MIFR in Calgary: Springbank Air Training College... Thanks!

4hrstovegas · Post by **4hrstovegas** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 10:21 pm

Just renewed my MIFR at Springbank, Alberta with Springbank Air Training College (CYBW). Just want to thank my Instructor (and CFI), Greg, and all the guys at SATC for an extremely professional experience. They had the patience of saints, and were accommodating in every way to help get me done on schedule.

If anybody is looking for an MIFR or MIFR renewal, check these guys out. You won't find a better place to learn. The GA-7 Cougar is easy to fly, the airport has everything you need for a rounded learning environment, and the Instructors come with a wealth of experience to get even the rustiest pilot up to par (trust me!).

Cheers SATC!
-H

duplicate2 · Post by **duplicate2** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 2:12 am

Nice to hear something positive about an aviation company for a change.

If you don't mind me asking:
-what was your experience/background/rustiness before the renewal?
-how long did it take calendar/flight hours?
-how much money was it?
-did you fly with the CFI?
-who was the examiner, how was the flight test?
-how is the GA-7 instrumented?

Thanks,
duplicate2

wannabatp · Post by **wannabatp** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 7:46 am

duplicate2 wrote:Nice to hear something positive about an aviation company for a change.

If you don't mind me asking:
-what was your experience/background/rustiness before the renewal?
-how long did it take calendar/flight hours?
-how much money was it?
-did you fly with the CFI?
-who was the examiner, how was the flight test?
-how is the GA-7 instrumented?

Thanks,
duplicate2

I'd also be interested.

Cheers!

ditto (get it?)

aero220 · Post by **aero220** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 9:54 am

They are great for doing private and commercial licences with as well. Check them out if you are looking for a place to do all of your training from private to commercial multi-IFR.

4hrstovegas · Post by **4hrstovegas** » Thu Oct 27, 2005 1:21 am

Rustiness/experience: My initial IFR training was 3 years ago and fairly... well... patchy. I'm not afraid to say that my initial ground training was not great, and I flew in a fairly quiet environment. This recent training was eye-opening, but in a very good way. Everything was presented in a more realistic fashion; I found that they tried to get you ready to actually use this stuff. The instructor knew I was preparing for an FO slot with my company in the North, and made our examples and explanations focus on that goal.

Cost: is about $300/hr dual twin time, about $100/hr for the sim. My instructor (yes, he is the CFI) was very honest in telling me when he felt I needed more flight time or sim time, but was just as honest in telling me when he felt I really didn't need to spend more money. He actually suggested I drop a couple bookings along the way to save money. He has lots of time, and is not in it for the hours. I hadn't been in an airplane in about 6 months, so I chose to take a bit more time getting back to basics. I was there for 1 week everyday, though it could have been shorter. Again, my choice.

The Cougar was equipped with everything you'd expect, but no GPS (they're working on it, but I'm glad to have had less distraction). All the equipment worked properly, and we had nothing go wrong at any point. The aircraft seem to be well maintained, and the superstars working the desk/ramp always had her fuelled and ready to go on time.

They work with 2 DFTE's for the most part, and know them well. I was well prepared for the flight test in a very thorough ground briefing by my instructor, who took the time the day before my flight test to fine tune my ground stuff. The examiner himself was very fair, and made it clear at the beginning of the test that his job was to give out ratings, not to fail people. He wasn't a pushover, but asked for nothing out of the ordinary. He also offered several great pointers through the flight test that I will take into my career. The guy has over 25,000 hours and experience flying just about everything, everywhere.

Wannabe: how are you?? Where are you? Brother, I hear ya! This is the place you want to go. You'll get what we missed the first time and then some.

duplicate2 · Post by **duplicate2** » Thu Oct 27, 2005 7:03 pm

4hrstovegas, thanks a lot for the info.

As for equipment, I'm not super interested in a GPS so no problem there, but I am more keen on an HSI and RMI. Any chance they have that?

duplicate2

scm · Post by **scm** » Thu Oct 27, 2005 7:21 pm

is there accommodation close by? i'm looking for somewhere to finish up my commercial (~10 hrs at the most) and do a multi/ifr.

4hrstovegas · Post by **4hrstovegas** » Thu Oct 27, 2005 11:45 pm

Duplicate: yeah, the Cougar is equipped with both an RMI and HSI. Also has a separate ADF (can't remember if it had a rotating or fixed card), VOR, and DME. Slaved HI's, and 2 altimeters. Basically, 2 of everything in there, all nicely placed for the left seat.

