How do I stop myself from beating on a 152?

[LeadPedals]

I’m 11 hours into my PPL (at the time of posting–– I try to fly 2x a week between classes) and my instructor and I have noticed, especially doing circuits, that I have a consistent problem of being way too hard on the poor 152. I fly like I drive–– I’m used to being pretty aggressive. I don’t have any anxiety about flying; I actually feel calmer than usual up there. I’m comfortable with my instructor. I understand all the procedures that I’m supposed to be doing. It’s not like I’m rushing to do something that I forgot to do. My instructor has tried to help me feel the right pressures for the pedals, and has made me practice moving the throttle smoothly, and gets after me for trimming like I’m spinning the Wheel of Fortune, but for some reason my feet and hands just have too much force no matter how much I concentrate on being gentle. I want them to do one thing, but then they do it way too strongly. I seem to be getting more violent the more I practice! I just can’t tone myself down. I’ve always had this problem driving a car, too, and slamming every door I ever close, it’s not just an airplane thing. My instructor says that I am doing well in general, but tells me like 5 times per lesson to stop taking my anger out on the innocent plane...

Not sure if these could be contributing factors:
- My first (informal) lessons, not counted in hours above, were in a Hawk XP on floats back in the summer. I do realize the 152 on wheels is different, but my hands/feet haven’t yet??
- I’m a 5’6” girl so I sit on a cushion to see where I’m going–– not sure if posture could be a problem
- I’m finishing university full-time in a program I’m sick of (not related to aviation) and usually I feel like throwing textbooks at people, so maybe I really am just taking my anger out on the plane
- I’m an intense, serious person in general, not lacking much confidence, I just go for it as long as it’s safe and reasonable (but I definitely listen to my instructor when he corrects me because I know I’m not doing things right)
- I keep my feet on the pedals the whole time in the circuit

Is learning how to be gentle on the controls something that you develop unconsciously over time, or are some people always a bit rough?

Is it too early in training to be worried about this? I’m asking this early on in the PPL because I know habits don’t go away easily and it’s something that I’ve done every lesson despite my instructor’s best advice.

Is there anything that can help with this alongside practice, practice, practice? (for example, my instructor is now making me wear shoes with thin soles so I can feel the pedals well–– but I was doing that in most of my previous lessons and it didn’t help me!)

Thanks

[PilotDAR]

A few thoughts....

Ask to have a look at the parts catalog, and the Cessna price list. Once you see how much those parts you're holding cost, you might rethink being forceful on them. I once had to assist with the repair of C-182 rudder pedal attachments in the floor, as the pilots had been so forceful on the pedals, they were torn out of the floor entirely - for the second time!

The air is not firm, nor need your control inputs to move the plane in the air.

If patience and temper are an underlying problem, get it under control now, 'cause the frustrations in flying will grow as you learn more, and have more freedom to fly. Being weathered out or in, broken aircraft, fussy airport security, and circuit traffic all require lots of patience - get use to it!

Best of luck!

[PropToFeather]

One thing that my first instructor did to help me get my over-corrections under control was to tell me to put an input in and then hold it for a second or two. That, for me, really helped hammer home that you didn't really need large, aggressive movements to get the plane to do what you want (unless, of course, you're doing something that actually requires them!)

Another thing could be that you're sitting either too close, or too far from the controls, which is then making your current issues worse.

As to fixing this... for some people it just clicks after a while (it did for me). A classmate of mine needed an extra flight where him and his instructor just went to the practice area and hammered that kind of aggressiveness out of him. Also, there was a good thread a month or so ago - that you touched on - about keeping your entire foot on the pedal (so, no part of the foot being on the floor). Finally, there's always the option of putting in an aggressive input, and then holding it for a few seconds as a way of showing yourself what NOT to do - don't do this on short final! Actually, now that you mention it, you might need to work on your trimming - until I figured out how it affected the flight, I would always have to have some sort of input, which would then lead to over- and under-correcting all the time.

Both of my PPL instructors really hammered into me that your control movements should be smooth but decisive. It didn't take until about 2/3rds through, but, once it did, my flying improved substantially, and I could then focus on more of the near future of "what is the plane going to do and what do I actually want to happen", as opposed to the immediate "fighting the plane to do something right now".

PilotDAR has it right - if your regular temper is one of anger or frustration, you need to work on that ASAP. If you think fighting with the plane is bad... well, PilotDAR covered most of the other things that you'll have to fight throughout training!

[photofly]

Put in the front of your mind that you're there to give your passengers a smooth flight. It's *really* uncomfortable for everyone else in the aircraft if the pilot is rough. Get your instructor to demonstrate it to you.

