that’s missing in that argument would be opening it to a global market would drive wages up not down. Reason being, of the door was to open.. we’d all flock south of the boarder.

In response Canadian carriers would have to raise wages exponentially higher to attract talent back.

Within a few years wages could be higher in Canada.. which would then force a hike on wages in the states, and so on and so forth until the pilot market finds equilibrium.

The open market is a good thing.. what we have now is artificial market bubbles, and a rigged economic system.

We need to let the supply and demand curve run its course, and ALPA would still get those wages up.

[Dash.Trash]

...
We have lobby groups on the hill do we not? .. ALPA etc..

...

ALPA USA has been very vocal against allowing immigrant pilots. They always reiterate that there is no pilot shortage, only a pay shortage in the US.

ALPA International is not against Canadian pilots legally immigrating to work in the US. What they are against is visas that are tied to a specific employer and temporary foreign workers. They are against employer sponsored visas because the company can threaten to pull pilots visas if they vote a certain way, or can cause pilots to make unsafe decisions out of fear of having their visa pulled.

The US could absorb every Canadian ATPL-rated pilot and it would barely make a dent in the shortage of crews they need over the next decade.

And before you ask for a source, it’s straight from the ALPA International Presidents mouth at one of the merger roadshows.

[Ash Ketchum]

I highly caution anyone wanting to go through the NIW route. Lawyers will take your money for the pipe dream of being able to help get you a visa. Your best bet is through family immigration for the green card. Not to mention, should there be a flip to a republican president, house and senate in 2024, the US is on course to really tighten the belt on immigration.

A lot of talk about the NIW, but not the best results. but, if you have 50+K us to throw at it, go for it.

I highly caution anyone wanting information to trust an anonymous post from a Cessna 172 Relief Pilot

I would contact directly either:

https://agimmigration.law/.well-known/c ... ur-team%2F

Or

https://harveylawcorporation.com/eb-2-niw-program/

Both have a 90 plus percentage approval rate and it is NOT even close to $50k. Try 20% of that...

It's happening and pilots are getting approved. These lawyers are overloaded with pilots trying to escape. That is one thing, be patient because with so many clients you have to wait your turn...

The thing is they want minimum 5k hours and 10 years total pilot work experience for those two law firms which I guess is why the approval rate is so high. I think that many EB-2 NIW hopeful pilots in Canada have less than that. I know for myself personally, I will probably be close to the left seat at AC by the time I reach that milestone and would be less motivated to get the ball rolling at that point than I am now.

[flyingfool]

I highly caution anyone wanting to go through the NIW route. Lawyers will take your money for the pipe dream of being able to help get you a visa. Your best bet is through family immigration for the green card. Not to mention, should there be a flip to a republican president, house and senate in 2024, the US is on course to really tighten the belt on immigration.

A lot of talk about the NIW, but not the best results. but, if you have 50+K us to throw at it, go for it.

I highly caution anyone wanting information to trust an anonymous post from a Cessna 172 Relief Pilot

I would contact directly either:

https://agimmigration.law/.well-known/c ... ur-team%2F

Or

https://harveylawcorporation.com/eb-2-niw-program/

Both have a 90 plus percentage approval rate and it is NOT even close to $50k. Try 20% of that...

It's happening and pilots are getting approved. These lawyers are overloaded with pilots trying to escape. That is one thing, be patient because with so many clients you have to wait your turn...

The thing is they want minimum 5k hours and 10 years total pilot work experience for those two law firms which I guess is why the approval rate is so high. I think that many EB-2 NIW hopeful pilots in Canada have less than that. I know for myself personally, I will probably be close to the left seat at AC by the time I reach that milestone and would be less motivated to get the ball rolling at that point than I am now.

Of course they want the experience

Any profession does

These are the guys that will be the trainers, line indoc, checkers, etc

A critical piece to any airline

And why it will be catastrophic to the Canadian airline industry. Brain drain is not good

Hopefully Canadian airlines realize this before it is too late and start paying North American rates

[cdnavater]

...
We have lobby groups on the hill do we not? .. ALPA etc..

...

ALPA USA has been very vocal against allowing immigrant pilots. They always reiterate that there is no pilot shortage, only a pay shortage in the US.

I would agree with the approach of ALPA on the financial aspect. However, the thing that’s missing in that argument would be opening it to a global market would drive wages up not down. Reason being, of the door was to open.. we’d all flock south of the boarder.