Regarding accommodations; Springbank is only a few minutes west of Calgary, and just a few minutes from Cochrane. Not sure exactly what is right near the airport, as I had a place to stay in Calgary. Make sure your instructor shows you where the Vietnamese restaurant in Cochrane is located, though!

If anybody wants info from them directly, you can reach them at 288-7700. Ask for Greg. Feel free, though, to fire me any questions you have if you want the opinion of a recent student.

A. Thompson · Post by **A. Thompson** » Sun Oct 30, 2005 3:41 pm

There is a Bed and Breakfast right on the airport grounds

Can't remember the name, I think it is called "The Tie Down", ask around, I know the airport manager's office would have the number.

LV2FLY · Post by **LV2FLY** » Tue Nov 22, 2005 6:06 pm

I have heard many distastefulll stories from Springbank air Training College. I use to fly out of CYBW at times and it seemed like every "near miss" or aircraft having difficulty was from the training college. If you are looking for a carrer in aviation.....i wouldnt touch them.....go to someplace like Mount Royal or the Calgary flying club with better airplanes and a more professonal staff not to mentiion the networking oppurtunities.

shamrock104 · Post by **shamrock104** » Tue Nov 22, 2005 6:19 pm

I have trained with a few different operators out of YBW and find them pretty much the same. Didnt like the atmosphere at the flying club, Fly Right was fine as long as you could take the dragon lady and the Air Training College was fairly average although the staff were great in most respects. The best school I have trained with in Canada happened to be Harvs Air out in Manitoba.

aero220 · Post by **aero220** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 5:51 pm

I have not heard of many bad stories about Springbank Air and thought the training and rentals were a great value. Their aircraft may not have the best interiors but for the price they are great. The engines all produce an acceptable RPM (cant be said about all mount royal aircraft) and as far a "near misses", They have never lost a plane like the Flying club who is one of the only schools still in springbank to loose a plane, and believe me, they have the just as many "near misses" on top of that.

LV2FLY · Post by **LV2FLY** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 10:43 pm

Hmmm.... Seems to me they pretty much wrote one off last week. GCCP ring a bell???????? Thought so. Flying club has been in buisness over 75 years and mount royal over 35 years. Both had thier accidents. Air training college....a fraction of that. Dont like any one school better than the other........just definantley would never get in a Springank Air Trainng College airplane.

Anyone who wants to start flying at Springbank. Go visit each place before you fly and ask around. Flight training is alot of money to spend and make sure you are getting what you want out of it.

P.S. Had to overshoot 4 times in one week due to Air Training College planes.

Keep the blue side up

D5GRVTY · Post by **D5GRVTY** » Thu Nov 24, 2005 11:50 am

Hmm I'd like to address some of the things LV2FLY has been saying:

just definitely would never get in a Springbank Air Training College airplane.

Despite the fact that one or two of our a/c could use a new coat of paint and a newer interior, they are mechanically sound. Our customers would rather fly a dull but safe plane rather than a pricey plane. In fact their isn’t a single school in YBW that I would call "scary" from a maintenance or flight training prepective. Even the example of CFC losing a plane was a poor one. That incident was a rental for which the club had little control over what decisions the renter made.

The rumor mill isn’t what I would base any decisions on. The outlandish stories I've heard about virtually every company would convince almost anyone to drive rather than ever fly.

LV2FLY had one excellent point, everyone considering any flight training should check out any prospective schools. You are a customer and make sure that any prospective flight school is treating you as such.

Remember how this thread started, a satisfied customer had nothing but good things to say about SATC

MRO · Post by **MRO** » Thu Nov 24, 2005 1:11 pm

Yes I must agree with D5GRVTY, I have flown a number of aircraft from the college and they could use paint and whatever. But there are a lot of planes that could. Everything I flew was mechanically sound, no problems. The owner is a great guy who does not cut corners and does not dispatch dangerous planes.

Check out your school before you sign up. If you check out the college you will not be scared to get in an airplane.

FLYaJET · Post by **FLYaJET** » Fri Nov 25, 2005 9:28 am

Bottom line is, anyone can say anything about any flight school/college on these things.

Go out to Springbank and visit every flight school and talk to some instructors. That is the only way you are going to know.

