looking for some advice about right at work

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freemat
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looking for some advice about right at work

Post by freemat »

Hello everyone,

I have just been hired by a helicopter company. Now they want me to sign a 3 years contract, because they will give me mountain training and other that costs around 30 000$. If I leave before the end of the agreement I will have to reimburse...Sounds fair. But they can also fired me without warning, I ll have to reimburse too... I would like to do some modification to it. I don t feel so comfortable with it. So I would like to show it to a lawyer or someone who knows about right at work and specifically in aviation (french speaking will be great!). I am not sure how good it is for me, I don t want get in trouble...

Thanks
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xsbank
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Re: looking for some advice about right at work

Post by xsbank »

Three years is a lot... Definitely talk to a lawyer. I would (and have done) two.

By the way, congrats on the new job!
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JBI
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Re: looking for some advice about right at work

Post by JBI »

Hi,

I unfortunately can't act for you directly as I'm currently non-practising, don't practice in Quebec (assuming this is the case based on the french language requirement) and also do not speak french well enough to review contracts. However, good for you for reviewing the contract and not simply signing the document without thinking about the consequences.

The following is not legal advice, just general information. It should also be noted that the Quebec Civil Code may have very different regulations with respect to contracts than the common law in the rest of the provinces. I'm afraid I do not have any specific recommendations for lawyers in Quebec, but I do know that Langlois Lawyers does both transportation/aviation work and labour/employment law. Perhaps give them a call and if they're not able to act for you they may be able to recommend someone who can.

Putting aside the issue of enforceability in Quebec civil code, you're now at a spot where essentially you're negotiating with the company. i.e. how badly you need the job vs. how much they want you instead of someone else. In my personal situation, I would ask for a change in both the length of the term (3 years seems very long) and also a change to the clause about dismissal without notice and a requirement to pay back the bond. In my personal situation, I would rather not have a job than be in a situation where a company dismisses me without notice and I then have agreed to pay them a pro-rated share of $30,000 even after they fired me. Your situation may be different depending on how badly you need this job - I'm not sure what you're negotiating power is.

It doesn't hurt to ask for modifications. They may say no. Then it's up to you to decide if you're willing to enter the employment on those terms.

The article I wrote in Skies provides some additional considerations http://skiesmag.com/news/article/Breaki ... -contracts
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freemat
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Re: looking for some advice about right at work

Post by freemat »

Hi JBI,

Thanks for your answer. In fact the company is based in British columbia. Maybe you know better the laws in this province... My contract is written in english. I asked someone who speak french because I have hard time to understand some specific terms used in the contract. But my english is not so bad, so if you know someone here or if you can give me a hand, that will be great...!
I don t know if I could find an other job like that, by the time we have now, I feel bad to refuse a job like that. Especially because it s the kind of work I was looking for for a long time... But I don t want to be screwed and have to pay this amount, I am pilot, so pretty poor!
If you want, I could send you by PM my contract. You could have a look to, and tell me what you think...

Thanks
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JBI
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Re: looking for some advice about right at work

Post by JBI »

Hi freemat,

I'm afraid I'm not able to review the specifics of your contract for you as that would be providing legal advice and I'm not able to provide that at the moment (you think the $55 medical fee is bad, I have to pay $300 a year to NOT practice or $3700 a year to practice!). If you PM me I can recommend some practising lawyers in Vancouver who would be able to assist.

The specific terms of the contract notwithstanding, it comes down to whether you're comfortable accepting the conditions of the job as is, or if you'd rather ask and/or demand that changes be made.

The recent decision in BC of Langford v. Carson Air Ltd.http://www.canlii.org/en/bc/bcsc/doc/20 ... c1458.html shows that clauses for reimbursement of training expenses even when the employee was dismissed may be enforceable.

I have signed training bonds before, but I've also asked for minor changes to be made and outlined my concerns with particular clauses. My employer was very reasonable and understood (they also knew that I was a lawyer though :) ) . The company ultimately wants to protect their interests and I don't blame them one bit, but maybe there's a way they can still have their interests protected but with a slightly different contract? Or, maybe they'll just tell you No.

Either way, just remember that the excuse of "I really needed this job so felt I had no choice but to sign" has been unsuccessful in past court cases on training bonds. The pilots still had to pay.
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donnybrook
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Re: looking for some advice about right at work

Post by donnybrook »

Before you sign, make use of forums available to research the company first! There are a few VERY well known companies that routinely abuse their low time pilots. There are also a lot of companies with high(er) standards out there. I have had multiple endorsements and mountain course etc with not even a mention of a bond. I realize things are different in fixed wing but if a company asked me for a bond with the terms you have stated I would turn around and walk out the door. When a company sets one sided terms like that, you know they will ruin the next three years of your life.
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