Schedule and PIC under Supervision

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Newchallenge
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Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#1 Post by Newchallenge » Wed Mar 22, 2017 5:28 pm

Just wondering about scheduling mainly as I look at applying to a few airlines and comparing systems in place.

Is Porter scheduling in pairings for multiple days at a time mainly? How many consecutive nights away from home base per month on average? Regarding the 12 days off a month, are they protected and efforts made to have consecutive days off for someone commuting? When does bidding occur and when is the schedule fixed?

Also, is there a PIC under Supervision program offered? I am short 80 hours of PIC time for an ATPL and am wondering if Porter offers the possibility to add PIC time in the first year of flying under the PIC under Supervision program provided by the CARs.

Thank you and cheers!
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#2 Post by maturepilot83 » Fri Mar 24, 2017 3:51 am

Newchallenge wrote:Just wondering about scheduling mainly as I look at applying to a few airlines and comparing systems in place.

Is Porter scheduling in pairings for multiple days at a time mainly? How many consecutive nights away from home base per month on average? Regarding the 12 days off a month, are they protected and efforts made to have consecutive days off for someone commuting? When does bidding occur and when is the schedule fixed?

Also, is there a PIC under Supervision program offered? I am short 80 hours of PIC time for an ATPL and am wondering if Porter offers the possibility to add PIC time in the first year of flying under the PIC under Supervision program provided by the CARs.

Thank you and cheers!
I'm only a low time CPL, but does this not apply?

https://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/civilaviation/ ... p-1802.htm
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#3 Post by Teeg » Fri Mar 24, 2017 4:17 am

Is Porter scheduling in pairings for multiple days at a time mainly?
->A mix of 1,2,3 and 4 day pairing depending on base. The majority are 2 days. You bid what you want, dependent on seniority.
How many consecutive nights away from home base per month on average?
->depends on how you bid your sked. Senior people doing long drives in the AM/PM can usually get 2- 3day pairing, and 3 -2 day pairings, so that's like... 7 days away from home.
Regarding the 12 days off a month, are they protected and efforts made to have consecutive days off for someone commuting?
->First off, commuting isn't officially allowed. However, you can bid your days on and off... fly 6 days straight, try and get 6 days off. Your Guranteed Days Off cant be touched, and you can try and block them together. It worked well for me.
When does bidding occur and when is the schedule fixed?
-> bid between Day 1 and 7 of the month, find out around the 23rd of the month.
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#4 Post by av8ts » Fri Mar 24, 2017 7:10 am

Commuting isn't allowed? You mean the company tells you where you can and can't live?
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#5 Post by goingnowherefast » Fri Mar 24, 2017 11:50 am

maturepilot83 wrote:I'm only a low time CPL, but does this not apply?

https://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/civilaviation/ ... p-1802.htm
Not in this case. The document you posted applies to copilot time credit towards total time. The OP needs 80 hours PIC for the ATPL, but can't be PIC at Porter without your ATPL. Catch-22. Hence the PICUS question. Welcome to the confusing world of regulations :goodman:
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#6 Post by maturepilot83 » Fri Mar 24, 2017 1:44 pm

goingnowherefast wrote:
maturepilot83 wrote:I'm only a low time CPL, but does this not apply?

https://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/civilaviation/ ... p-1802.htm
Not in this case. The document you posted applies to copilot time credit towards total time. The OP needs 80 hours PIC for the ATPL, but can't be PIC at Porter without your ATPL. Catch-22. Hence the PICUS question. Welcome to the confusing world of regulations :goodman:
Ahh - I see it now!
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#7 Post by Newchallenge » Fri Mar 24, 2017 3:08 pm

Thanks for the scheduling info. Interesting that they don't seem to have a PIC US program to log the allowable PIC hours under the CARs.
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#8 Post by fish4life » Fri Mar 24, 2017 3:51 pm

Maybe because they want people to have experience making decisions before they go left seat on a q400? Why rush into Porter? Go get some experience and multi pic time you won't regret it.
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#9 Post by Grey_Wolf » Fri Mar 24, 2017 7:35 pm

Newchallenge wrote: Also, is there a PIC under Supervision program offered? I am short 80 hours of PIC time for an ATPL and am wondering if Porter offers the possibility to add PIC time in the first year of flying under the PIC under Supervision program provided by the CARs.
Porter does not have a PICUS Program at this time. First officers with approx 3000 TT and 500 MPIC, are still being upgraded with about a year and a half of service with the company.
av8ts wrote:Commuting isn't allowed? You mean the company tells you where you can and can't live?
As for commuting, you can live anywhere you want, the caveat is that when you're called off reserve, you have 2 hours to report. If you can't report, then there a system in place to book off. Booking-off results in loss of pay from your monthly minimums. Booking off too often will cause you to have a chat with management about your future employment with the airline.
Newchallenge wrote:Is Porter scheduling in pairings for multiple days at a time mainly? How many consecutive nights away from home base per month on average? Regarding the 12 days off a month, are they protected and efforts made to have consecutive days off for someone commuting? When does bidding occur and when is the schedule fixed?
As mentioned before, a bidding package with all available pairing become available on the 1st of the month. Bidding stays open till the 7th. Crew Scheduling then has till the 23rd of the month to release the next month's schedule. The pairing vary for single to multi days (4 max). The bidding software (Flica) allows you to put in your preferences. So if you're a commuter, you may want multi-day pairing, and you would bid accordingly. You could also specify start and end times to allow you to catch a flight before/after the pairing. Lastly you could try to lump all your days off together. The likelihood of getting want you want depends on CARs days off regulations (3 in 17 or 36 in 7) as well as your seniority. Most junior staff are on reserve for some time (6 months, maybe less depending on hiring cycle).
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#10 Post by Spirit » Sat Mar 25, 2017 1:27 pm

How much MPIC time is required to get a job at Porter? I see some guys coming off PC-12, so I take none?
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#11 Post by Grey_Wolf » Sat Mar 25, 2017 6:43 pm

From historical data, they have wanted an FO to be Captain ready within a short time. 3000 TT and 500 MPIC was the unofficial bar a few years ago. That said, with the state of the regional industry, Porter is still attracting candidates that meet those requirements. It has on occasion lowered the hiring minimums. It seems the bar is now unofficially around 2000 TT with some MPIC or Captain experience (PC-12, C208, etc...).

