Westjet Ordering Dreamliners

[wallypilot]

I always figured they would go this route. Nice to see they have committed to it. Those 67's were never a long term viable option.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/westjet ... -1.4095010

[Cessna 180]

Very cool. May see big blue start to compete on long haul international routes with AC. It will be interesting though, since WJ isn't just competing with AC on international routes, they're competing with all the US carriers as well.

[Jimmy2]

So are these going to be the ULCC or is that something different?

[Rowdy]

I'd speculate that they'd operate the 76's at the ULCC. Compete with rouge and Transat pretty effectively!

Always good to see more widebodies being operated in Canada, regardless of what colour is on the tail

[Jean-Pierre]

I don't agree that it is always good. If these are the lowest paid 787 pilot in North America (maybe the world?) which they​ almost certainly will be that is not good for aviation.

[.80@410]

Hopefully we will be ALPA in a week and they won't let that happen.

[altiplano]

How many 737max orders did they defer?

I wonder how they plan to leverage this against the ALPA initiative?

[wallypilot]

I don't agree that it is always good. If these are the lowest paid 787 pilot in North America (maybe the world?) which they​ almost certainly will be that is not good for aviation.

You may or not be right about the last bit...there are a so many budget carriers in SE Asia that truly pay rock bottom, and I think even WJ will not break through that floor. But your sentiment is valid. For sure the pay will be below average.

[JohnnyHotRocks]

It will be like the time that Jazz flew those 757s for poverty wages

[atphat]

Lol. Glass houses

Edit to add : I'm not thrilled about WJ getting 87's. Not because of the added competition, rather the fact that I can already feel my potential earnings being lowered in arbitration due to the fact that WJ pilots will establish a new "industry standard".
Yippee!

[Smitty]

It will be like the time that Jazz flew those 757s for poverty wages

Yes...career contract indeed.

[mbav8r]

It will be like the time that Jazz flew those 757s for poverty wages

Yes...career contract indeed.

^idiots, the pay was industry standard but the 40 or so pilots decided to share that with ALL Jazz pilots instead of 185/hr, it's called status pay. I received a raise in pay just because we had them. Greedy selfish idiots probably can't understand the concept, so I won't waste any more time trying:)
Also, I didn't realize that as an FO making 12 dollars an hour more than an Encore Captain qualified as poverty wages, what does that make Encore Captain's pay, Welfare wages?

[confusedalot]

Getting back to business, I am genuinely curious about what the rank and file think about WestJet departing the original Southwest business model. (after all Southwest shows no desire to change their business model)

Just asking, It's an innocent question.

[JohnnyHotRocks]

It will be like the time that Jazz flew those 757s for poverty wages

Yes...career contract indeed.

^idiots, the pay was industry standard but the 40 or so pilots decided to share that with ALL Jazz pilots instead of 185/hr, it's called status pay. I received a raise in pay just because we had them. Greedy selfish idiots probably can't understand the concept, so I won't waste any more time trying:)
Also, I didn't realize that as an FO making 12 dollars an hour more than an Encore Captain qualified as poverty wages, what does that make Encore Captain's pay, Welfare wages?

Lol, defend it anyway you want but those pilots were making far less than the Skyservice guys they replaced.

[Deadwood]

Getting back to business, I am genuinely curious about what the rank and file think about WestJet departing the original Southwest business model. (after all Southwest shows no desire to change their business model)

The US Market has demand on routes that the Canadian market doesn't seem to have. Southwest has a viable business strategy, that doesn't require widebodies to be successful. Westjet seems to be morphing into a full carrier these days, they can claim they are a low fare airline, but when AC matches prices on almost every route, I think they lose that title. It's back to how it was before, AC and Canadian (now Westjet) fighting a battle over who gets to be a monopoly.

If Westjet gets ALPA, I'll have a hard time figuring out the differences between the airlines aside from tail colour.

[PostmasterGeneral]

Was discussing this with a friend earlier on how WJ might be able to break into the wide body game.

With current fleet projections, by the time WJ takes delivery of their first 787, AC will have about 40 of the aircraft in the air (788 and 789). In addition to about 30 777's. If we count Rouge as well, that's another 24 767's.

How does WJ expect to be competitive with only 10 airframes, when going up against AC who will have close to 100 wide bodies in the air around the time they take delivery of their first one? Will they even put a dent into AC's business? Keep in mind with the increased capacity, AC will likely be able to operate their aircraft for cheaper.

Is WJ aiming to actually compete with AC directly on these routes, or is their business model targeting more Rouge and Transat? How do they plan to compete for business travellers, and do they understand the costs involved in that? Keep in mind if you plan to offer a true business class product, not only do you need seats on the aircraft ("plus" seating is still a joke to anyone who is a legitimate business traveller) but you also need lounges at every airport you plan to serve, concierge service, etc. Have these costs been taken into account?

Where will WJ be getting slots at any of these major airports that business travellers will be using?

[av8ts]

Yes...career contract indeed.

^idiots, the pay was industry standard but the 40 or so pilots decided to share that with ALL Jazz pilots instead of 185/hr, it's called status pay. I received a raise in pay just because we had them. Greedy selfish idiots probably can't understand the concept, so I won't waste any more time trying:)
Also, I didn't realize that as an FO making 12 dollars an hour more than an Encore Captain qualified as poverty wages, what does that make Encore Captain's pay, Welfare wages?

Lol, defend it anyway you want but those pilots were making far less than the Skyservice guys they replaced.

Yes they absolutely were making less. However they were not undercutting or contributing in the race to the bottom. The company was paying out the same wages as Skyservice was, it was just being shared among all the pilots