If you want a career in aviation, which you probably do if you are getting your Multi/IFR. I would go to Mt. Royal. Yes a bit more expensive. ( I hate schools that bragg about how cheap thier training is compared to others, you get what you pay for) Mt. Royal only have Class 2 and Class 1 instructors with years of experience. Also the networking i hear is great. I know people flying for Kenn Borek, Air Canada, Central Mountain Air, North Cariboo, Japan Airlines.......the list goes on.

swede · Post by **swede** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 7:09 pm

re your mifr (marginal that is), you kiddies want to continue wasting your lives, keep on with the pipe dreams about aviation. Yes, you can work for KB air in some third world shit hole, yes you can smarm your way to a possible "airline" job watching a machine work where all the old timers hate the crap out of their job and croak very shortly after retirement from UV exposure along with low 0xygen sat levels. This aint sour grapes talkin kiddies, this is bitter reality...THERES NO LIFE LIKE IT!!

4hrstovegas · Post by **4hrstovegas** » Fri Dec 02, 2005 9:18 am

Ummmm.... yeah. "This ain't sour grapes"? Sorry, but anybody who'd search through a Flight Training forum to tell all the "kiddies" out there about his own disillusionment is kinda sad. This thread is about a great experience at an excellent flight school, not about, "why I hate my life as a pilot." But thank you for replying to my post.

ANYWAY... I had a great experience at SATC. As a former instructor myself (I was once part of one of the largest flight schools in the country), I was very impressed with the operation and people at SATC. Every airline/flight school/operation (large and small) will have a history of good and not-so-positive experiences. Pay heed to the more recent of the reports, though, so that you get the most current idea of what's going on. But by all means, do the research. In the end, though, I gotta give these guys a huge thumbs up.

EyeOh · Post by **EyeOh** » Fri Dec 02, 2005 2:33 pm

Wow. I can't believe that people still think that the school you go to determines where you will end up. The ONLY thing that matters are the relationships you form where you are. You think KB, CMA or even AC looks at your resume and goes " WOOWWEEE mount royal. Man we better call this guy. Never seen that before. He MUST be good........maybe he'll date me."
I hear so many people that are so cocky because of who you gave 30,000-55,000(MRC) to and I’m sick of it.
I flew out of CYBW for a number of years and it's all the same shit different pile. I have seen every one of the three bigger schools do stupid shit, cause guess what YOUR LEARNING. And who ever said the accidents are proportional to age is bang on. Lets review a little CYBW history, CFC CYPO crash, MRC midair, CFT (now gone) Engine failure, now the younger SATC gets it's first golden bee bee. And you know what, as long as all three is in business, unfortunately it's not the last for any of the above.
So for those who come out of our little training Mecca, remember your shit still stinks wherever you go. Just make friends with other people who have stinky shit and work hard for yourselves and each other.

girlpilot · Post by **girlpilot** » Fri Dec 02, 2005 8:25 pm

EyeOh, keep in mind YPO .... renter, an organization with 75+ years and I'm guessing, when they were really involved with EFTS, lots of mishaps, yeah, your right, training and trainers and .... you are always a student in an aircraft. Anytime you think you know it all .... it will bite you in the butt.

happy_flyer · Post by **happy_flyer** » Sun Dec 04, 2005 10:47 pm

I have to agree with eyeoh..every school has it's s**t coming to it. It's ineveitable cos humans screw up and if you rent to a human it's gonna happen. Personally, I LURRRRVE SATC for their professionalism, their machines and attitude towards students, renters and the real world alike. I have been a customer of theirs in many capacities and never been let down.

And...I have to agree..the school means jack s**t really..ultimately, those who have an in will get ahead. So you better make that connection somewhere. Make friends cos you will need them !!

happy_flyer · Post by **happy_flyer** » Sun Dec 04, 2005 11:01 pm

I think I should qualify my last statement by saying that I instructed for 2-3 years and made many friends. I quit at that level for financial and family reasons but have had two offers in the last 12 months for serious turbine time ( F/O KA200+ ) from people I worked with who have since moved on. ( I have been out of the game for 2 years ). Network network network..and make friends, not enemies. Honestly, really, when will you guys get it ?

fl390 · Post by **fl390** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 7:05 pm

I just want to say that SATC is the school I would go straight back to if i were going to do my flight training again.I did my mifr there last year and now I fly a twin for a company here in BC.I would get into any of there airplanes in a instant and everyday I recommend guys to go train with SATC.So if anyone is wondering were to do there flight training,head down to YBW and talk to Greg you wont be disapointed.You get alot more than what you pay for at SATC,you cant say that about any other school in Calgary.If you are worried about networking that is the best place to start.I have seen many ppl around there that can help you out.I have seen CMA pilots there as well as North cariboo pilots.So head down and begin your dream of flying its your best bet.