In response Canadian carriers would have to raise wages exponentially higher to attract talent back.

Within a few years wages could be higher in Canada.. which would then force a hike on wages in the states, and so on and so forth until the pilot market finds equilibrium.

The open market is a good thing.. what we have now is artificial market bubbles, and a rigged economic system.

We need to let the supply and demand curve run its course, and ALPA would still get those wages up.

You’re crazy if you think a Canadian pilot would come back once the wages go back up here, once you get used to paying way less tax, there’s no going back!
With the spending the liberals just announced, someone will have to pay for that, taxes will only increase in Canada going forward, how much would the wages need to go up to equal the take home!

[Jetlifer]

ALPA USA has been very vocal against allowing immigrant pilots. They always reiterate that there is no pilot shortage, only a pay shortage in the US.

I would agree with the approach of ALPA on the financial aspect. However, the thing that’s missing in that argument would be opening it to a global market would drive wages up not down. Reason being, of the door was to open.. we’d all flock south of the boarder.

In response Canadian carriers would have to raise wages exponentially higher to attract talent back.

Within a few years wages could be higher in Canada.. which would then force a hike on wages in the states, and so on and so forth until the pilot market finds equilibrium.

The open market is a good thing.. what we have now is artificial market bubbles, and a rigged economic system.

We need to let the supply and demand curve run its course, and ALPA would still get those wages up.

You’re crazy if you think a Canadian pilot would come back once the wages go back up here, once you get used to paying way less tax, there’s no going back!
With the spending the liberals just announced, someone will have to pay for that, taxes will only increase in Canada going forward, how much would the wages need to go up to equal the take home!

I don’t know how to respond to this, except to say that’s how supply and demand works?

Look at it this way, how’s the current approach working out for Canadian aviation? Are we making those big bucks south of the border?

Maybe instead of saying I’m crazy following a basic economic principle, we open our minds up to what could be.

Personally I feel the same about the open skies regulations. Everyone is so afraid to lose Canadian aviation should we open this up with the United States. Well, either they will step up or be illuminated, I suspect the latter. What will be left is a stronger more robust industry that pays us.. you, better.

[cdnavater]

I would agree with the approach of ALPA on the financial aspect. However, the thing that’s missing in that argument would be opening it to a global market would drive wages up not down. Reason being, of the door was to open.. we’d all flock south of the boarder.

In response Canadian carriers would have to raise wages exponentially higher to attract talent back.

Within a few years wages could be higher in Canada.. which would then force a hike on wages in the states, and so on and so forth until the pilot market finds equilibrium.

The open market is a good thing.. what we have now is artificial market bubbles, and a rigged economic system.

We need to let the supply and demand curve run its course, and ALPA would still get those wages up.

You’re crazy if you think a Canadian pilot would come back once the wages go back up here, once you get used to paying way less tax, there’s no going back!
With the spending the liberals just announced, someone will have to pay for that, taxes will only increase in Canada going forward, how much would the wages need to go up to equal the take home!

I don’t know how to respond to this, except to say that’s how supply and demand works?

Look at it this way, how’s the current approach working out for Canadian aviation? Are we making those big bucks south of the border?

Maybe instead of saying I’m crazy following a basic economic principle, we open our minds up to what could be.

Personally I feel the same about the open skies regulations. Everyone is so afraid to lose Canadian aviation should we open this up with the United States. Well, either they will step up or be illuminated, I suspect the latter. What will be left is a stronger more robust industry that pays us.. you, better.

Sorry, I was only disagreeing with the part where a Canadian who gains the right to live and work in the US is not coming back to Canada, it would have to be an equivalent wages where the take home is the same, that’s about all the would entice me. Until I retire, then I come home for the health care I’ve prepaid for with my 70+ grand a year in taxes

[JoeyBarton]

I'd say it's the first time we are seeing over 10 resignations in a 3 month timeframe in the bottom half of the seniority list. Things are slowly moving but it is moving for sure. There's no denial that some ac pilots are moving to the US.

[sportingrifle]

At least 4 were not “resignations.” Another 4 did leave for the US.

[JoeyBarton]

You mean were shown the door?

[lownslow]

At least 4 were not “resignations.”

Would that list ever show dismissals or does it always say resigned?