That goes for driving too, by the way.

[cgzro]

Or take up aerobatics

[jschnurr]

On my first lesson, my instructor said that if you can't fly only using your thumb and index finger of one hand on the control column... then you're doing it wrong. If you need a death-grip on the controls, then either you're not trimmed, or you're not relaxed enough, or you're flying too aggressively.

[LeadPedals]

Thanks everyone. I'll trying changing up my posture a bit and being more cautious with trim next lesson. Perhaps some meditation would be good as well...

[ahramin]

Maybe some Yoga classes?

[PilotDAR]

I Have great faith that CGZRO is being humorous when he suggests aerobatics. That training is excellent in helping you to refine your technique, but it is not an outlet for excessive rough flight control inputs.

Consider this: Both the air through which you fly, and the aircraft you fly, have their own natural inertia and momentum. Those are the result of natural physics, and you cannot change that. You either find the way to fly in harmony with those forces, or you fight the plane against them with excessive or forceful control inputs - but you will never win.

You know that you can stall a plane, you can also stall a flight control momentarily. Moving the control further or faster than it can have streamline affect on the air creates lots of drag, and less than desired effect on the motion of the aircraft. Most any aircraft you will fly for the next while can be flown with thumb and forefinger effort only, in all but the most turbulent conditions. If you are needing more than that for normal flying, up to entry to the flare, you may consider refining your technique more.

You will master being in harmony with the plane, or it will continue to master you - you will not change the way the plane reacts to being flown with any amount of will.

[tired of the ground]

It's somewhat easy to keep yourself from exerting too much pressure on the airplane. Connect yourself to it in a way that makes it impossible.

Only one hand on the control column, EVER. Even when you are holding it, no palm, just thumb and two fingers on the one side.

On the throttle, grab it with one thumb and one finger and only on the side. You can't exert enough force if you are only holding the side of the throttle with a thumb and a finger.

Rudder pedals are a little more difficult but require more of the same. You should have your feet on the at all times but only the balls of your foot. Keep from ever being flat footed on them.

Finally a little thought about what you are trying to achieve is required. In the air, in normal flight, nothing requires quick input. Even though 5 degrees of bank may seem like a lot when you're supposed to be straight and level, it isn't. Pretend you're not flying a straight line, think of it more like trying to herd a toddler along a straight line. You don't smack him every time walks a little off the line, as long as he's generally going in the right direction, gentle pressure one way or the other (control inputs) will have the desired effect. Once you figure out how much control input is required to get your intended results you won't be flying like a drunk toddler (even though that is totally fine and even expected in the beginning) you'll be smooth and flying straight.

[DanWEC]

While you should only be lightly holding the yoke with one set of fingertips most of the time anyways, here's an exercise you can try- it's helped some, doesn't do anything for others.

Hold the yoke (left hand obviously) in the normal way, a couple of fingertips on the back (away from you), and your thumb resting on the front (facing you). Normal. Then move your middle finger so it's also on the front along with your thumb, and the yoke is now making contact with the outside of the knuckle of your middle finger. The idea here is that it's a little awkward and uncomfortable to exert much pressure on the yoke since it's basically between your fingers. Obviously don't fly like this all the time, but just as an exercise to feel how light the forces need to be, even in the circuit.

Also, make sure you are relaxed and sitting in the seat- not tensed up and pressing on the pedals, etc. Consciously relax your body into the seat. Makes it easier to feel what your inputs are doing.

Keep the scan of the T+B coord going.

Nothing requires instant correction. The air is fluid and the little bugsmasher has to ride with the waves so to speak, to a certain extent.

A 152 is super light on the controls, it's actually a pretty nice plane to fly!

[crazyaviator]

Become passionate with him/her ! He/She needs to be pampered, caressed, loved and sometimes treated with a firm but thoughtful hand! Treat him/her well and that thoroughbred horse shall treat you well in return
I have flown with male and female EXPERIENCED pilots who treat the plane like its a load of dirty laundry !! I mean REALLY, would you expect your partner to appreciate such rough moves in bed?
Becoming one with that tamed beast will pay in spades throughout your life,,,and just remember, if your "better half" is in a cave/ tantrum/ no talk fit, you can ALWAYS mosy on up to your steed and massage those cumulus clouds with glee !!

[NunavutPA-12]

Whether you're learning to fly, drive a car, ski (I could go on and on), you will reach a plateau in your learning. Then you will begin to FEEL the airplane and your brain will start to tell your feet and hands exactly what to do.

Some flight instructors have forgotten that at one time they also could not FEEL what the airplane was doing.