Porter has two options for FO's to qualify to become Captains. The first stream is to have 2000 PIC and 500 hours on type (DH8D). The second option is to have 3500 TT with 500 on type, and one of the following options: 750 PIC or 500 MPIC.

So long story short, you can get hired at Porter with 0 MPIC, as long as you meet the above to qualify as a Captain one day.
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#12 Post by Spirit » Sun Mar 26, 2017 10:41 am

Grey_Wolf wrote:From historical data, they have wanted an FO to be Captain ready within a short time. 3000 TT and 500 MPIC was the unofficial bar a few years ago. That said, with the state of the regional industry, Porter is still attracting candidates that meet those requirements. It has on occasion lowered the hiring minimums. It seems the bar is now unofficially around 2000 TT with some MPIC or Captain experience (PC-12, C208, etc...).

Porter has two options for FO's to qualify to become Captains. The first stream is to have 2000 PIC and 500 hours on type (DH8D). The second option is to have 3500 TT with 500 on type, and one of the following options: 750 PIC or 500 MPIC.

So long story short, you can get hired at Porter with 0 MPIC, as long as you meet the above to qualify as a Captain one day.
As always, very informative. Thank you for taking the time to help us out!
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#13 Post by Mr.Blonde » Wed Mar 29, 2017 11:59 am

How long does it take to be based out of YOW, I imagine it would be more of a senior base...?
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#14 Post by Grey_Wolf » Wed Mar 29, 2017 5:15 pm

YOW is a small base, 15 in each position (Capt/FO).

FO can transfer over space pending. Over the last 3 years, there's been movement; the last ones on the list are now in the top 5. I'd venture to guess that 10-16 months is the average.

As for Captains, the only movement is if someone moves on to a better opportunity. Very slow, 1 captain upgrade per year or so. Some wait till their turn comes up; some transfer to YTZ and do the 'commute'. Current wait is 4 years.
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#15 Post by Mr.Blonde » Fri Mar 31, 2017 7:28 am

Grey_Wolf wrote:YOW is a small base, 15 in each position (Capt/FO).

FO can transfer over space pending. Over the last 3 years, there's been movement; the last ones on the list are now in the top 5. I'd venture to guess that 10-16 months is the average.

As for Captains, the only movement is if someone moves on to a better opportunity. Very slow, 1 captain upgrade per year or so. Some wait till their turn comes up; some transfer to YTZ and do the 'commute'. Current wait is 4 years.
awesome thanks for the info !
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#16 Post by PRM1 » Tue Apr 25, 2017 4:11 pm

Grey_Wolf, how does the upgrade work for "Destination Porter" Candidates? If I am successful in the program and I am hired at 1000 hours TT with no MPIC, is there a plan in place to allow these pilots to gain MPIC within the company through a PICUS program in the future, or will a "Destination Porter" pilot be locked to the right seat for the duration of their career with Porter?
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#17 Post by Grey_Wolf » Tue Apr 25, 2017 6:58 pm

Excellent question PRM,

As a candidate, I would try to attend the open house and ask the Pilot Ambassador, that same question.
"What's my career progression at Porter? What qualifications do I need to apply/get hired?"

Although I'm not associated with hiring; I'd venture to say that Porter wouldn't hire candidates with 1000TT, without some sort of PIC time. I would want a candidate to have sound decision-making, interpersonal, and command experience. So, it's safe so say, that you'll still need to fly for a 703/704 operator to get some PIC/MPIC. A year or two is worth it; you'll learn lots!

Once there is a 'shortage/depletion' of qualified candidates (2000 TT/ 500 MPIC), then maybe Porter would entertain the idea of a PICUS program, but that just an opinion.

As a traveling passenger, I would hope that the crew is qualified with the task of taking 70+ people, and a 25 million dollar aircraft, from point A to B in a safe and efficient matter. There would have to be a Risk Assessment to allow crews with the bare minimums.

All the best!
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#18 Post by chipmunk » Wed Apr 26, 2017 10:47 pm

PRM1 wrote:Grey_Wolf, how does the upgrade work for "Destination Porter" Candidates? If I am successful in the program and I am hired at 1000 hours TT with no MPIC, is there a plan in place to allow these pilots to gain MPIC within the company through a PICUS program in the future, or will a "Destination Porter" pilot be locked to the right seat for the duration of their career with Porter?
PRM1, if you were recently accepted into this program, this is a perfect question for Julie, or your mentor. A Destination Porter candidate certainly won't be locked into the right seat forever. :)

Also - don't worry about the M in front of "PIC" - many of our current Captains started at the company with PC12 or C208 single PIC time. We also have several former flight instructors and who came in with a good chunk of "just" single PIC.
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Re: Schedule and PIC under Supervision

#19 Post by YVRDroider » Sat Aug 05, 2017 6:16 pm

No update on schedules, but PICUS is now available at Porter.
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