[Freshredmeat]

There were a few, including one from my PIT, that went back to the military

Only in Canada would an global airline pilot return to the military

What a proud legacy there is here

[172ReliefPilot]

I highly caution anyone wanting to go through the NIW route. Lawyers will take your money for the pipe dream of being able to help get you a visa. Your best bet is through family immigration for the green card. Not to mention, should there be a flip to a republican president, house and senate in 2024, the US is on course to really tighten the belt on immigration.

A lot of talk about the NIW, but not the best results. but, if you have 50+K us to throw at it, go for it.

I highly caution anyone wanting information to trust an anonymous post from a Cessna 172 Relief Pilot

I would contact directly either:

https://agimmigration.law/.well-known/c ... ur-team%2F

Or

https://harveylawcorporation.com/eb-2-niw-program/

Both have a 90 plus percentage approval rate and it is NOT even close to $50k. Try 20% of that...

It's happening and pilots are getting approved. These lawyers are overloaded with pilots trying to escape. That is one thing, be patient because with so many clients you have to wait your turn...

Ah so have you gone through the process, have had your interview at the consulate and given an approval?

Its a long road, often doesnt follow timelines (from experience), can be random and brutally unfair in some cases.

Im sure any lawyer would love to tell you their success rate so you sign the dotted line and pay their retainer fee in case you need to file a lawsuit against the USCIS when they deny your petition. Even if pilots are getting through with the NIW, what are the qualifications? one of the law firms you cited, as well as the USICS, states

"The National Interest Waiver dispenses with the typical requirement for a job offer and a process to demonstrate unavailable American workers for the position."

As mentioned before, should there be a turn of the tides politically in the next election in the US, immigration is gonna slam on the brakes. Trump had previously put in restrictions on employment based GC. wouldnt expect anything different should he or any red candidate hold office.

I dont blame anyone for trying this process, but there are going to be many that are turned down after investing thousands. Maybe it was an exaggeration to estimate $50k, but the filing fee, immigrant fee and medical cost $1500 USD alone.

Good luck!

[CaliforniaDreamin]

[172ReliefPilot]

I highly caution anyone wanting information to trust an anonymous post from a Cessna 172 Relief Pilot

I would contact directly either:

https://agimmigration.law/.well-known/c ... ur-team%2F

Or

https://harveylawcorporation.com/eb-2-niw-program/

Both have a 90 plus percentage approval rate and it is NOT even close to $50k. Try 20% of that...

It's happening and pilots are getting approved. These lawyers are overloaded with pilots trying to escape. That is one thing, be patient because with so many clients you have to wait your turn...

Ah so have you gone through the process, have had your interview at the consulate and given an approval?

Its a long road, often doesnt follow timelines (from experience), can be random and brutally unfair in some cases.

Im sure any lawyer would love to tell you their success rate so you sign the dotted line and pay their retainer fee in case you need to file a lawsuit against the USCIS when they deny your petition. Even if pilots are getting through with the NIW, what are the qualifications? one of the law firms you cited, as well as the USICS, states

"The National Interest Waiver dispenses with the typical requirement for a job offer and a process to demonstrate unavailable American workers for the position."

As mentioned before, should there be a turn of the tides politically in the next election in the US, immigration is gonna slam on the brakes. Trump had previously put in restrictions on employment based GC. wouldnt expect anything different should he or any red candidate hold office.

I dont blame anyone for trying this process, but there are going to be many that are turned down after investing thousands. Maybe it was an exaggeration to estimate $50k but the filing fee, immigrant fee and medical cost $1500 USD alone.

Good luck!

So you admit you were giving misinformation

Which is entirely my point. Ask the lawyers for the data

Spoiler Alert: it's a very high percentage for approvals

lol whats misinformation?????

I never denied that there are likely successful candidates that have gone the NIW route. I think its wise for those that are able to take advantage of this route. I am just trying to avoid this cloud of delusion that ANYONE can just apply for the exception of an NIW and expect an approval, especially after hiring a lawyer that would HAPPILY take your money for the filing fees, consultation and retainer to represent you in court.

Once again, have YOU applied under this stream and received a visa from the US consulate???

You are much better off marrying a US citizen, should you be single, or getting that experience as a 787 LCA.