We are all wired a bit different, but I would say that at 11 hours you've probably not gotten off that plateau yet. It will come!

[Rookie50]

I endorse the thumb and 2 fingers. Even in heavier singles, in cruise it's all you need in smooth air.

Think how much steering inputs you need to correct your driving at 140 (so I've heard, lol) on the highway. Not much. The airplane is going faster than that, and needs very little.

[Meddler]

Ever try driving on ice? If you are rough or aggressive doing that you will be way slower and more out of control than someone who drives slowly and smoothly, never breaking traction. Same thing in a plane.
I wouldn't worry too much. It's early. Easier to learn to be smooth later than to learn not to let the airplane fly you later.
A few vomiting passengers will also encourage you to be smooth.

Lastly, be careful about the 2 finger technique. Good idea most of the time, but not in the flare.

[Bede]

A couple things:
1) You have 11 hours. I really don't think you have much to worry about.
2) Don't move the controls, add pressure.
3) A friend of mine once had a student with a similar problem. The student was a urologist. He told the student to handle the airplane like he handles the man parts at work. Problem solved.

[cgzro]

I Have great faith that CGZRO is being humorous when he suggests aerobatics. That training is excellent in helping you to refine your technique, but it is not an outlet for excessive rough flight control inputs.

Yes But more seriously balancing the plane on the edge of a stall for a bit could be helpful. Likewise flying the length of the runway at a few feet could be useful too, gives better feedback to control inputs.

[PilotDAR]

balancing the plane on the edge of a stall for a bit could be helpful. Likewise flying the length of the runway at a few feet could be useful too, gives better feedback to control inputs.

Absolutely yes.

[cgzro]

Falling leaf is great exercise to learn gentle rudder use and also avoid aileron inputs lest they reverse on you at large deflections at stall speeds.

[Rookie50]

Falling leaf is great exercise to learn gentle rudder use and also avoid aileron inputs lest they reverse on you at large deflections at stall speeds.

K just opened the door there on training. Forgive the thread drift.

I highly doubt any FTU is going to allow a falling leaf excercise, just like in many cases low wind and crosswind limits are enforced, and no IFR training in Imc.

I get why -- they don't trust their own instructors can get back in safely -- I just continue to think later stage PPL's and CPL's would benefit from more "advanced" training than strictly required to pass the rating, like crosswinds to the plane's capability. Especially those of us not going the commercial route, because we don't get the FO mentoring experience.

Would you believe, on my own I fairly recently did some practice, and did my first ILS to actual minimums (lower than they were forecast to be, actually) -- and been rated over 4 years. Now I know what 200 -250 and 1/ 1/4 is like. Can't simulate that, and seeing the approach lights only and no runway at the same instant.

Gives me new respect for approach lighting available at the chosen runway.......I've hardly thought about that!

Never came remotely close to actual minimums in training, which would have been valuable. Similiar story with crosswinds, I gradually built experience to higher levels on my own.

Just thoughts this fine morning -- again if too much thread drift I'll move it ---

[photofly]

I highly doubt any FTU is going to allow a falling leaf excercise,

Oh for goodness sakes. You really are talking out of your ass.

[Rookie50]

I highly doubt any FTU is going to allow a falling leaf excercise,

Oh for goodness sakes. You really are talking out of your ass.

Hmmmm ---

Like premier Wynne. Apparently no critique allowed.

Analysing on these pages is not FTU bashing -- btw.

Feelings.......

[tipsails]

I recall doing "falling leaf" in my CPL training. It wasn't really a briefed thing or something we planned, I just remember one day while doing stalls my instructor showed me and we did a few. It was pretty neat, and quite easy in a Cessna with the stall characteristics.

[cgzro]

I would hope most CFIs could safely do it. Its really just a continuous stall so no big deal really.
If you are an instructor and worried about something useful like a falling leaf go find somebody to show you and pass it on. Superb way to learn better control of your plane. Start at slow idle then add more and more power to add difficulty. Add flaps for fun. Learn to turn as you stall. All easy and safe and superb excercises and you wont be ham fisted after that.

But 11hrs is probably a bit early:)

[photofly]

I highly doubt any FTU is going to allow a falling leaf excercise,

Oh for goodness sakes. You really are talking out of your ass.

Hmmmm ---

Like premier Wynne. Apparently no critique allowed.

Analysing on these pages is not FTU bashing -- btw.

Feelings.......

Your (incorrect) doubts about what FTUs allow or don't allow are not a critique or analysis of anything. They're just ignorant guesses drawn from your own prejudices which you present as "fact".