[CaliforniaDreamin]

[newcomer]

I highly caution anyone wanting information to trust an anonymous post from a Cessna 172 Relief Pilot

I would contact directly either:

https://agimmigration.law/.well-known/c ... ur-team%2F

Or

https://harveylawcorporation.com/eb-2-niw-program/

Both have a 90 plus percentage approval rate and it is NOT even close to $50k. Try 20% of that...

It's happening and pilots are getting approved. These lawyers are overloaded with pilots trying to escape. That is one thing, be patient because with so many clients you have to wait your turn...

Ah so have you gone through the process, have had your interview at the consulate and given an approval?

Its a long road, often doesnt follow timelines (from experience), can be random and brutally unfair in some cases.

Im sure any lawyer would love to tell you their success rate so you sign the dotted line and pay their retainer fee in case you need to file a lawsuit against the USCIS when they deny your petition. Even if pilots are getting through with the NIW, what are the qualifications? one of the law firms you cited, as well as the USICS, states

"The National Interest Waiver dispenses with the typical requirement for a job offer and a process to demonstrate unavailable American workers for the position."

As mentioned before, should there be a turn of the tides politically in the next election in the US, immigration is gonna slam on the brakes. Trump had previously put in restrictions on employment based GC. wouldnt expect anything different should he or any red candidate hold office.

I dont blame anyone for trying this process, but there are going to be many that are turned down after investing thousands. Maybe it was an exaggeration to estimate $50k but the filing fee, immigrant fee and medical cost $1500 USD alone.

Good luck!

So you admit you were giving misinformation

Which is entirely my point. Ask the lawyers for the data

Spoiler Alert: it's a very high percentage for approvals

I 've just been through the process with a lawyer, spent around 10K usd.
My profile: 9000h tt, 3000h pic on 737 and 320, 17 years in the industry.
4 ATPLs (FAA, Canadian, european, emirati). Worldwide experience, ETOPS, Cat C airports, high altitude airports,...
Letters of recommendation from test pilots, directors of flight ops, chief pilots, instructors/examiners, even a board member of a reputed airline. I'm also a member of a reputed association. I thought I had a pretty good shot.
Answer from the USCIS: they sent me an RFE (request for further evidence). Basically not a no yet, but they said that I failed to demonstrate that I am exceptional, and that a pilot shortage is not enough to grant me the EB2 NIW because it's not the purpose of this visa. They want more evidence that giving me a work visa will benefit the US. They want evidence of contributions that I made to the industry. I cannot give them more than what I already gave them, so I'm giving up. I've got a pretty good job back home now anyway.
It might have been different if I had been an instructor/examiner, or maybe I was just unlucky to be evaluated by a picky person...

[CaptDukeNukem]

Ah so have you gone through the process, have had your interview at the consulate and given an approval?

Its a long road, often doesnt follow timelines (from experience), can be random and brutally unfair in some cases.

Im sure any lawyer would love to tell you their success rate so you sign the dotted line and pay their retainer fee in case you need to file a lawsuit against the USCIS when they deny your petition. Even if pilots are getting through with the NIW, what are the qualifications? one of the law firms you cited, as well as the USICS, states

"The National Interest Waiver dispenses with the typical requirement for a job offer and a process to demonstrate unavailable American workers for the position."

As mentioned before, should there be a turn of the tides politically in the next election in the US, immigration is gonna slam on the brakes. Trump had previously put in restrictions on employment based GC. wouldnt expect anything different should he or any red candidate hold office.

I dont blame anyone for trying this process, but there are going to be many that are turned down after investing thousands. Maybe it was an exaggeration to estimate $50k but the filing fee, immigrant fee and medical cost $1500 USD alone.

Good luck!

So you admit you were giving misinformation

Which is entirely my point. Ask the lawyers for the data

Spoiler Alert: it's a very high percentage for approvals

I 've just been through the process with a lawyer, spent around 10K usd.
My profile: 9000h tt, 3000h pic on 737 and 320, 17 years in the industry.
4 ATPLs (FAA, Canadian, european, emirati). Worldwide experience, ETOPS, Cat C airports, high altitude airports,...
Letters of recommendation from test pilots, directors of flight ops, chief pilots, instructors/examiners, even a board member of a reputed airline. I'm also a member of a reputed association. I thought I had a pretty good shot.
Answer from the USCIS: they sent me an RFE (request for further evidence). Basically not a no yet, but they said that I failed to demonstrate that I am exceptional, and that a pilot shortage is not enough to grant me the EB2 NIW because it's not the purpose of this visa. They want more evidence that giving me a work visa will benefit the US. They want evidence of contributions that I made to the industry. I cannot give them more than what I already gave them, so I'm giving up. I've got a pretty good job back home now anyway.
It might have been different if I had been an instructor/examiner, or maybe I was just unlucky to be evaluated by a picky person...

Damn dude, I know a guy from Italy with 7000TT , some jet PIC, A350 driver that got in. You may have drawn the short straw with the paper pusher.

[Blueontop]

Ah so have you gone through the process, have had your interview at the consulate and given an approval?

Its a long road, often doesnt follow timelines (from experience), can be random and brutally unfair in some cases.

Im sure any lawyer would love to tell you their success rate so you sign the dotted line and pay their retainer fee in case you need to file a lawsuit against the USCIS when they deny your petition. Even if pilots are getting through with the NIW, what are the qualifications? one of the law firms you cited, as well as the USICS, states

"The National Interest Waiver dispenses with the typical requirement for a job offer and a process to demonstrate unavailable American workers for the position."

As mentioned before, should there be a turn of the tides politically in the next election in the US, immigration is gonna slam on the brakes. Trump had previously put in restrictions on employment based GC. wouldnt expect anything different should he or any red candidate hold office.

I dont blame anyone for trying this process, but there are going to be many that are turned down after investing thousands. Maybe it was an exaggeration to estimate $50k but the filing fee, immigrant fee and medical cost $1500 USD alone.

Good luck!

So you admit you were giving misinformation

Which is entirely my point. Ask the lawyers for the data

Spoiler Alert: it's a very high percentage for approvals

I 've just been through the process with a lawyer, spent around 10K usd.
My profile: 9000h tt, 3000h pic on 737 and 320, 17 years in the industry.
4 ATPLs (FAA, Canadian, european, emirati). Worldwide experience, ETOPS, Cat C airports, high altitude airports,...
Letters of recommendation from test pilots, directors of flight ops, chief pilots, instructors/examiners, even a board member of a reputed airline. I'm also a member of a reputed association. I thought I had a pretty good shot.
Answer from the USCIS: they sent me an RFE (request for further evidence). Basically not a no yet, but they said that I failed to demonstrate that I am exceptional, and that a pilot shortage is not enough to grant me the EB2 NIW because it's not the purpose of this visa. They want more evidence that giving me a work visa will benefit the US. They want evidence of contributions that I made to the industry. I cannot give them more than what I already gave them, so I'm giving up. I've got a pretty good job back home now anyway.
It might have been different if I had been an instructor/examiner, or maybe I was just unlucky to be evaluated by a picky person...

Damn. Does seem like you got the one fighting with his wife that day. Why not just withdraw your application and resubmit. Compared to what you’ve already spent it would a drop in the bucket.

[newcomer]

I was thinking about it, maybe it depends which center processes it? My lawyer filed it in Texas...
But like I said, I've just started a new job at one of the best airlines in the world (apart from the US ones of course), and I don't want to spend another dollar on this. It wasn't meant to be that's all. I will not be as rich as I could have been, but I'm sure my lifestyle will be much better.

[CaptDukeNukem]

I was thinking about it, maybe it depends which center processes it? My lawyer filed it in Texas...
But like I said, I've just started a new job at one of the best airlines in the world (apart from the US ones of course), and I don't want to spend another dollar on this. It wasn't meant to be that's all. I will not be as rich as I could have been, but I'm sure my lifestyle will be much better.

Fair enough. I respect your decision.

[canadian_aviator_4]

I was thinking about it, maybe it depends which center processes it? My lawyer filed it in Texas...
But like I said, I've just started a new job at one of the best airlines in the world (apart from the US ones of course), and I don't want to spend another dollar on this. It wasn't meant to be that's all. I will not be as rich as I could have been, but I'm sure my lifestyle will be much better.

Which airline?

[newcomer]

A European legacy

[highspeed]

That's very unfortunate for you.
I'm in almost the same situation. 11k total and 8000pic 737 TRI in MCT.
Just submitted my application and hoping I don't get screwed over like you did.

My lawyer says just withdraw and resubmit if it doesn't work out. I hope it doesn't come to that.

Good luck with your new gig.